"Traditional" whale hunting

[Bikewer]

I've commented before on the dubious (to me, anyway...) practice of allowing Tribal people to hunt endangered species as a part of their culture or heritage.

However, this particular incident goes a bit beyond tradition; seems the lads decided a proper weapon for whaling would be a .50 machine gun:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070909/ap_on_sc/whale_shot_7;_ylt=ApNUqR4kJWXq6um5xKnSxFsE1vAI

Now, nothing in the story mentions why the lads were in posession of such a weapon, (which can be legal, if proper permits and transfer fees are obtained)
but this does seem to stretch the definition of tradition and culture a bit.

 

[Niobe]

I dislike the practice as much as the next person, but honestly, if it's subsistence hunting wouldn't it be more humane the animal be shot dead effectively rather than culturally appropriate?

 

[Leif Roar]

However, this particular incident goes a bit beyond tradition; seems the lads decided a proper weapon for whaling would be a .50 machine gun:

I suspect that's mis-reported, and the weapon in question was a .50 calibre rifle rather than a machine gun. A machine gun strikes me as a particularly poor choice of weapon for whaling, and the Makah do make use of large calibre rifles in their whaling.

As for the "that's not traditional" argument: bah. Traditions aren't museum artifacts and the cultural significance of the Makah's whaling doesn't disappear because they use modern, more humane methods to kill the whales with.

You might as well argue that Thanksgiving turkey is not traditional unless people chop their heads off in the backyard and rib them for feathers themselves before cooking.

 

[casebro]

Besides, who says any whale is endangered now?

Yes, Marine Mammals are all protected, but I do believe that the hunted species are of stable and/or growing numbers.

Though if we allow folks to hunt just because their grandfathers did, why can't I? Shouldn't I be able to preserve my heritage too? Just because Gramps moved half-way around the world 100 years ago is no reason to outlaw my heritage. There are whales off Southern California.

 

[Bikewer]

I think I mentioned that the first time this came up.... I suppose my "heritage" would be stumping around atlatl in hand, looking for a mammoth....

I suspect that this might well be a .50 rifle, as stated above. The article reports it as a machine gun, but we know how reliable the press can be in terms of firearms.
The idea of mounting an M2 on a whaling boat may be appealing......

 

[Amapola]

It looks like the authorities agree with you, as at this time they think the shooting may have been illegal.

I would have thought a machine gun would have finished the whale off, not merely injured it. So maybe the type of gun was misreported as several have said.

I don't really have a problem with subsistence hunting by small groups. I actually think using modern weapons to make the animal die more humanely is a good thing.

 

[Miss Anthrope]

This is a hot issue locally. Part of the problem is that the Makah's were waiting on a permit. They were "fed up" with the wait and went out and did this in violation of the law. Many of their fellow tribespeople are angry with them as well.

Living on a river that is netted dry of protected salmon because it runs through tribal land, I have mixed feelings on the whole thing. There are good arguments and some evidence the Makah's are doing this more for cultural than subsistence reasons.

I support ethical hunting and fishing. The problem is that many of the tribal practices in Washington do not fit this description, and I'm currently quite on the fence with the Makah tribe.

 

[baron]

From here (1997) ~ http://depts.washington.edu/rural/RURAL/fieldnotes/seattletimes2.html ~

Makah whalers, who acknowledge they don't really know how to go about killing a whale, plan to chase the 25-ton mammals in wooden canoes backed by a support crew in a powerboat.

And they still don't appear to have a clue. Clearly they shouldn't be allowed to hunt if they are ignorant of the correct methods. If I went into a field and started hacking at a cow with a kitchen knife, would that be considered OK? Would whining about "my culture" get me off the hook?

That aside, seeing they hadn't hunted whales for 70 years until 1997, how can it be considered traditional? And why is it even considered important, if they've managed without it that long?

 

[Miss Anthrope]

Good questions, baron. Questions that have troubled me throughout the local debate.

 

[sinclairmcevoy]

From here (1997) ~ http://depts.washington.edu/rural/RURAL/fieldnotes/seattletimes2.html ~



And they still don't appear to have a clue. Clearly they shouldn't be allowed to hunt if they are ignorant of the correct methods. If I went into a field and started hacking at a cow with a kitchen knife, would that be considered OK? Would whining about "my culture" get me off the hook?

That aside, seeing they hadn't hunted whales for 70 years until 1997, how can it be considered traditional? And why is it even considered important, if they've managed without it that long?

Exxxxxxxxxaaaaaactly

 

[Puppycow]

This article says that it was a .460 calibur rifle, not a machine gun, and that the tribe has denounced the act and intends to try the individuals in tribal court.

I believe a .50 cal machine gun is military equipment, and civilians shouldn't have access to it.

 

[Bikewer]

Surprisingly, you can. There are a number of these weapons in the hands of private citizens, all quite legal if one pays the appropriate federal transfer taxes and passes the background checks.
There are any number of "full-automatic" shooting clubs across the country.

The first time I recall reading about this sort of thing was several years ago where (I believe) a different tribe was apply for permits to hunt a whale. In that case, there was no mention of "subsistence" hunting or survival, this was all about culture and heritage.
The people in the article said essentially that they could not consider themselves to be proper members of their tribe without this sort of hunting.

Now a great many people over the face of the Earth have "moved on" as it were from the occupations and practices that their fathers and forefathers engaged in. (I don't even know what occupation my forefathers had...)

I suppose these native people might have a case that their lifestyle was not voluntarily abandoned, but rather taken from them by outside forces.