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ACLU: Decries bathroom Sting

tsg said:
It is only unfair, if the ACLU is right, because the police made the arrest before they had enough evidence to show the solicitation was for public sex. They got sloppy.
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THe ACLU seems to want there to be a real sex act taking place, comunication is not enough.
 
ponderingturtle said:
Yep and here the ACLU is accusing the police of an unconstitutional sting. So let them present their evidence.
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They have presented their argument. And, should it go to court, I am sure they will present their evidence there as well.
 
ponderingturtle said:
So saying "I want to have sex with you in this bathroom right now" is legal because of the first amendment? Add in actions to support that they are serious about this.
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That isn't their claim. And it is patently obvious you have no intention of understanding what their claim really is.
 
ponderingturtle said:
So why do you infer what the ACLU means and not what others mean? You infer that they meant reasonable doubt when they only said doubt, but any small omission by anyone else is something to jump on?
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See above.
 
This might be the motive:
"The real motive behind secret sting operations like the one that resulted in Senator Craig’s arrest is not to stop people from inappropriate activity. It is to make as many arrests as possible – arrests that sometimes unconstitutionally trap innocent people," said Anthony Romero, Executive Director of the ACLU. "If the police really want to stop people from having sex in public bathrooms, they should put up a sign banning sex in the restroom and send in a uniformed officer to patrol periodically. That works."
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I did post it because they were supporting a conservatives right to tap someone's foot in the bathroom without getting arrested.
 
I had no idea that sex in public was to be assumed okay and legal unless a sign was up noting otherwise!

Reminds me of George Costanza, when his boss asked him if he really had sex with the cleaning lady on his desk at work. "Was I not supposed to do that? Because nobody told me."
 
tsg said:
As far as I am aware, walking into a bank with a shotgun, ski mask and empty duffel bag isn't a constitutionally protected right.

But beyond that, it depends on whether or not the cop can show your intention was to rob the bank beyond a reasonable doubt. If the bank was in the middle of New York City during summer, he probably can. If it was in a rural area during winter hunting season, possibly not.
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And if you're trying to score gay sex in a men's room, you get arrested. I don't see the problem.
 
tsg said:
Strawman.
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Nope. Observe, bolding mine:

It is to make as many arrests as possible – arrests that sometimes unconstitutionally trap innocent people," said Anthony Romero, Executive Director of the ACLU. "If the police really want to stop people from having sex in public bathrooms, they should put up a sign banning sex in the restroom and send in a uniformed officer to patrol periodically. That works."
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The logical conclusion is that, absent a sign notifying otherwise, we may assume we have a constitutional right to engage in sex in any public place.
 
TragicMonkey said:
How about attempted murder? That's just trying to kill someone...but nobody's died. How then can it be a crime?
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Strawman.

Do you even want to understand or would you rather just be outraged? Because if it's the latter I'm not going to waste my time.
 
tsg said:
Do you even want to understand or would you rather just be outraged? Because if it's the latter I'm not going to waste my time.
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Yeah, I'm so outraged. You can tell by my passion. The passion of someone who really emphasizes with a self-hating closetcase who got busted trying to get a BJ from a cop in a public bathroom, then tries to weasel out of it by explaining his typical crapping posture!

eta: Oh, and saying "strawman" to everything doesn't prove anything.
 
tsg said:
Strawman.
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On the contrary. It's an example of a criminal charge that is possible without any crime taking place. Unless you think that attempting to do something can also be a crime.

Which is it? Attempted murder and attempted public sex are NOT crimes if those intentions aren't carried out due to being caught? Or they are? It seems inconsistent if you want to hold that attempted murder can be a crime whereas attempted public sex can't.
 
TragicMonkey said:
Yeah, I'm so outraged. You can tell by my passion. The passion of someone who really emphasizes with a self-hating closetcase who got busted trying to get a BJ from a cop in a public bathroom, then tries to weasel out of it by explaining his typical crapping posture!

eta: Oh, and saying "strawman" to everything doesn't prove anything.
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Choice noted.
 
tsg said:
You don't see a problem with getting arrested for doing nothing illegal?
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You know he has already turned in a guilty plea, and this entire case is a matter of him trying to get out of a crime on a technicality, right?
 
TragicMonkey said:
On the contrary. It's an example of a criminal charge that is possible without any crime taking place. Unless you think that attempting to do something can also be a crime.

Which is it? Attempted murder and attempted public sex are NOT crimes if those intentions aren't carried out due to being caught? Or they are? It seems inconsistent if you want to hold that attempted murder can be a crime whereas attempted public sex can't.
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That isn't the argument. Not even close.

ETA: Neither I nor the ACLU are claiming that he isn't guilty because the police prevented a crime from happening. The ACLU is claiming that there is reasonable doubt that there was ever a crime in the first place.
 
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tsg said:
That isn't the argument. Not even close.

ETA: Neither I nor the ACLU are claiming that he isn't guilty because the police prevented a crime from happening. The ACLU is claiming that there is reasonable doubt that there was ever a crime in the first place.
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Because he didn't do it, or because soliciting sex in public isn't a crime?
 
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