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Proof of God

Hardenbergh said:
I'll refer you to some verses of scripture in the New Testament if you wish to take time to read them:

Luke 13: 10-17

Luke 14: 1-6

Matthew 12: 1-8

Mark 2: 23-28

Also, this link will answer some questions. It references the same Bible passages with comments. Some of the comments may reflect the doctrine of the church that is represented at the website but it seems to be fairly accurate.

http://www.wcg.org/lit/law/otl/otl11.htm
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Should we put to death those who work on the Sabbath?
 
The Sword of the Spirit
"for the Word of God is quick, and powerful,
and sharper than any twoedged sword."
-Hebrews 4:12

sword.gif
 
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Your god is weak. It cannot do anything I can do. For example, I can type in an internet forum. Your god cannot do this.
 
Hardenbergh said:
The Sword of the Spirit
"for the Word of God is quick, and powerful,
and sharper than any twoedged sword."
-Hebrews 4:12

[qimg]http://www.mountainretreatorg.net/sword.gif[/qimg]​
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Should we put to death those who work on the Sabbath?
 
Foster Zygote said:
Should we put to death those who work on the Sabbath?
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I think that the verses of scripture answered your question. Those were the Old Covenant laws under Moses. As I said, I'm just an amateur Bible scholar. You'll have to study the Bible and you can judge for yourselves.
 
So, have we figured out which of the billions of so-called gods we are talking about.

Paul

:) :) :)
 
Hardenbergh said:
I think that the verses of scripture answered your question. Those were the Old Covenant laws under Moses. As I said, I'm just an amateur Bible scholar. You'll have to study the Bible and you can judge for yourselves.
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I've heard this false claim before.

Here are some passages for you to study from the New Testament where Jesus himself advocates all kinds of violence.

For example:
Mark 7:10 "Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death."

Jesus criticizes the Jews for not killing their disobedient children as required by Old Testament law.
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And Jesus tells us to follow the Old Testament laws as well.
Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
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Hardenbergh said:
I think that the verses of scripture answered your question. Those were the Old Covenant laws under Moses. As I said, I'm just an amateur Bible scholar. You'll have to study the Bible and you can judge for yourselves.
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How in blazes can anyone be a bible scholar or study the bible. Who do you ask for confirmation on confusing items? If the author(s) of a book is dead, you will never know exactly what he/she meant and studying it word for word hoping for a revelation of knowledge, seems rather sad. You could go 'eureka' thinking you have solved some part and still be wrong if you don't know or cant prove what the authors meant.

Someone can be a maths scholar because other people know what 2+2 equals and can prove it and then teach you. Nobody knows what was meant throughout most of the bible and if they say they do, then they are obviously hearing voices and need assistance.

You mean you are a bible reader. Different thing altogether.

Led Zepplin: "A bustle in your hedgerow". Nobody knew what this meant for years until they explained. If they had all died, it would never have been explained and it would be confusing to this day. Exactly the same thing as the bible.

The bible is just a mishmash of words interspersed with a little bit of common sense and a good smattering of brutality written by a bunch of uneducated people, some good time ago.
Anyone saying they know exactly what is meant by things stated in the bible, are arrogant in the extreme, usually do all the talking on sundays and should be avoided. They are usually the people who advocate violence towards believers and un-believers alike.
 
PBTree said:
Led Zepplin: "A bustle in your hedgerow". Nobody knew what this meant for years until they explained. If they had all died, it would never have been explained and it would be confusing to this day.
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First of all, it's not "they".
The lyrics to "Stairway to Heaven" were written by Robert Plant, lead singer of the group.
Secondly, he has never revealed what those words actually mean.
Thirdly, Plant is, at best, a third rate lyricist.
Most likely the words just sounded good.
That, he succeeded in.

If you can show otherwise, I'd be pleased to hear it though.
 
Hardenbergh said:
I'll refer you to some verses of scripture in the New Testament if you wish to take time to read them:

Also, this link will answer some questions. It references the same Bible passages with comments. Some of the comments may reflect the doctrine of the church that is represented at the website but it seems to be fairly accurate.
Click to expand...

What amazes me is that you didn't answer the questions put forth.

1- How do you explain that Jesus doesn't mention the same commandments as those listed in Exodus ?

2- Do you think that people who work on the Sabbath should be put to death, in accordance with the word of God ?
 
Hardenbergh said:
I think that the verses of scripture answered your question. Those were the Old Covenant laws under Moses. As I said, I'm just an amateur Bible scholar. You'll have to study the Bible and you can judge for yourselves.
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What an exciting way to make sure that you never have to answer those difficult questions, eh ?
 
BillyJoe said:
First of all, it's not "they".
The lyrics to "Stairway to Heaven" were written by Robert Plant, lead singer of the group.
Secondly, he has never revealed what those words actually mean.
Thirdly, Plant is, at best, a third rate lyricist.
Most likely the words just sounded good.
That, he succeeded in.

If you can show otherwise, I'd be pleased to hear it though.
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Well there you go, a third rate lyricist but known throughout the land. Never confuse talent with entertaining. If talent meant anything in this world, Bruce Willis would be broke.

I do remember seeing an interview with Plant once where they asked him about it but I don't recall what he said. Someone told me that it was supposed to mean a disturbance in your world. Now I could be and probably am, wrong. This more or less assists with my view of the bible. If you can't get proof from the person(s) who actually authored something, how do you prove whether you are right or wrong?? ergo, how do you study it. Learning something off by heart is great if its something like the 'times tables', something that has substance but the poor old bible has nothing to back it up.
 
PBTree said:
Well there you go, a third rate lyricist but known throughout the land. Never confuse talent with entertaining. If talent meant anything in this world, Bruce Willis would be broke.
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:D

Actually, I asked the five people immediately around me and not a single one recognised the name "Robert Plant". They all recognised "Led Zeppelin" however.

In any case, I was commenting only on the lyrics. The music is another matter entirely. I have all eight albums and the DVD, "The Song Remains The Same". Overstating it only a little, they have moments of pure genius.


regards,
BillyJoe
 
Foster Zygote said:
Not only have the Ten Commandments changed, but I see little morality contained within them. In fact, the only ones I wouldn't chuck into the dustbin would be 6, 8, and 9 from Exodus 20. These are the only three that are worthy of being written into contemporary law. They are in contemporary law. But many societies with no basis in Abrahamic tradition and no connection to the Ten Commandments have laws prohibiting murder, theft and defamation. And oddly enough, the commandments of Exodus 20 are the ones Moses smashed. Exodus 34 lists the replacement commandments (claiming them to be the same words, which they clearly are not) so this second set is really the "official" set of God's commandments. Should we really base our modern society on them?
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I was just reading Exodus 34. Which version of the Bible did you quote from?

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=exodus 34;&version=9;

Lack of agreement among various divisions with Christianity and Judaism makes it very difficult to reach a consensus about how the Ten should be printed for display in public locations. Usually, the preferences of Jews, Roman Catholics and some Lutherans is overruled, and the Protestant format is chosen.

The Bible makes

"frequent reference to "two" tablets...(Exodus 31:18; 32:15; 34:1, 4, 29; Deuteronomy 4:13; 5:22; 9:10, 11, 15, 17; 10:1, 3; 1 Kings 8:9; 2 Chronicles 5:10). According to rabbinic tradition, the purpose for having two tablets was to divide the Ten Commandments under two rubrics. The first tablet, we are told, contained the so-called religious commandments, describing obligations owed to God. The second tablet contained ethical or moral commandments, describing obligations we owe to one another as creatures of God and as fellow human beings." 3
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http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_10c4.htm

Yes, people were stoned to death as punishment (in Israel). Do you see anyone here being put to death for working on the Sabbath? Then don't worry about it.

Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, yet not from the commands of it. The first and the best evidence of the pardon of sin, and peace with God, is the writing the law in the heart. (Ex 34:5-9)
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http://www.biblegateway.com/resourc...etCommentaryText&cid=19&source=2&seq=i.2.34.1
 
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