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Why the astrologers may be right

That is a shockingly bad article.

All it says is : "Scientists have discovered the dates when we are born affects our lives and even our personalities, which is what astrologers and psychics have been saying for thousands of years."

It gives no details of which scientists, from where, and what they actually said...

There is a quote from Professor Kristine Barlow-Stewart of the Royal North Shore Hospital, Sydney - but no indication if she is one of the 'scientists' mentioned.

The large part of the article is commentary from and about astrologers.

Awful article.
 
Urk!

article said:
Australia's best-known astrologer Milton Black welcomed the new scientific announcements but he is worried there could be a downside to the multi-million-dollar prediction industry.

"It could open the doors to a lot of sceptical, shonky people that are going to come onto the market," he said.
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And you will be able to distinguish between them and the other fakes, how?

same article said:
Campaigner Brian Wiseman has launched a website to stop phoney psychics.

"If you've got a complaint, get on my website and ask me. I will take them to court for you if I have to," he said.
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Don't tempt me. ;)
 
Which basically says 'it's nothing to do with stars or anything like that...but temperature and nutrition may have an effect'

Nice spin of the story there by Today Tonight.
 
To play devil's advocate for a second - do astrologist's claim that the stars 'cause' personality differences or just claim some correlation between the two? Maybe astrologist's have deciphered a pattern that has some validity as is is also a known scientific phenomena (by modern psychology), and the actual cause is still a mystery. This article seems to say that season of birth is correlated to certain personality characteristics due to seasonal temperature. I remember from developmental psychology (years ago, I admit) that children born in the spring are more likely to be schizophrenic in later life.
If I was not playing devil's advocate, I might say this article proves that astrology is bunk - that there are real differences between people that depend on when they were born, and we have a perfectly rational explanation why...

I do agree that the linked article is giving no verifiable information, but I do think it is actually out there - though I believe chess is a learned skill, not an inborn talent.
 
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Smackety said:
To play devil's advocate for a second - do astrologist's claim that the stars 'cause' personality differences or just claim some correlation between the two? Maybe astrologist's have deciphered a pattern that has some validity as is is also a known scientific phenomena (by modern psychology), and the actual cause is still a mystery. This article seems to say that season of birth is correlated to certain personality characteristics due to seasonal temperature. I remember from developmental psychology (years ago, I admit) that children born in the spring are more likely to be schizophrenic in later life.
Click to expand...

The trouble is, the actual correlations we see are annual variations. Many of the things astrologers refer have completely different length cycles. While the stars' motion could correlate, the various planets, eclipses and whatever else they ramble on about can't.
 
Scientists have discovered the dates when we are born affects our lives and even our personalities...
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This is true. If someone was born in the early to middle of last century, they are likely to be more racist than someone born in the later part of last century. Think of how different wars affect a person's life and personality.

Of course this doesn't give Astrology any credit.
 
Smackety said:
To play devil's advocate for a second - do astrologist's claim that the stars 'cause' personality differences or just claim some correlation between the two? Maybe astrologist's have deciphered a pattern that has some validity as is is also a known scientific phenomena (by modern psychology), and the actual cause is still a mystery. This article seems to say that season of birth is correlated to certain personality characteristics due to seasonal temperature. I remember from developmental psychology (years ago, I admit) that children born in the spring are more likely to be schizophrenic in later life.
If I was not playing devil's advocate, I might say this article proves that astrology is bunk - that there are real differences between people that depend on when they were born, and we have a perfectly rational explanation why...
Click to expand...

But astrology says that everyone in the world born at the end of December or the beginning of January have the same traits. No astrologer has every come forward to say that there should be a Northern hemisphere astrology and a Southern hemisphere astrology.

Furthermore, astrology should be able to show amazing evidence in the age of computers. We can now analyze databases in a matter of seconds. Given the amazing amount of information that is available to anyone with an internet connection, astrologers should be producing mountains of evidence that show that birth dates coincide with specific traits.
 
Smackety said:
To play devil's advocate for a second - do astrologist's claim that the stars 'cause' personality differences or just claim some correlation between the two? Maybe astrologist's have deciphered a pattern that has some validity as is is also a known scientific phenomena (by modern psychology), and the actual cause is still a mystery.
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That would be nice, except for the fact that no astrologers have actually found any valid correlations between astrological data and personality traits. Any "correlations" are really better described as coincidences.

Ladewig said:
But astrology says that everyone in the world born at the end of December or the beginning of January have the same traits.
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Well, to be fair, most of the astrology-believes I've talked to here on JREF admit that the "old" ways of 12 signs are bad and inaccurate, but that there's a "better" way which is accurate up to a few seconds or minutes (conveniently disregarding the fact that birth times on birth certificates can be inaccurate up to half an hour).
 
sthomson said:
(conveniently disregarding the fact that birth times on birth certificates can be inaccurate up to half an hour).
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That's sure the truth. When my son was born, there were 3 clocks in the room, each with a different time. I asked the doctor how he knew what time was correct, and he said "That's the clock I see, so that's the correct time".


There's the fact that astrologers give advice based upon your star sign. That groups a whole lot of people together who were born within a 30 day or so period. If they're saying that they need to be so accurate about their birth time, why can they make wholesale predictions/advice based upon your sign at all? :confused:


I'd love to see some of the data/results from those scientists they're talking about.
 
Noblecaboose and I couldn't bring ourselves to watch. We saw the promo, both started ranting and cursing, and found something else to view (not to say we ever watch ACA or TT anyway).

The other story was about how a major departments store has banned Santa from saying 'ho-ho-ho'...when in the news they said it was complete nonsense and that the guy they fired was given the boot for breaking other parts of his contract. The fact a single moron is given so much credence to make such a stupid claim on national television never ceases to amaze me.

Athon
 
Quick question: if there are claims of "second and minute" accurate predictions from birth what is the precise definition of when birth occurs? I have to assume that the baby must come *all* the way out.

Does that mean a discerning mother could maybe put a bit of effort in to affect her child's life by subtly altering the moment of the critical threshold.

Inquiring minds need to know.
 
cyborg said:
Quick question: if there are claims of "second and minute" accurate predictions from birth what is the precise definition of when birth occurs? I have to assume that the baby must come *all* the way out.

Does that mean a discerning mother could maybe put a bit of effort in to affect her child's life by subtly altering the moment of the critical threshold.

Inquiring minds need to know.
Click to expand...

It strikes me that since the motions of astronomical bodies are extremely predictable, that a theoretical astrologist could make a computer program that correlates all the different factors that they feel are important, and the different conditions that they think cause meaningful events. They could then have it write out a day-by-day complete horoscope for a customer's expected lifetime, and sell it for quite a sum. The downside is that they can only do so once per person.

It'd be even easier if they distributed a computer document instead of a physical book. Save paper, too.
 
Lynx2174 said:
It strikes me that since the motions of astronomical bodies are extremely predictable, that a theoretical astrologist could make a computer program that correlates all the different factors that they feel are important, and the different conditions that they think cause meaningful events. They could then have it write out a day-by-day complete horoscope for a customer's expected lifetime, and sell it for quite a sum. The downside is that they can only do so once per person.

It'd be even easier if they distributed a computer document instead of a physical book. Save paper, too.
Click to expand...

That's an extremely good idea. What could possibly be the catch? But surely, it must have been done already?
 
I don't know, but I believe in the Chinese Zodiac. I'm a tiger and it has me pegged down good.
 
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