Was the shot Oswald had to take really all that hard?

[R.Mackey]

Yep. And actually the time between the first and third shot was estimated at 8 seconds. About 3 seconds between 1st and 2nd shot, about 5 seconds between 2nd and 3rd shot.

The Failure Analysis guys considered a few different timing scenarios, including one where a total of six seconds covered all three shots. They found even that was plausible, although working an old Carcano carbine that fast isn't the easiest thing in the world.

Oswald had qualified as a sharpshooter in the Marines (score 212, M-1 rifle, December 21, 1956). Indicating that he could, from a standing position, hit a 10-inch bullseye from a minimum of 200 yards away, 8 times out of 10.

Yup. And that's with iron sights.

 

[ConspiRaider]

What type of ammo is the magic bullet? I know nothing about guns.

I thought it was some crazy conspiracy theory. What does silver have anything to do with JFK being shot?

I knew that. Water is good at stopping rounds without deformation.

Your right.

Carcano ammo was 6.5 mm. Left Oswald's rifle at approximately twice the speed of sound.

 

[Gravy]

Huh? Are you telling me that it's normal to get an undeformed bullet that went through two people. Im sorry but this isn't normal. Dumb luck? Yes.

Oh, don't you be goin' there!

Note the lead ejected from the back.

McAdams is the shizzle.

 

[Elizabeth I]

Oswald had qualified as a sharpshooter in the Marines (score 212, M-1 rifle, December 21, 1956). Indicating that he could, from a standing position, hit a 10-inch bullseye from a minimum of 200 yards away, 8 times out of 10. A few years later just before leaving the Marines, he still qualified as a marksman in the Marines (score 191). Above average shooter when compared to other Marines, excellent shooter when compared to your average American male.

Source: Case Closed, Gerald Posner.

Not arguing the conspiracist case, but I thought I remembered reading that Oswald, while he met minimum requirements for the military, was not all that great a shot. Or is that conspiracy hype?

 

[JEROME DA GNOME]

What was the motive for Oswald?

 

[ConspiRaider]

The Failure Analysis guys considered a few different timing scenarios, including one where a total of six seconds covered all three shots. They found even that was plausible, although working an old Carcano carbine that fast isn't the easiest thing in the world.

Yeps.

Oswald also knew this rifle implicitly. Same one he used to try and kill General Walker with. And, he practiced with it as well. And as anyone who owns a gun will tell you, familiarity with a weapon can eventually make it feel like an extension of your arm.

That 3rd shot - at least one witness remembers a longer pause between the 2nd and 3rd, as opposed between the 1st and 2nd. Also, the limo driver, Bill Greer, essentially stopped the car to determine what the hell was going on. So, Oswald had a virtually stationary target for the final shot.

 

[ConspiRaider]

Not arguing the conspiracist case, but I thought I remembered reading that Oswald, while he met minimum requirements for the military, was not all that great a shot. Or is that conspiracy hype?

Pure hype. More accurately, lies.

 

[Gravy]

What was the motive for Oswald?

He was a very angry, violent guy who desperately wanted to make a name for himself somehow. That didn't happen when he defected to Russia. He finally got his wish.

 

[bynmdsue]

What was the motive for Oswald?

Gonna be a Big Man.Finally show them all.


ETAamn that Gravy's quick.

 

[Skibum]

What was the motive for Oswald?

According to the Warren Commission

It is apparent, however, that Oswald was moved by an overriding hostility to his environment. He does not appear to have been able to establish meaningful relationships with other people. He was perpetually discontented with the world around him. Long before the assassination he expressed his hatred for American society and acted in protest against it. Oswald's search for what he conceived to be the perfect society was doomed from the start. He sought for himself a place in history — a role as the "great man" who would be recognized as having been in advance of his times. His commitment to Marxism and communism appears to have been another important factor in his motivation. He also had demonstrated a capacity to act decisively and without regard to the consequences when such action would further his aims of the moment. Out of these and the many other factors which may have molded the character of Lee Harvey Oswald there emerged a man capable of assassinating President Kennedy.

Scary thing is, a great many truthers would probably fall into that characterization as well.

 

[ConspiRaider]

What was the motive for Oswald?

Nobody would take him seriously. Delusions of grandeur. And - very important - no strong, positive male influence growing up. His brother, Robert Oswald, said that if the father had been there for Lee, the assassination never would have happened. Oswald's father died 2 months before he was born.

His mother moved them all over the place. New Orleans to New York to Dallas and round and round.

10 years before the killing, in November 1953, a judge in New York City ordered Lee be placed in a home for disturbed boys, and be given psychiatric care. His mother fled with the family, back to New Orleans, before that could be enacted.

By the time he was 17, he had moved 21 times.

 

[JEROME DA GNOME]

It is apparent, however, that Oswald was moved by an overriding hostility to his environment. He does not appear to have been able to establish meaningful relationships with other people. He was perpetually discontented with the world around him. Long before the assassination he expressed his hatred for American society and acted in protest against it. Oswald's search for what he conceived to be the perfect society was doomed from the start. He sought for himself a place in history — a role as the "great man" who would be recognized as having been in advance of his times. His commitment to Marxism and communism appears to have been another important factor in his motivation. He also had demonstrated a capacity to act decisively and without regard to the consequences when such action would further his aims of the moment. Out of these and the many other factors which may have molded the character of Lee Harvey Oswald there emerged a man capable of assassinating President Kennedy.

So, he was a communist that thought himself more than he was and needed to prove it. Two motivations.

Why did the U.S. governmnet allow him back after defecting?

 

[ConspiRaider]

So, he was a communist that thought himself more than he was and needed to prove it. Two motivations.

Why did the U.S. governmnet allow him back after defecting?

Because the U.S. Gov had been through this kind of thing before. And, Russia was happy to offload him. They knew he was a kook.

Not very many, but others had defected from the USA, only to be soon disillusioned and aching to return. It's tough to leave home wherever it is, and that's even more a case for the USA. Many Americans are just not aware of how good we really do have it. That message gets drilled in rather clearly when you leave.

So the U.S. Gov wasn't really surprised he wanted to return, and, they decided to keep a loose watch on him when he did. FBI, mostly.

 

[Gravy]

Why did the U.S. governmnet allow him back after defecting?

They thought he was every bit as important as the Russians did, which was not at all. They knew he had no secrets to pass either way. One of the reasons that people didn't take him seriously was that he was prone to great exaggerations.

 

[JEROME DA GNOME]

Not very many, but others had defected from the USA, only to be soon disillusioned and aching to return. It's tough to leave home wherever it is, and that's even more a case for the USA. Many Americans are just not aware of how good we really do have it. That message gets drilled in rather clearly when you leave.

Then the Warren report mis-characterized him as a communist?

It was only the "big-man" need that caused his action.

 

[technoextreme]

Oh, don't you be goin' there!

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/879047237aa5f1c78.gif[/qimg]

Note the lead ejected from the back.

McAdams is the shizzle.

Gotcha. Though I don't quite get what the lead enjected out the back represents. It's certainly the bullet isn't even round anymore with that picture.

 

[ConspiRaider]

Then the Warren report mis-characterized him as a communist?

It was only the "big-man" need that caused his action.

No, he was a lover of Marxism, or so he claimed to love it. He'd tried to convert his Marine "buddies", talked to anyone who would listen (or not). It was an "identity" to Oswald.

But getting to the point where you are going to do something this drastic is a complex, very hopscotch journey, typically. With his Marxist views, Oswald knew he would stand out. He expected some kind of celebrity or notoriety for that, but what he got was far below his lofty expectations. Lots of people have delusions of grandeur and yet could never imagine killing someone of prominence to sate their yearning for attention. Many things figured into Oswald's pathology.

 

[Walrus32]

What was the motive for Oswald?

Interesting theory I ran across many years ago, but I can't remember where - so don't ask for a link.

Oswald was actually trying to get Connelly, who would not give him an honorable discharge, or for some other grievance. If that was Oswald's motive, it removes any controversy over his skill as a marksman. At least it's an interesting idea...

 

[njslim]

Discovery TV Channel did recreation of shooting to debunk the so called "magic bullet"
claimed by CT kooks. Placed person with Carcano rifle on elevated platform same
elevation as Book Depository and used ballistic gel dummies with bone simulants
Placed dummies at same distance and position as Kennedy/Connally - with Connally
inboard and lower as was on that day. Most CT committ elementary mistake of
assuming were positioned directly inline with each other (where have we seem this
before?) Rifleman was able to almost exactly duplicate wounds, Kennedy struck in
upper back, exiting at throat, Connally in back, exiting through ribs, passing through
wrist and inbedding in thigh. Only difference was their shot struck 2 of the ribs versus
only 1 rib, bullet lacked velocity to inbed in thigh, bouncing off. This was only one shot
and could duplicate the wounds almost perfectly.
inbedding

 

[JEROME DA GNOME]

Gotcha. Though I don't quite get what the lead enjected out the back represents. It's certainly the bullet isn't even round anymore with that picture.

It means that the bullet was fired.

This has no relevance to the fact that the bullet does not represent a bullet that caused such a great deal of damage.

ETA: This only shows that that bullet most probably was not the real bullet. Could have been someone misplaced the real bullet and did not want to get into trouble for losing evidence in such a high profile case.