9/11: Impossible Speed & Impact Busted!

[HL7442]

Apathoid what did you guys think of the 727?

 

[apathoid]

Apathoid what did you guys think of the 727?

I loved flying on it, but never really got to work on it. My first and only time working on it was before the last flight of our second to last 727 in service. The 737 Classic was by far my favorite airplane to work on. It seemed like it was designed by mechanics, for mechanics. Everything was easy to get to and the systems were very straight forward and easy to troubleshoot. That plane made me look good on many occasions, whereas the 777 makes me look and feel like a moron at times.

 

[HL7442]

I've heard some horror stories concerning the L1011, mainly with the RR engines. But hey it's a beauty.

 

[Corsair 115]

So what's the difference then between the DC-10 and the MD-11? I thought they were pretty much the same thing.

 

[apathoid]

I've heard some horror stories concerning the L1011, mainly with the RR engines. But hey it's a beauty.

Yeah, it was very beautiful and way ahead of it's time...and built like a tank too.

So what's the difference then between the DC-10 and the MD-11? I thought they were pretty much the same thing.

The MD11 is basically a DC-10 on steroids with winglets and a glass cockpit. Most airlines that flew the MD11 gave up on them long ago. It's pretty much been relegated to cargo duty, where it is actually a big moneymaker. UPS and FedEx both operate the MD-11 and FedEx has the largest fleet of them in the world.

It's a neat airplane in alot of respects, but it just didn't live up to its billing.

 

[ihaunter]

How long before someone tries to use the fact that there is depleted uranium in planes to support the nuclear weapons at ground zero theory? You know someone will.

 

[Reality Believer]

...
The MD11 is basically a DC-10 on steroids with winglets and a glass cockpit. Most airlines that flew the MD11 gave up on them long ago. It's pretty much been relegated to cargo duty, where it is actually a big moneymaker. UPS and FedEx both operate the MD-11 and FedEx has the largest fleet of them in the world.
It's a neat airplane in alot of respects, but it just didn't live up to its billing.

It is also 19 feet longer than a DC-10, accomplished with barrel plugs just forward and aft of the wing box section. I think the wing geometry was changed slightly with modifications to the slats and flaps, but nothing drastic. The flight engineer was eliminated, so it was theoretically more economical to fly with a crew of two.

 

[Reality Believer]

How long before someone tries to use the fact that there is depleted uranium in planes to support the nuclear weapons at ground zero theory? You know someone will.

Oh Great! You just HAD to let that cat out of the bag didn't you.

Here kitty, kitty ....

 

[AMTMAN]

A bigger horizental would have helped too. I've heard from several MD11 pilots that it was very difficult to land and has some very squirrely handling characteristics at low speed. The worst being that you have to pretty much manhandle the beast to get it to even respond. Not a good thing on approach. See the not one, but two, MD11s that flipped over and crashed on landing for no apparent reason.

I don't know if you've ever worked on them, AMTMAN, but they have an even worse reputation with mechanics. There are a bunch of "gotchas" that make those things really dangerous to work on. Those things are built to be flying, not sitting in the hangar...which is where they spend most of their time...Hydraulics, pneumatics and the APU are designed to be sort of "automatic", meaning that "stuff can start moving" without warning and even the APU will actually start itself if you select APU GEN on the elex panel. The first thing we do after one comes in(yes even though we got rid of them, we also sold our mx services to the new operator) is pull and tag a crapload of breakers and put the elex, hydro and pneumatic panels in manual mode.
It's the only plane we work on in which you have to have been to its initial school to work on it.

You also can't have the parking brake set when transferring fuel into the center tank or simply fuelling(or defuelling) the center tank because of the weird angle of the center mlg strut. Then there's the wet horizental concept which resulted from not meeting its initial range criteria. Another bad idea. And how could I forget the "barking dog" aux pump.

All the crazy stuff aside though, it's not a bad airplane to work on(except #2 engine changes)

I worked on them breifly. It's funny how MD spent money on changing things like the cockpit but kept things like servicing hydraulics the same as on the DC-10. Which of course meant climbing into left hand wheel well and hooking up to each individual system. Murphy's Law dictated that the wheel well was slick as an ice rink. Boeing planes are much easier to service. You do have to admit however it's a good looking aircraft.

 

[AMTMAN]

I loved flying on it, but never really got to work on it. My first and only time working on it was before the last flight of our second to last 727 in service. The 737 Classic was by far my favorite airplane to work on. It seemed like it was designed by mechanics, for mechanics. Everything was easy to get to and the systems were very straight forward and easy to troubleshoot. That plane made me look good on many occasions, whereas the 777 makes me look and feel like a moron at times.

Never touched a 727 myself, it was on it's way out when I showed up. On the surface the 777 can be a bit intimidating. However once you get the hang of the MAT it's no that bad. If you get a fault you just go to that ATA code and do the test for it. If it doesn't clear it will tell you what to do or give a code that you can look up in the MM. That's not to say the aircraft won't throw you a curve every now and then.