Obama says child rapists should be executed

JEROME DA GNOME said:
That was the point. He is a typical political BS artist.
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Only if he has stated he is against the death penalty and for the death penalty for child rapist/murderers.

AFAIK he has stated he is pro-death penalty for some heinous crimes (which would tend to contradict the statement that he is the most liberal member of congress.)

Has he made contradictory statements on this issue? Has he flip-flopped?

If not, your statement that he is "a typical political BS artist" fails.
 
gdnp said:
Only if he has stated he is against the death penalty and for the death penalty for child rapist/murderers.

AFAIK he has stated he is pro-death penalty for some heinous crimes (which would tend to contradict the statement that he is the most liberal member of congress.)

Has he made contradictory statements on this issue? Has he flip-flopped?

If not, your statement that he is "a typical political BS artist" fails.
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I am completely against the death penalty yet I am commonly called a "right-winger" for most of my ideas on this board.

Does that mean I am a Liberal?


Back to the point. He is; like most politicians, giving a yes answer to both sides of the question.
 
JEROME DA GNOME said:
This particular case had to due with under 12 years of age.
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When then becomes the magic year...the magic day of that year, even?

I think the Bible or other religious texts have it about right when they say 'an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth". Rapers should maybe have things cut off...but not killed...with that rule in mind.
 
gdnp said:
I tend to agree. Child rape is a sickness, which justifies locking up child rapists after they complete their sentences until they are cured. I doubt many child rapists would be deterred. They would, however, be more likely to resist arrest.
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I see you also attended the Dukakis school of penology. A sex crime multiple offender "cured?" Libs are truly staggering in their capacity to always give the offenders the benefit of the doubt at the expense of the rest of society.
 
Cicero said:
I see you also attended the Dukakis school of penology. A sex crime multiple offender "cured?" Libs are truly staggering in their capacity to always give the offenders the benefit of the doubt at the expense of the rest of society.
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Except that if you read what gdnp actually posted, the conclusion he draws is that they should remain locked up even after completing their sentences. If, as you seem to be suggesting, the cure of such people is rare, that will amount in most cases to a life sentence.

Comprehension isn't your strong suit, is it? I wonder what is.
 
Obama did specifically mention a "small child, 6 or 8 years old". Right or wrong, people tend to feel a little stronger about crimes against small children. Especially parents of little ones. By saying it that way my guess is that he is just trying to pull the heart strings of parents in general. If he can pick up a couple redneck "kill 'em all and let god sort it out" type folks then even better.

I have heard it said that these people can't be rehabilitated. I would be curious to see the stats. What percentage of them re-offend? If it is a truly high percentage then the question of capitol punishment is a no brainer.
 
MrPuck said:
Obama did specifically mention a "small child, 6 or 8 years old". Right or wrong, people tend to feel a little stronger about crimes against small children. Especially parents of little ones. By saying it that way my guess is that he is just trying to pull the heart strings of parents in general. If he can pick up a couple redneck "kill 'em all and let god sort it out" type folks then even better.

I have heard it said that these people can't be rehabilitated. I would be curious to see the stats. What percentage of them re-offend? If it is a truly high percentage then the question of capitol punishment is a no brainer.
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I don't have a cite handy, but its an amazingly high percentage. I think limited only by those who are too ill to re-offend when they leave jail and those who somehow manage to not get caught again.
 
MrPuck said:
I have heard it said that these people can't be rehabilitated. I would be curious to see the stats. What percentage of them re-offend? If it is a truly high percentage then the question of capitol punishment is a no brainer.
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Really? Considering the "success" of capital punishment in the US, I'd say that even if 100% re-offend it's still an unproductive (costly, lousy deterrant to crimes based on extreme emotions/mental illness, unevenly applied, etc.) way to address the problem.

Of course, since you're only asking for a "truly high percentage," I wonder how you'd justify killing the truly tiny percentage who might have been rehabilitated.
 
Dr Adequate said:
Except that if you read what gdnp actually posted, the conclusion he draws is that they should remain locked up even after completing their sentences. If, as you seem to be suggesting, the cure of such people is rare, that will amount in most cases to a life sentence.

Comprehension isn't your strong suit, is it? I wonder what is.
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Since I posted gdnp's quote verbatim, since his point was unambiguous, where is this subtext "conclusion" you say he drew in the quote?
I do not have the liberal decoder ring.

"Cured" means that a psychiatrist is allowed to decide when to release a sex offender, which means that there was no life sentence without the possibility of parole, so there is no such thing as a life sentence in their case. Penology is not your strong suit, is it? Since your misinformed opinions on this subject effect the rest of society, figuring out what is your strong suit is superfluous.
 
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I agree with Darrow on this point.

If you impose the death penalty for rape (regardless of the victim's age) then the rapist has no incentive not to murder the victim and remove the witness.

That's assuming that the death penalty actually acts as a deterrent. And if it does not, then I see no benefit in that case, either.

I don't see any benefit to anyone if we allow death penalty for child rape, but I do see potential harm.
 
Cicero said:
Since I posted gdnp's quote verbatim, since his point was unambiguous, where is this subtext "conclusion" you say he drew in the quote?
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Highlighted below.

gdnp said:
I tend to agree. Child rape is a sickness, which justifies locking up child rapists after they complete their sentences until they are cured. I doubt many child rapists would be deterred. They would, however, be more likely to resist arrest.
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Duh.

Cicero said:
I do not have the liberal decoder ring.
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You wrong your fellow-conservatives. Comprehension of basic English is not limited to liberals.

"Cured" means that a psychiatrist is allowed to decide when to release a sex offender, which means that there was no life sentence without the possibility of parole, so there is no such thing as a life sentence in their case.
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However, since they hardly ever are cured, it would, as I said, "amount in most cases to a life sentence".

Penology is not your strong suit, is it? Since your misinformed opinions on this subject effect the rest of society, figuring out what is your strong suit is superfluous.
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If you have a point, perhaps you would tell us all what it is?
 
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Babbylonian said:
Really? Considering the "success" of capital punishment in the US, I'd say that even if 100% re-offend it's still an unproductive (costly, lousy deterrant to crimes based on extreme emotions/mental illness, unevenly applied, etc.) way to address the problem.
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When was capital punishment last used as it was intended? Convicted felons spending 20 years on death row before execution, if ever, is not capital punishment.

The death penalty is cheap. It is the endless appeals that are costly.

Doctors refusing to administer lethal injections on the grounds of cruel and unusual punishment is absurd.
 
Dr Adequate said:
Highlighted below.

Duh.

You wrong your fellow-conservatives. Comprehension of basic English is not limited to liberals.

However, since they hardly ever are cured, it would, as I said, "amount in most cases to a life sentence".

If you have a point, perhaps you would tell us all what it is?
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What is this agency that "locks up" child rapists after they complete their court ordered sentences? Why were they released from prison in the first place? Why are they not spending their life sentences where they were initially incarcerated? Having them spend their time in a half way house is not the same as maximum security.

Using the word "cured" in conjunction with the offenders is beyond ridiculous even with the silly caveat "hardly ever."

If these already convicted offenders need to be incarcerated after they leave incarceration, why were they released, and if they are repeat offenders, why were they not executed as obama thinks they should be?
 
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Cicero said:
When was capital punishment last used as it was intended? Convicted felons spending 20 years on death row before execution, if ever, is not capital punishment.
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As it was intended by whom? The Supreme Court? A sometimes bloodthirsty electorate? Politicians vying for election on "law and order" platforms?
The death penalty is cheap. It is the endless appeals that are costly.
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No doubt. Capital punishment would be a lot cheaper if we stopped worrying so much about whether someone might not deserve it (perhaps by virtue of being innocent, or because they were improperly convicted).
Doctors refusing to administer lethal injections on the grounds of cruel and unusual punishment is absurd.
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If only everyone would come around in that respect (as regards all forms of capital punishment, not just lethal injection)...
 
Babbylonian said:
As it was intended by whom? The Supreme Court? A sometimes bloodthirsty electorate? Politicians vying for election on "law and order" platforms?

No doubt. Capital punishment would be a lot cheaper if we stopped worrying so much about whether someone might not deserve it (perhaps by virtue of being innocent, or because they were improperly convicted).

If only everyone would come around in that respect (as regards all forms of capital punishment, not just lethal injection)...
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Come on. More than five years of appeals to check over whether a person was fairly tried and sentenced? Name one person executed who was found to be innocent?

You are not being intellectually honest. Even if the convicted felon's crimes were on video tape along with their confession, you would not be in favor of executing them, so their guilt or innocence is not even your argument against the death penalty.

"Everyone?" If the criminals would realize that taking lives by the most heinous methods possible might constitute "cruel and unusual" death the criminal justice system would not have a need for the death penalty, or as many prisons either.
 
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