An excerpt from Matt Taibbi's book

[Drudgewire]

I won't argue it could have been a LOT funnier. The fact I had to go to page three to find a quote that truly made me laugh with the wealth of material twoofers provide daily sort of annoyed me as a comedy writer.

Still, once it finally got rolling there were a few zingers in there.

 

[1337m4n]

If we do bomb Iran sometime in the near future or have another questionable election and Taibbi can’t find any facts about that either at least he’ll have Big Foot or the Loch Ness Monster to turn to. Unfortunately it probably won’t be any funnier then his last piece of garbage.

So believing in 9/11 Truth is like believing in Big Foot or the Loch Ness Monster.

A stunning admission.

 

[1337m4n]

Why shouldn't it anger me? Because like most of our press he is a fraud. He can't find anything better to write about? He pretends to be some hard hitting journalist coming with the cold hard facts when he’s nothing of the sort. He’ll write article after article on how the Bush administration is stupid and incompetent when they got just what they wanted and they’re still getting it. He’ll write two years ago about how Joe Lieberman and company are finished when Joe Lieberman two years later is still running around as AIPAC’s little messenger boy telling anyone who will give him the time that we need to bomb Iran. Taibbi has been effectively neutered like most of our press and he’s bitter and pretends like 9/11 activists are the only ones who point this fact out. Maybe he needs to find out a little more about 9/11 or anything else he chooses to write about before he puts pen to paper and then and only then might he get on the road to actually having an effect. Then again he’s probably given up on being relevant so he’s just going to try and be funny and get his hard hitting point across by calling people names and writing bad satire. Maybe he can get a movie deal and bail for good. One can only hope. Or maybe he should take some cues from 9/11 truth who obviously have had an effect on him. He can’t seem to stop writing about them anyway. If we do bomb Iran sometime in the near future or have another questionable election and Taibbi can’t find any facts about that either at least he’ll have Big Foot or the Loch Ness Monster to turn to. Unfortunately it probably won’t be any funnier then his last piece of garbage.

Not every journalist has to report on what a tiny minority of hallucinating lunatics want him to report on. This is why newspapers have different sections for global, national, local, business, sports, weather, etc, and it's also why articles have these things called "headlines": so you can avoid reading what doesn't interest you. If you're interested in Iran you can scan through these "headlines" until you find one dealing with Iran.

 

[TruthByDecree]

Not every journalist has to report on what a tiny minority of hallucinating lunatics want him to report on. This is why newspapers have different sections for global, national, local, business, sports, weather, etc, and it's also why articles have these things called "headlines": so you can avoid reading what doesn't interest you. If you're interested in Iran you can scan through these "headlines" until you find one dealing with Iran.

First off to even imply that the rag Rolling Stone is a newspaper is a stretch to say the least. They’re the same cutting edge rock journalists who panned Led Zeppelin and Nirvana. They don’t exactly have their hand on the pulse of anything now do they? And to refer to Taibbi as a journalist is a further stretch. And if the truth movement is just a fringe group of “hallucinating lunatics” then why does the bad-ass Taibee bother with them at all? Because that’s all I admitted. If he really feels 9/11 is in the same group as any other wacky conspiracies he wouldn’t bother with it. So why does he? Well I see he’s been on Maher more then a few times. Maybe he’s just sucking up and trying to get some more Real Time because he’s such an ethical journalist. Excuse me I think I just threw up in my mouth. He want’s to be famous. How is a lunatic CT that no one believes in going to facilitate that? He likes getting his face on air doesn’t he? Face it he doesn’t want to be a reporter writing on the internet and in Rolling Stone. He could care less about 9/11 he’s got bigger plans he’s just using it. How funny. Ha ha

 

[uk_dave]

And yet when that bastion of journalism, Hustler, produced a feature on Loose change the fanboys were ecstatic.......

...well that might have been because of the porn.

 

[Par]

...if the truth movement is just a fringe group of “hallucinating lunatics” then why does the bad-ass Taibee bother with them at all? Because that’s all I admitted. If he really feels 9/11 is in the same group as any other wacky conspiracies he wouldn’t bother with it.

Opposition to such a cynical and morally perverse attempt at historical falsification is of inherent value, and thus if not practically a duty, then at the very least an honourable activity with which to engage.

 

[1337m4n]

First off to even imply that the rag Rolling Stone is a newspaper is a stretch to say the least. They’re the same cutting edge rock journalists who panned Led Zeppelin and Nirvana. They don’t exactly have their hand on the pulse of anything now do they? And to refer to Taibbi as a journalist is a further stretch. And if the truth movement is just a fringe group of “hallucinating lunatics” then why does the bad-ass Taibee bother with them at all? Because that’s all I admitted. If he really feels 9/11 is in the same group as any other wacky conspiracies he wouldn’t bother with it. So why does he? Well I see he’s been on Maher more then a few times. Maybe he’s just sucking up and trying to get some more Real Time because he’s such an ethical journalist. Excuse me I think I just threw up in my mouth. He want’s to be famous. How is a lunatic CT that no one believes in going to facilitate that? He likes getting his face on air doesn’t he? Face it he doesn’t want to be a reporter writing on the internet and in Rolling Stone. He could care less about 9/11 he’s got bigger plans he’s just using it. How funny. Ha ha

I don't get it. First you're whining about how Taibee's article is a "fraud" "like most of our press" and that it's an insult to journalistic integrity. But now here you are claiming that he's not a journalist at all and the Rolling Stone is not a real newspaper.

Which is it? If the Rolling Stone is insignificant as a true journalistic newspaper, then its hypocritical to get angry at Taibee's alleged lack of journalistic integrity. You can't simultaneously argue that this article damages journalistic integrity AND that it is neither written by a real journalist nor written for a real newspaper. Have some consistency in your woo, please.

 

[Par]

So why does he? Well I see he’s been on Maher more then a few times. Maybe he’s just sucking up and trying to get some more Real Time because he’s such an ethical journalist. Excuse me I think I just threw up in my mouth. He want’s to be famous. How is a lunatic CT that no one believes in going to facilitate that? He likes getting his face on air doesn’t he? Face it he doesn’t want to be a reporter writing on the internet and in Rolling Stone. He could care less about 9/11 he’s got bigger plans he’s just using it. How funny. Ha ha

Irrelevant.

 

[1337m4n]

Opposition to such a cynical and morally perverse attempt at historical falsification is of inherent value, and thus if not practically a duty, then at the very least an honourable activity with which to engage.

I'd also like to add that the Earth Liberation Front could also be considered a lunatic fringe group, but it's still a bad idea to simply ignore or sweep under the carpet their acts of property destruction and arson.

 

[Stellafane]

First off to even imply that the rag Rolling Stone is a newspaper is a stretch to say the least...

And yet, truthers can't even achieve that meager level of journalistic success. (I bet Matt didn't have to pay Rolling Stone to publish his article.) Meanwhile, mountains of irrefutable, carefully researched, expert material that proves beyond a quark of reasonable doubt that all the 9/11 CTs are nothing more than demented fairy tales is readily available all over the place.

 

[Par]

Opposition to such a cynical and morally perverse attempt at historical falsification is of inherent value, and thus if not practically a duty, then at the very least an honourable activity with which to engage.

I'd also like to add that the Earth Liberation Front could also be considered a lunatic fringe group, but it's still a bad idea to simply ignore or sweep under the carpet their acts of property destruction and arson.

Indeed. It seems that TruthByDecree is trying to make the following argument, or something very like it:

• If something is fringe, then it will be or should be completely ignored.
• 9/11 conspiracy theories are not completely ignored.
• Therefore, they are not fringe, but rather mainstream.
• Therefore, they are legitimate.

It is an obvious non sequitur, however. (Holocaust denial, for example, is undoubtedly fringe pseudohistory. But it is not completely ignored*; nor necessarily should it be. This doesn’t mean, however, that Holocaust denial is somehow mainstream or legitimate.)

* Of course, it is ignored – and probably rightly so – by the vast majority of mainstream academia, just as are 9/11 conspiracy theories.

 

[Par]

I'd also like to add that the Earth Liberation Front could also be considered a lunatic fringe group, but it's still a bad idea to simply ignore or sweep under the carpet their acts of property destruction and arson.

Interestingly, I once gave some fairly serious consideration to engaging in this sort of activity myself – either by joining a group like the Earth Liberation Front, or simply by acting as an individual or part of a splinter group. I was somewhat more radical at the time.

 

[ktesibios]

I've just started reading the book- got it on my regular Wednesday afternoon bookstore run- and my impression is that Taibbi's point is that the "Great Derangement"- the idiot belief that reality is determined by ideology and that opinions are facts- now permeates our society from the highest levels of government to the least-literate commenter on YouTube, in the manner of fleas in a feral cat colony.

I'd like to thank TruthbyDecree for providing evidence that this hypothesis is true.

 

[Cl1mh4224rd]

He can't find anything better to write about?

So, basically, what you're saying is that you only want to see praise and adulation heaped upon the truth movement. No criticism? Why?

And if the truth movement is just a fringe group of “hallucinating lunatics” then why does the bad-ass Taibee bother with them at all? Because that’s all I admitted. If he really feels 9/11 is in the same group as any other wacky conspiracies he wouldn’t bother with it. So why does he?

Here it is again... You don't want attention unless it's only positive. You want your critics to just shut up, don't you?

 

[Dog Town]

First off to even imply that the rag Rolling Stone is a newspaper is a stretch to say the least. They’re the same cutting edge rock journalists who panned Led Zeppelin and Nirvana. They don’t exactly have their hand on the pulse of anything now do they?

Are you claiming Matt writes the Record/CD/MP3 etc...reviews? No political writers do. RS has giv'en to the public many great writers of my lifetime. Ever hear of PJ O'rourke, or a little Gonzo guy named Hunter?
Matt shreds your little movement, we laugh along.

 

[TruthByDecree]

And yet when that bastion of journalism, Hustler, produced a feature on Loose change the fanboys were ecstatic..........well that might have been because of the porn.

Hustlers better in my book then Rolling Stone any day. Didn’t Larry Flint get a Republican to resign once? Now that’s relevant.

Opposition to such a cynical and morally perverse attempt at historical falsification is of inherent value, and thus if not practically a duty, then at the very least an honourable activity with which to engage.

Then why don’t you do your duty? You’re on the wrong side you know.

Which is it? If the Rolling Stone is insignificant as a true journalistic newspaper, then its hypocritical to get angry at Taibee's alleged lack of journalistic integrity. You can't simultaneously argue that this article damages journalistic integrity AND that it is neither written by a real journalist nor written for a real newspaper. Have some consistency in your woo, please.

I haven’t changed my position on Taibee one iota. Stop babbling because you have nothing else.

Irrelevant.

Not as irrelevant as Taibee and his fiction.

I'd also like to add that the Earth Liberation Front could also be considered a lunatic fringe group, but it's still a bad idea to simply ignore or sweep under the carpet their acts of property destruction and arson.

So why does the Bush administration get a pass?

And yet, truthers can't even achieve that meager level of journalistic success. (I bet Matt didn't have to pay Rolling Stone to publish his article.) Meanwhile, mountains of irrefutable, carefully researched, expert material that proves beyond a quark of reasonable doubt that all the 9/11 CTs are nothing more than demented fairy tales is readily available all over the place.

What mountain? Not in anything Taibee ever wrote or anywhere else for that matter. Debunkers have nothing without Bush administration controled investigations. Nothing not even a mole hill of evidence. Even articles like Taibee’s you all seem so giddy about are absent any facts because he like everyone else has no facts on 9/11. There hasn't been a real investigation to get any.

Indeed. It seems that TruthByDecree is trying to make the following argument, or something very like it:

• If something is fringe, then it will be or should be completely ignored.
• 9/11 conspiracy theories are not completely ignored.
• Therefore, they are not fringe, but rather mainstream.
• Therefore, they are legitimate.

It is an obvious non sequitur, however. (Holocaust denial, for example, is undoubtedly fringe pseudohistory. But it is not completely ignored*; nor necessarily should it be. This doesn’t mean, however, that Holocaust denial is somehow mainstream or legitimate.)

* Of course, it is ignored – and probably rightly so – by the vast majority of mainstream academia, just as are 9/11 conspiracy theories.

What’s that your lame attempt at pretending to be Taibee? Is he your new hero? And please give the holocaust a rest already. It’s sure sign you have nothing. What I would like to know if it’s so fringe then who is sending him the massive amounts of email he claims? And did you check out the comments under his articles on 9/11? I guess that’s all one guy too? Whatever gets you through the night.

I've just started reading the book- got it on my regular Wednesday afternoon bookstore run- and my impression is that Taibbi's point is that the "Great Derangement"- the idiot belief that reality is determined by ideology and that opinions are facts- now permeates our society from the highest levels of government to the least-literate commenter on YouTube, in the manner of fleas in a feral cat colony.

I'd like to thank TruthbyDecree for providing evidence that this hypothesis is true.

Don’t thank me thank the Bush administration it’s their hypothesis. Hell it’s their motto. So Taibee doesn’t even have an original thought on that either. Or does that count as research on the Bush Administration and their claim that they are an empire now and make their own reality? I haven’t pushed any conspiracy theories here. You are the one who needs no proof to believe in your spoon fed version of 9/11. Now go wave your flag and say your prayers and feel secure in your blind faith in the Bush Administration and the new reality.

So, basically, what you're saying is that you only want to see praise and adulation heaped upon the truth movement. No criticism? Why? Here it is again... You don't want attention unless it's only positive. You want your critics to just shut up, don't you?

Because it’s not criticism it’s fiction. So he writes fiction and then points out how ridiculous it is. What’s that called again? Is it a Scarecrow? It’s something like that right? I wouldn’t really know but I bet you do.

 

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Because it’s not criticism it’s fiction.

With this new revelation, I think it may be time for you re-evaluate your original answer to l337m4n's question:

Why does he anger you so much then?

...and maybe try your hand at this one: In this very thread you whined, "if he thinks 9/11 truth is nonsense, why does he waste his time talking about it?" (Paraphrased, of course.) So, if you think this is nonsense, why do you waste time talking about it?

 

[ktesibios]

Don’t thank me thank the Bush administration it’s their hypothesis. Hell it’s their motto. So Taibee doesn’t even have an original thought on that either. Or does that count as research on the Bush Administration and their claim that they are an empire now and make their own reality? I haven’t pushed any conspiracy theories here. You are the one who needs no proof to believe in your spoon fed version of 9/11. Now go wave your flag and say your prayers and feel secure in your blind faith in the Bush Administration and the new reality.

I do enjoy it when conspiracists melt down and go for the "you're one of them!" schtick, blithely unaware that doing so demonstrates their inability to reason logically.

The whole routine is based on one of the paranoid conspiracist's favorite logical fallacies: affirming the consequent. The "reasoning" behind these amateurish attempts at insulting his interlocuter apparently runs thus:

P1: An adherent of [insert Evil Other out-group here] would reject my conspiracy theory for ideological reasons.

P2: So-and-so rejects my conspiracy theory.

C: Therefore so-and-so is an adherent of [whatever].

The trouble is that this mode of thought does not work. It's exactly analogous to thinking:

P1: If the electrical power failed throughout greater L.A. the light in my living room would not work.

P2: The light in my living room won't come on.

C: Therefore the electrical power has failed throughout greater L.A.

Perhaps I ought to note that the converse- denying the consequent, does work and is in fact the basis of diagnostic logic. Simple example:

P1: If the mains fuse is blown, the POWER indicator won't light up.

P2: the POWER indicator is lit.

C: threfore, the mains fuse is not blown (and I need a new hypothesis for why the damned thing doesn't work).

TruthbyDecree might find this book helpful in learning how to avoid such dumbass mistakes.

And I'd recommend a reading of The Great Derangement for an example of how to handle invective. While I wouldn't class Taibbi with the late Steve Gilliard as an exponent of the fine art of calling the mayor a hyena, he does have a handy way with the scorn scooper.

 

[Par]

Opposition to such a cynical and morally perverse attempt at historical falsification is of inherent value, and thus if not practically a duty, then at the very least an honourable activity with which to engage.

You’re on the wrong side you know.

By all means prove it.

 

[Par]

Irrelevant.

Not as irrelevant as Taibee and his fiction.

Irrelevant.