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AA77 FDR Data, Explained

pilots are not more qualified to talk about FDR specs than FDR Experts. That is why we called several FDR manufacturers and have several "FDR Experts" now on our team. Some anonymous (due to anonymous internet persona with an agenda of character assassination, discussed earlier in this thread, some not). However, "pilots" learn from FDR data every recurrent training to save lives (what not to do).

With that said.. pal... who are you? We will certainly entertain anything you hve to offer as far as debate on a recorded line considering we actually called FDR companies and have FDR Experts working on our team. Do you think "pilots" can learn FDR data interpretation? Or are we just dumb monkeys.
 
hxstamper said:
pilots are not more qualified to talk about FDR specs than FDR Experts. That is why we called several FDR manufacturers and have several "FDR Experts" now on our team. Some anonymous (due to anonymous internet persona with an agenda of character assassination, discussed earlier in this thread, some not). However, "pilots" learn from FDR data every recurrent training to save lives (what not to do).
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Is that a no then? Pilots are not more qualified than electrical and electronic aorcraft technicians with exeprience of FDR and Pitot/Static instruments?

What about flight attendants? are they more qualified? Why does the page you link to have so many lies by the editor on one page?

HX said:
With that said.. pal... who are you? We will certainly entertain anything you hve to offer as far as debate on a recorded line considering we actually called FDR companies and have FDR Experts working on our team. Do you think "pilots" can learn FDR data interpretation? Or are we just dumb monkeys.
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Who are your FDR experts? If they remain anonyomous then you are hypocritical to call anyone here out for the same thing are you not?

I am ex RAF fastjet technician who worked on FDR systems 1st and 2nd line. I also worked on pitot static flight instruments. I saw one of your guys called L3 and one of your guys posted info from L3 but he did not understand what they told him. I pointed this out and was ignored. Anti sophist pointed it out and was ignored. I have seen the pathetic MO of Balsamo, he is a mental case. I would never give any of my details to anyone one of his crew and I would never give permission to be recorded, although it seems most of the time your lot do not ask for this anyway. If you want to see why I remain anonymous see my sig about Mr Lovetro.
 
We contact the NTSB, FBI and L3 with our names, faces and professional reputations on the line.

The "Experts" at JREF (i count maybe 1 left? "Anti-Sophist" was exposed, "Reheat", well, just look at his posts, i think only "beachnut" is left) make excuse, contradict each other, refuse to debate, avoid questions, offer theory that the NTSB is wrong, L3 is wrong, refuse to call all of the above, and remain anonymous.

Who exactly are the "critical thinkers" here?

as i said funk, anytime you are ready to discuss the fact... feel free to contact us for debate... you'll be the first out of all the "experts" here.

As for Balsamo being a "mental case", yeah... attacking the person instead of the argument is the norm it seems here on JREF...

But, Balsamo has grown this in a short period of time...

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core

And there are many more behind the scenes.

Perhaps that is why you "experts" refuse to "debate" a "mental case", except of course fom behind your screen. Balsamo must have manipulated all those other professionals. Wonder why the list grows?
 
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Turbofan must be correct; they are so rabid about it.

Therefore I look forward to when Turbofan and other Pfffffters gather their experts and present a legal challenge to expose the criminal in the government, in all the organisations they claim were complicit.

So far all I see them is them gathering in a circle and stroking each others egos.

Rob must have raised a pretty penny what with the booming sales of all the truth material. After all, his Loose Change buddys have made a packet from their movies, right? The Twoofers have all sorts of supporters who have lots of money. Hell, even if the masses of supporters donate a dollar or so each, they'll have more than enough to hire independent experts to present their conclusive findings in a court of law, where the criminals can be brought to justice.

Or are they just siphoning off the money to feed their own desires?

Action, not bleating.
 
hxstamper said:
But, Balsamo has grown this in a short period of time...

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core

And there are many more behind the scenes.

Perhaps that is why you "experts" refuse to "debate" a "mental case", except of course fom behind your screen. Balsamo must have manipulated all those other professionals. Wonder why the list grows?
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Wow, it is staggering! How many pilots, sharp pilot flock to pure fantasy and made up ideas! Staggering!
The list grow? Could be decline in education values, you guys clearly forgot to use cause and effect, and lack knowledge on many issues related to the event you lack so much evidence and knowledge on. I mean, take the 11.2 G fiasco! That alone would be a deal closer for most members if they understood physics and math. Yes, I would have to say lack of education and pure ignorance are the reason the list is growing so exponentially!

Soon you may have 0.01 percent of all pilots on earth signed up to prove, there are a few people who believe just about anything! Good job. What will all of us in on the big cover-up do? Right, Balsamo said he would kill us
“… deserves to die a traitors [sic] death for trying to suppress 9/11 families from seeking the Truth.”–"Pilots for Truth" founder, and ex-commercial pilot, Robert Balsamo

...And a few months later:


"… does deserve to die a traitors death....

I will not apologize for it this time. I will be there for his death should America fall into Civil War. That is not a threat. .that is a promise.
If he gets in my way of defending our Constitution.. it will be my pleasure to put a bullet in his head to defend our Constitution from enemies foreign or domestic." –"Pilots for Truth" founder Robert Balsamo
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. Great! When will you guys takeover?

I would not keep posting the list of pilots who are unable to make rational decisions on 9/11, it may be bad for hiring if a Major see you jump to false ideas and fake information and ignore real evidence. Just an observation! The list is a good sign, there are not a lot of people who suspend reality and jump to false conclusions! Wait, p4t make no conclusions, they have NO THEORY! Darn, why not?
 
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Beachy... our pilots actually flew F-15's in Desert Storm and Fighters in Vietnam. They actually put their name to it and can be verified.. .you?
 
hxstamper said:
We contact the NTSB, FBI and L3 with our names, faces and professional reputations on the line.

The "Experts" at JREF (i count maybe 1 left? "Anti-Sophist" was exposed, "Reheat", well, just look at his posts, i think only "beachnut" is left) make excuse, contradict each other, refuse to debate, avoid questions, offer theory that the NTSB is wrong, L3 is wrong, refuse to call all of the above, and remain anonymous.

Who exactly are the "critical thinkers" here?

as i said funk, anytime you are ready to discuss the fact... feel free to contact us for debate... you'll be the first out of all the "experts" here.

As for Balsamo being a "mental case", yeah... attacking the person instead of the argument is the norm it seems here on JREF...

But, Balsamo has grown this in a short period of time...

http://pilotsfor911truth.org/core

And there are many more behind the scenes.

Perhaps that is why you "experts" refuse to "debate" a "mental case", except of course fom behind your screen. Balsamo must have manipulated all those other professionals. Wonder why the list grows?
Click to expand...

Pathetic post and a retreat from any questions I asked. I have heard Balsamo threaten someone. I am accused of being a traitor and a shill even thogh I am not amercian and hate the Bush administration. My analysis is ignored as inconvenient. I see truthers threaten people and harrass them.

You have it all apparently yet you want to debate instead of taking your claims and evidence to the authorities. Oh you big brave boys

Who are your FDR experts? Dont say Balsamo cause he is not. I am more of an expert than anyone you have named so far.

You are all full of wind and pish as we say round my way. Why are there so many lies on the page you linked to? Why does a page that is named "pilots" have flight attendants on it? Is she more qualified than me to discuss FDR and flight instruments?
 
hxstamper said:
Beachy... our pilots actually flew F-15's in Desert Storm and Fighters in Vietnam. They actually put their name to it and can be verified.. .you?
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I thought you knew who beachnut was?

I serviced FDR and flight instruments on F3 during Desert Shield/Storm and the Balkans conflict. I am more qualified to comment than your pilots and flight attendants apparently.

Give me a name of anyone on your lists with more experience than me in servicing FDR and flight instruments?

See my sig and Robs threats, you will never get my name. If you cannot see why then you are deluded.
 
hxstamper said:
Beachy... our pilots actually flew F-15's in Desert Storm and Fighters in Vietnam. They actually put their name to it and can be verified.. .you?
Click to expand...

Looks like flying F-15 in combat did not prepare them for fraud! But since the number of F-15 pilots who think you guys have nut case ideas outnumber you entire pilot numbers, I feel safe most F-15 pilots are able to make rational decisions on 9/11, unlike all the pilots in p4t. None of the pilots I personally know support your failed ideas! And those alone out numbers your pilots in your core, and they have more credentials then everyone but your alien man!

Darn, I missed Vietnam by just a few months, but I was on the hook in 1971 to be in the USAF! They let me finish my engineering degree, and then let me attend UPT. Guess you are just a civilian pilot and lack some of that USAF stink that has no bearing on your or my ability to understand 9/11. What great planes have you flown that also have no bearing on your lack of knowledge and failure to make correct conclusion on 9/11?

I actually flew in Desert Storm and made it possible for the fighters to complete their mission! I refueled planes that could not complete their mission without my refueling. I had more pilots under my direction in Desert Storm/Shield and not one of them supports your ideas on 9/11! They also outnumber your core group. I was chief instructor for over 200 crewmembers, and not one of them supports your ideas on 9/11. This includes over 100 pilots (we outnumber your p4t pilots!). I have yet to find, out of the hundreds of pilots I have worked directly with, anyone who supports your failure of a group. Your group with 0.0001 percent of all world pilots is such a big flop, you have clearly won the, "I live in a fantasy world and do not even know it Award".

Putting your names to failed ideas and groups, does not mean much! Since you know my name and use it without hesitation, I think your failed ideas are clearly exposed on all fronts!

Still, they, you, rob, and p4t, have zero theories? No evidence. Great stuff. You can not make this stuff up!

Growth of p4t core member pilots. 30 pilots in April 2007, now they have 55 pilots! Wowzer, they sure are growing.

Are 55 pilots enough to carry out Balsamo's threats?
“… deserves to die a traitors [sic] death for trying to suppress 9/11 families from seeking the Truth.”–"Pilots for Truth" founder, and ex-commercial pilot, Robert Balsamo

...And a few months later:


"… does deserve to die a traitors death....

I will not apologize for it this time. I will be there for his death should America fall into Civil War. That is not a threat. .that is a promise.
If he gets in my way of defending our Constitution.. it will be my pleasure to put a bullet in his head to defend our Constitution from enemies foreign or domestic." –"Pilots for Truth" founder Robert Balsamo
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No! The funny thing about the explosive growth of p4t, is trying to figure out when accessions will stabilize the living population of p4t pilot members in the future. How many years will it take to stabilize, and do cult groups based on false CT ideas maintain the rapid growth shown by p4t. Going from 30 to 55 pilots is a feat for most groups who base their ideas on false information. I think you can still find some more suckers if you dig deep enough. So far you have failed to fool one pilot I worked with, flew with, refueled, or taught. Good job!
 
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hx:

SO since you have been here, you have provided ZERO evidence, you have whined about character assassination (providing publicly available information together in a more condensed form), whined about people wanting to remain anonymous (so the nuts, like those at PFT, DU, LCF, etc, can't start harrassing us or our families), and complained about moderator bias (despite the fact that they have let this non-debate, tit for tat argument over nothing continue for several pages).

Are you about done, or is their more (Oh joy oh bliss)?

TAM (your truther character assassinator)
 
Curious how this Pentagon stuff has suddenly popped up. I have no idea why, and speculation in this kind of question is pretty pointless. Do Hxstamper, Turbofan et al. think they'll see [ETA: sell] more DVD's? Or that they have a chance of convincing anyone who is not already one of their own?

I actually think that the most telling argument against them is that the pilots' unions do not support them. It is absolutely unimaginable that the unions would not be involved if there were the slightest real-world hint of "inside job."

They also appear unable to create a positive narrative; that is, what they believe actually happened. Without at least a sketchy narrative -- heck, by this time, a fairly complete narrative should be available -- they have contributed nothing, nada, nichego, nic, nichts, zilch.

I suppose I will now be abused by them. Go ahead. My only connection to flying is 1/ as a passenger, 2/ my father had some sort of small plane pilot's license in the 1940s. In later years he'd toy with the idea of taking it up again but never did. As for understanding FDR's, when the conversations started I thought they were upset about something Roosevelt did.
 
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hxstamper said:
pilots are not more qualified to talk about FDR specs than FDR Experts. That is why we called several FDR manufacturers and have several "FDR Experts" now on our team. Some anonymous (due to anonymous internet persona with an agenda of character assassination, discussed earlier in this thread, some not). However, "pilots" learn from FDR data every recurrent training to save lives (what not to do).

With that said.. pal... who are you? We will certainly entertain anything you hve to offer as far as debate on a recorded line considering we actually called FDR companies and have FDR Experts working on our team. Do you think "pilots" can learn FDR data interpretation? Or are we just dumb monkeys.
Click to expand...


So if you are really interested in the truth why don't you guys hire a few people who actually analyze FDR data for a living to go over your claims.


Some anonymous (due to anonymous internet persona with an agenda of character assassination, discussed earlier in this thread, some not).
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So you claim to have real experts who have verified that the FDR points to a coverup but they are afraid to come forward. Why don't they write a cogent , technical paper and present it to some publications.

Instead you pine for a worthless debate that will do little or nothing to help bring the truth to the public. The results on the debate are entirely predictable. The people at PF"truth" will claim they have proved their points.
The average person will read or listen to them and not having the expertise will leave it non the wiser.

Step up and start actually trying to bring the truth out even if it disagrees with your fantasy world.
 
Incredible!

These guys are basing their hopes on a whim that the FDR wasn't working 100%! LMAO

I keep seeing, can you prove the FDR was working properly?

YES!

You see, if the data was stored incorrectly, the parity and error bits contained
in the data string would show errors.

This didn't happen!

You see, the FDR is certified, and designed to work correctly. There are
parity and errors bits used to verify the integrity of data.

To spread a theory that the FDR might not have worked 100% is just
reaching! LMAO

Beachnut, you are wrong about the altitude, and now you are wrong about
the data storage. Too bad they didn't teach you about parity and checksums
in flight school! haha.

I
Edited by Darat: 
Breach of Rule 10 removed.
dare you to go live with me, or anyone else at PFT. We will bury
your false claims and dreams instantly.

Wake up world, Beachnut is waving his hands and sinking. Help him out!
 
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Turbofan said: "to go live with me".

I asked my wife. She said she expected me to continue to live at home. Sorry. But listen, if you ever in town...
 
Am I wrong to assume that the the pilots' union would be all over this if there were any possibility?
 
Turbofan said:
Regarding your questions. I felt that I have answered them fully, while
providing links, diagrams, photos, etc.
Click to expand...

My questions to you remain unanswered. You need to post the statements of the 1,000+ eyewitnesses I requested. You know what I'm talking about.
 
Turbofan said:
Incredible!


I
Edited by Darat: 
Breach of Rule 10 removed.
dare you to go live with me, or anyone else at PFT. We will bury
your false claims and dreams instantly.

Wake up world, Beachnut is waving his hands and sinking. Help him out!
Click to expand...

What would that accomplish for the "truth". this is more like a personal vendetta against a few members of JREF than an attempt to awaken the world to the "truth".

I have no doubt if he went there and "debated' on PFT you would be claiming victory and so would Beachnut. Exactly the same as here.What would that accomplish. Send your findings in a clear , cogent and consise paper to the companies that manufacture and understand the FDR's. See what they say if they even think it is worthy of their time. At least you would be heading towards the truth. That would carry a lot more weight than a recorded conversation with a salesman from one of the companies (I think you send it was recorded).
 
Deal Breaker

Turbofan said:
BJE, feel free to sign up at PFT.

Just as I have been warned here about JREF forum rules, we will respect PFT forum rules during our discussion.
Click to expand...

That's a deal breaker, Turbofan, to wit:

"- Skeptics, who follow the official story are asked to keep their discussions in the Debate section, we do not accept the official conspiracy theory as evidence in other areas of the forum."
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As Balsamo knows, this statement is designed to prevent meaningful discussion and protect PFT from having to deal with evidence.

The terms "Official Story" and "official conspiracy theory" have meant anything Balsamo wants it to mean including, and especially, any evidence Balsamo does not want discussed. This the fundamental reason most of us have been banned. We will discuss the evidence and all sources of the evidence. Anything or anyone preventing that discussion, as Balsamo has consistently done in the past, renders participating on the PFT forum meaningless.

In order for there to be discussion of what happened at the Pentagon on 9/11 on the PFT forum, ALL evidence at the Pentagon must be allowed to be discussed and it must be allowed in the AA77 subforum.

Unless and until Balsamo changes his forum rules to treat every member equally, without institutionalized discrimination against some members and evidence, there is no deal with me.
 
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