Tom Cruise compared to Goebbels

[Darth Rotor]

A prominent German Nazi historian has compared a Scientology speech by Tom Cruise with Goebbels' "Total war" speech.

You and this German get the prize, January 2008, as soldiers on the wrong side of the War on Stupid.

Where have either of you located Cruise as a Government official in charge of anything?

He's a freaking actor.

He's a member of a fringe religion.

Goebbels was far better placed, by an order or two of magnitude.

Please do not propagate Teh Stupid, OK?

DR

 

[Cain]

And He will probably play the role with a accent that is right out of Hogan's Heros.


Entertainment Weekly says he's using a Valley Boy accent. His "people" were afraid of him sounding like Hogan's Heroes.

I had heard they were not doing accents because the whole idea is a stupid Hollywood movie convention. Last time I checked Germans spoke German. The events from that time are not any more realistic because they are speaking English with German accents.

As for the parent post in this thread -- it's hysterical nonsense. The O'Connell video was funny, mostly because it mocked Cruise's mannerisms. The infamous SOUTH PARK episode was dull, formulaic.

 

[ddt]

You and this German get the prize, January 2008, as soldiers on the wrong side of the War on Stupid.

Thanks for the prize, but I think I'll decline it

Where have either of you located Cruise as a Government official in charge of anything?

He's a freaking actor.

He's a member of a fringe religion.

Goebbels was far better placed, by an order or two of magnitude.

Please do not propagate Teh Stupid, OK?

DR

Yes, but Tom Cruise is a popular actor who uses his popularity to promote his "religion" - I'd rather say sect, or cult - which according to many, is quite dangerous to its members.

And the historian compares only the speech style. See also this quote from the Guardian article:

Thomas Gandow, of the German Protestant church, who has previously compared Cruise to Goebbels, said the video revealed the actor's high standing in the organisation: "He is not your average sect member but rather a propaganda minister ... I still believe it: Tom Cruise is the Goebbels of Scientology."

Of course, we may discuss the noteworthiness of this.

 

[alfaniner]

Jerry O'Connell parodies the Tom Cruise video

Classic. Freakin' classic.

Upping the level of parody...



his video combines the audio of Jerry O'Connell's parody with the original video, only slightly edited.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWSlPYV_U7w

 

[Complexity]

Goebbels should sue.

 

[Darth Rotor]

Yes, but Tom Cruise is a popular actor who uses his popularity to promote his "religion" - I'd rather say sect, or cult - which according to many, is quite dangerous to its members.

How does this parallel with Goebbels? His party was dangerous to pretty much everyone else, not so much to itself. (Unless you consider starting a two front war a self inflicted wound, a position we might agree on.)

If you wish to buy into the Hollywood concept that it's denizens are somehow important, I'd ask you to reconsider. Cruise's Scientology, and its oddities, are hardly a secret. It is those publicly known oddities that undermine efforts he undertakes to influence, through the big lie or other means spewed all over the 24/7 peep show, a greater population.

As Mr Randi notes, any number of folks want to be deceived. Those sheep are welcomed to be sheared. PT Barnum summed up their lot rather nicely.

And the historian compares only the speech style. See also this quote from the Guardian article:

Of course, we may discuss the noteworthiness of this.

Hard to discuss what is not present.

DR

 

[ddt]

How does this parallel with Goebbels? His party was dangerous to pretty much everyone else, not so much to itself. (Unless you consider starting a two front war a self inflicted wound, a position we might agree on.)

Scientology is still heavy into recruiting. You and I and other internet-savvy people now know what Scientology entails, we know about Xenu etc., but does the public at large? Those who are sucked in, don't get out.

 

[Darth Rotor]

Scientology is still heavy into recruiting. You and I and other internet-savvy people now know what Scientology entails, we know about Xenu etc., but does the public at large? Those who are sucked in, don't get out.

Wrong.

Plenty of ex Scientologists provide info and criticism of Scientology. See some of the folks who provide info to Clambake, see also my friend Rob (mentioned in the R & P forum discussions) who left.

People do leave. You seem to be attributing super human powers to Scientology, the organization. They put their pants on one sleeve at a time, just as you do.

DR

 

[Almo]

I had heard they were not doing accents because the whole idea is a stupid Hollywood movie convention. Last time I checked Germans spoke German. The events from that time are not any more realistic because they are speaking English with German accents.

I think they should speak German with subtitles. But I like that kind of thing. Apocalyptica and The Passion of the Christ did right by me by being spoken in their native languages.

 

[luchog]

Plenty of ex Scientologists provide info and criticism of Scientology. See some of the folks who provide info to Clambake, see also my friend Rob (mentioned in the R & P forum discussions) who left.

And if you read the info on Operation Clambake, many who leave end up on the receiving end of a huge amount of harrassment, and sometimes worse. Some people have had their lives destroyed by it. Look up "suppressive persons" and the "Fair Game Doctrine". Although technically they publically claim to have repudiated Fair Game, testimony from ex-scientologists say that it is still very much in force.

I know of one instance in particular that I personally witnessed. It happened in a small town where I used to live on Vashon Island. The male half of a couple who operated an animal rescue shelter in town was a locally prominent and very outspoken ex-scientologist. Very shortly, a rotating group of about a dozen protestors gathered at the head of the (dead-end) road to picket him and his family, as well staging demonstrations in town. Their demonstrations and pickets included accusations of child sexual abuse, child pornography, and a few other lesser charges; and their tactics included repeatedly and deliberately blocking the private roads and driveways used by the couple and their neighbors. They also accused the shelter of animal abuse, and caused a ruckus about licensing and such. While the shelter survived, his marriage didn't, and his ex-wife left the Island. He died of cancer a few years later.

The articles linked at the end of my post give a bit more information; however, they don't go into all the tactics used and accusations made by the protestors. Although they make no mention of the accusations of paedophilia, I personally witnessed those accusations made by the protestors.

There was also a dentist who operated an office on the same road, whose business was also affected by the scientologists; and he was similarly harrassed and picketed for supporting his neighbor.

Fortunately, Vashon is a small and very tight-knit community, and the damage was limited by a lot of support from his neighbors. They also received considerable support by well-known Scientology critic Bob Minton.

links:
http://solitarytrees.net/pickets/sp990.htm
http://www.solitarytrees.net/pickets/sp992b.htm

There's a lot more out there if you Google "vashon" and "Scientology".

 

[ddt]

Plenty of ex Scientologists provide info and criticism of Scientology. See some of the folks who provide info to Clambake, see also my friend Rob (mentioned in the R & P forum discussions) who left.

I've read most of it at one time of another. One of the ISP's that was subpoena'd in Holland some ten years ago over the Fishman affidavit is run by a friend of mine.

People do leave. You seem to be attributing super human powers to Scientology, the organization. They put their pants on one sleeve at a time, just as you do.

Sorry for the sloppy wording. People who are involved in Scientology are under heavy pressure not to leave. What happens when they do, is quite aptly described by luchog.

 

[fredcarr]

People do leave. You seem to be attributing super human powers to Scientology, the organization. They put their pants on one sleeve at a time, just as you do.

That's not true! I like to jump in the air and while floating do both legs at once. I admit my float time is to be measured in milli-seconds

 

[alfaniner]

Maybe it's the uniform?

Why does he remind me so much of this guy?

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

That's not true! I like to jump in the air and while floating do both legs at once. I admit my float time is to be measured in milli-seconds

Stop that.

You are using the techniques ot the Maharishi Yoga Foundation and may unlease energies that you are not qualified to control.

Inquiries concerning trademarks, copyrights and other intellectual property rights governing should be directed to Legal Department, Maharishi University of Management, Fairfield, IA 52557, USA.

Maharishi University of Management is an Equal Opportunity Institution.

® Transcendental Meditation, TM, TM-Sidhi, Maharishi Ayur-Veda, Science of Creative Intelligence, Maharishi Sthapatya Veda, Maharishi Global Construction, Maharishi Yoga, Maharishi Yagya, Maharishi Vedic Astrology, Maharishi Jyotish, Maharishi Gandharva Veda, Maharishi Vedic Approach to Health, Maharishi Vedic Vibration Technology, Maharishi Rejuvenation, Maharishi Rasayana Program, Maharishi Vedic Management, Maharishi Corporate Development Program, Consciousness-Based, Maharishi Vedic University, Maharishi Vedic School, Maharishi Vedic Center, Maharishi Ayur-Veda School, Maharishi Ayur-Veda University, Maharishi Ayur-Veda College, Maharishi Ayur-Veda Foundation, Maharishi Ayur-Veda Medical Center, Maharishi University of Management, Maharishi School of the Age of Enlightenment, Maharishi Medical Center, Maharishi Vedic Medical Center, Maharishi Medical College, Maharishi Vedic, Maharishi, Maharishi Self-Pulse, Maharishi Heaven on Earth, Maharishi Center for Excellence in Management, Maharishi Vedic Management, Maharishi Master Management, Natural Law Based Management, Maharishi Corporate Revitalization Program, Maharishi Global Administration through Natural Law, Maharishi Vedic Development Fund, Thousand-Headed Purusha, Maharishi Thousand-Headed Purusha, Maharishi Purusha, Purusha, Thousand-Headed Mother Divine, Mother Divine, Ideal Girls School, 24 Hour Bliss, Spiritual University of America, Breath of Serenity, Vedic Sound Therapy, Maharishi Amrit Kalash, Maharishi College of Vedic Medicine, Vedic Science, Maharishi Vedic Science, Maharishi Vedic Observatory, Vastu Vidya, Maharishi Vastu, Time Zone Capital, Council of Supreme Intelligence, and Prevention Wing of the Military are registered or common law trademarks licensed to Maharishi Vedic Education Development Corporation and are used under sublicense or with permission.

From: http://www.mum.edu/disclosures/copyright.html

 

[luchog]

Sorry for the sloppy wording. People who are involved in Scientology are under heavy pressure not to leave. What happens when they do, is quite aptly described by luchog.

And it's not just people leaving the organization, it's anyone who is a prominent enough critic, or facilitiates critics and people leaving Scientology.

They may not be superheroes, but considering the massive financial, legal, and fanatical follower resources they have, they come pretty close at times; and have ruined the lives of a great many people. One of their favorite tactics is to attempt to bankrupt critics by the filing of frivolous lawsuits.

For an interesting, if somewhat older example, look up what happened to anon.penet.fi back in the mid-'90s when an ex-Scientologist used them to publish some of their "secret" doctrines.

Or more recently, how they destroyed Religious Freedom Watch, a website extremely critical of Scientology, known for publishing their "secret" doctrines, and replaced it with their own propaganda website; as well as their ongoing attacks on Arnie Lerma.

 

[Father Dagon]

Why does he remind me so much of this guy?
[qimg]http://mcgonnigle.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/boris_natasha_fearless.jpg[/qimg]

>_< I saw that movie. Dubbed into swedish. It was totally surreal.

And yes, comparing Cruise to Goebbels is really rude:

In a 1928 speech, Goebbels expounded on his then-radical theories of manipulation. What he said then seems today to be cutting edge meme-ology, and provides an insight into why he favored using the most popular music of the day to spread his message of hate:

"An idea always lives in individuals. It seeks an individual to transmit its great intellectual force. It becomes alive in a brain, and seeks escape through the mouth. The idea is preached by individuals, individuals who will never be satisfied to have the knowledge remain theirs alone. You know that from experience. When one knows something one does not keep it hidden like a buried treasure, rather one seeks to tell others. One looks for people who should know it. One feels that everyone else should know to, for one feels alone when no one else knows. For example, if I see a beautiful painting in an art gallery, I have the need to tell others. I meet a good friend and say to him: "I have found a wonderful picture. I have to show it to you." The same is true of ideas. If an idea lives in an individual, he has the urge to tell others. There is some mysterious force in us that drives us to tell others. The greater and simpler the idea is, the more it relates to daily life, the more one has the desire to tell everyone about it."​

Joseph had smarts

 

[articulett]

Jerry O'Connell parodies the Tom Cruise video

Classic. Freakin' classic.

That was superb.

Parody may be the best way to raise consciousness-- O'Connell was brilliant.