Creepy

Yes well, in that particular instance, OldSchool is acting like an idiot.

Not saying he is all the time; just in this one particular instance. Having a clearance does not automatically equate to working for the CIA; nor is the CIA the "leader" of all the intel agencies, as he seems to be intimating. The CIA does not run the DIA, NSA, NGA, NRO, FBI, etc etc etc. They are independent agencies, and don't even get me started on the military aspect (I got my clearance through the Army).
 
I think OldSchool is not answering because he doesn't understand what we are trying to say. So I am reposting this in more easily-understood (to OldSchool) English.

jaydeehess said:
This, the Natiounahl Security Act ouf 1947 htp://ww4.law.cornell.eduo/uscode/html/uoskode50/usc_sup_01_50_10_15.html if so thien whaht part of it backs your interpretation that any memvier of Congress recieiving Cya reports is counsidered a member of the Cya? perhaps the pahrt that outlines pienaltyis for breaching the Act? realy, you hahve been ahsked a very strahhightforward question councierning a contiention you made. So far you refuse too show ahny suoportyng doucuementation four that contentyon. Wwill you retyyfy that or just attempt too vluostier youor way arouund actuoally answeryng the quoiestion?
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A further remonder to please respond to the arguments presented, and not personalise the issue by attacking another member.

Several more posts moved to AAH.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: chillzero
 
OK, enough picking on his atrocious grammar. Let's try this one:

In your extensive research (a handful of papers in college), you obviously took notes and cited your sources. You can't write and submit a paper without doing so.

Would you mind providing the names of these documents and/or publications so we can read them for ourselves?
 
Although I did recieve an A the final report, which I completed detailing the CIA's most horrific deeds, was seized by federal agents moments after she was done grading it.

Your are correct though I did have to provide sources for everything. Quite a bit of effort went into especially the last 12 page report. As I didn't keep it, I would have to start from the beginning. I would note the CIA's actions in Central America have been under scrutiny for sometime. During the Clinton administration the story even reached "The Today Show". There wasn't a single follow up and the investigation became back page news.
I know the difference between the various agencies Sabrina. They aren't of much consiquence compared to the CIA. The FBI is glamorized federal police. The DEA is a waste of tax dollars. You would have to enlighten me as to who the NGA and the NRO are. As for the CIA. Once again the select senators who do recieve reports are instructed only to provide information to the President or Congress if they feel it is required for reasons of national secrurity. The chain of command is no different than any other common agent. The only difference between a member of congress and a common CIA agent,nobody knows who the agents are except a select few of there superiors.

The point of the discussion of the CIA is only to reveal there high standards of secrecy. This level of secrecy allows for no accountability. I haven't an answer for how to hold such an institution accountable either. The CIA has grown to a level of power which makes it "untouchable". This agency has learned from its mistakes and has grown to standards which make it almost immune to Federal and international laws.

"It's only wrong if you get caught" Tool
 
OldSchool said:
Although I did recieve an A the final report, which I completed detailing the CIA's most horrific deeds, was seized by federal agents moments after she was done grading it.

Your are correct though I did have to provide sources for everything. Quite a bit of effort went into especially the last 12 page report. As I didn't keep it, I would have to start from the beginning. I would note the CIA's actions in Central America have been under scrutiny for sometime. During the Clinton administration the story even reached "The Today Show". There wasn't a single follow up and the investigation became back page news.
I know the difference between the various agencies Sabrina. They aren't of much consiquence compared to the CIA. The FBI is glamorized federal police. The DEA is a waste of tax dollars. You would have to enlighten me as to who the NGA and the NRO are. As for the CIA. Once again the select senators who do recieve reports are instructed only to provide information to the President or Congress if they feel it is required for reasons of national secrurity. The chain of command is no different than any other common agent. The only difference between a member of congress and a common CIA agent,nobody knows who the agents are except a select few of there superiors.

The point of the discussion of the CIA is only to reveal there high standards of secrecy. This level of secrecy allows for no accountability. I haven't an answer for how to hold such an institution accountable either. The CIA has grown to a level of power which makes it "untouchable". This agency has learned from its mistakes and has grown to standards which make it almost immune to Federal and international laws.

"It's only wrong if you get caught" Tool
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Old School, some evidence may stop most of us putting you on ignore.

Come on, you have said all manner of things concerning your grammer and then demonstrated the almost opposite of these claims.
Now you have pulled out the whole 'they are watching me' fast one, a classic 'feel important' aspect of the 9/11 movement psychology.
Please, provide some evidence. Your making so many claims and statements without thinking them through it comes as across as intentionally lying.
The forum is about learning and being educated. Im willing to give people the benefit of the doubt, but thats something you earn, you dont just get it given.

* I doubt your claims regarding your education
* I doubt your claims regarding the rules of the CIA
* I doubt your claims regarding your homework

Not one of these have you shown any evidence for.

How do you expect rational people to react?
Lying is dangerous.
Being wrong can be educational.

What do you choose?
 
chillzero said:
A further remonder to please respond to the arguments presented, and not personalise the issue by attacking another member.

Several more posts moved to AAH.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: chillzero
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When someone is discussing a particular conspiracy theory and then sensationalizes it further with yet an additional conspiracy ("seized by federal agents moments after she was done grading it"), it often becomes difficult to separate the issue from the issuer.
 
Björn Toulouse said:
When someone is discussing a particular conspiracy theory and then sensationalizes it further with yet an additional conspiracy ("seized by federal agents moments after she was done grading it"), it often becomes difficult to separate the issue from the issuer.
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True.

Remember, crazy people don't know they're crazy.

Others just go around making crap up to see what kind of reaction they'll get.

Either way, it's time to ignore this guy.
 
I'll go you one better, OldSchool; here's a list of EVERY agency that does intelligence work (the sixteen main ones and some auxiliary agencies) in the United States. Each of which is just as important as the others in the intelligence community; there is no ranking.

Office of the Director of National Intelligence
Central Intelligence Agency (CIA)
Air Force Intelligence, Surveillance and Reconnaissance Agency (AF ISR) AIA
Army Intelligence [1]
Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA)
Marine Corps Intelligence Activity [2]
National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency (NGA)
National Reconnaissance Office (NRO)
National Security Agency (NSA)
Office of Naval Intelligence (ONI)
United States Department of Energy
Office of Intelligence​
United States Department of Homeland Security
Coast Guard Intelligence [3]
Office of Intelligence and Analysis​
United States Department of Justice
Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), Directorate of Intelligence
Drug Enforcement Administration, Office of National Security Intelligence (DEA)​
United States Department of State
Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR)​
United States Department of the Treasury
Office of Intelligence and Analysis​
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Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_intelligence_agencies#U

And it should be noted that doesn't even include the TSA's intelligence section, or NCTC (National Counterterrorism Center), or the private contractors that do intelligence (SAIC, Booz Allen Hamilton, Boeing, Northrup Grummon, Lockheed Martin, etc). And trust me when I say the CIA is NOT more important than any of the others. They each have their own independent mission that is just as important. This idea you have that the CIA runs the IC is ludicrous on the face of it. If anything, the ODNI (Office of the Director of National Intelligence) runs the IC; the CIA has to answer to them the same as any of the other agencies since 9/11 and the commission that recommended the establishment of such an office. I don't know where you got your sources, but clearly they didn't know a damn thing about the workings of the IC. And do me the following courtesy; DON'T tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. Considering that I WORK within the community and you don't, I think I'm MUCH more qualified to detail how the IC works than you are.
 
Calcas said:
True.

Remember, crazy people don't know they're crazy.
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Most of the legitimately mentally ill that I have worked with have been acutely aware of their conditions. When properly treated and in a lucid state, they've all expressed a desire to be better, they don't want to be crazy.

They know they are sick and want more than anything to be well.

I've seen no such desire expressed by OldSchool, Max Photon or any of the other ego-strokers we've seen here lately.
 
DISCLAIMER: I was never anything more than an untrained volunteer worker. My knowledge of mental illness is limited. I am just giving my own observations from my experiences and not "laying down the law" as it were.

When they are not in a lucid state, you generally won't see them making asses of themselves on message boards like this one. Furthermore, their delusions and hallucinations won't have the internal consistency that OldSchool and Max Photons do. Actual schizophrenic delusions don't follow any sort of pattern and are most often just a series of random unrelated concepts strung together by the misfiring of neurons in the brain.

An actual shcizoid delusion would make absolutely no sense at all, something along the lines of "The Sponge Demons warned me the driver of the #8 bus is working for the Invisible Robot Fish.". OldSchools claims, on the other hand, do make sense in a saturday morning cartoon sort of way. OldSchool's claims follow the pattern of a rehashed old spy movie plot. It's tired, predictable and obviously B.S., but it doesn't have the "all-over-the-map" quality of a schizoid delusion.

I don't see even the crazier seeming CTs we get around here as being insane. Most of them are quite sane... if less than perfectly honest.

Christophera is an exception and is most certainly ill. I don't think anyone doubts that. That he doesn't follow the pattern I've observed doesn't mean that he has a perfect bill of mental health.
 
Please stop this derail and get back on topic.
Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: chillzero
 
Sword_Of_Truth said:
DISCLAIMER: I was never anything more than an untrained volunteer worker. My knowledge of mental illness is limited. I am just giving my own observations from my experiences and not "laying down the law" as it were.

When they are not in a lucid state, you generally won't see them making asses of themselves on message boards like this one. Furthermore, their delusions and hallucinations won't have the internal consistency that OldSchool and Max Photons do. Actual schizophrenic delusions don't follow any sort of pattern and are most often just a series of random unrelated concepts strung together by the misfiring of neurons in the brain.

An actual shcizoid delusion would make absolutely no sense at all, something along the lines of "The Sponge Demons warned me the driver of the #8 bus is working for the Invisible Robot Fish.". OldSchools claims, on the other hand, do make sense in a saturday morning cartoon sort of way. OldSchool's claims follow the pattern of a rehashed old spy movie plot. It's tired, predictable and obviously B.S., but it doesn't have the "all-over-the-map" quality of a schizoid delusion.

I don't see even the crazier seeming CTs we get around here as being insane. Most of them are quite sane... if less than perfectly honest.

Christophera is an exception and is most certainly ill. I don't think anyone doubts that. That he doesn't follow the pattern I've observed doesn't mean that he has a perfect bill of mental health.
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I agree that the vast majority of twoofers are not insane (of course with a few notable exceptions).

I wonder if you took a poll of the hardcore toofers how many would be claim to be devoutly religious. My guess is very few if not any.

I think that many young people (including myself when I was that age) have a strong longing to belong somewhere. Many find this urge satisfied in the mainstream, religion, sports, chess clubs, etc. But there have always been a few who consider themselves 'outsiders' and want to go 'against the flow' or 'establishment'. The funny thing is these 'outsiders' rarely are loners and tend to join with like minded people. The irony is they are fufilling this urge to belong in the exact same way as someone who joins the basketball team or the local church. I've believe that this exact same subsect is now the nucleus of the twoofers. They've found something to belong too.

In many ways arguing with a twoofer about 9/11 is eerily similar to arguing with a Baptist about whether it actually rained for 40 days and nights before the biblical flood.

I don't find it suprising that the twoofers believe strongly in irrational things. While perhaps in the minority here, the majority of the human population believe quite strongly in irrational things.

Humans are distinctly a social bunch, and in many cases social pressure is ulitimate cause for most things good and bad.

I guess what I am saying is that in the absense of religion, something must fill that void, and that something is not always good or right.

I would tend to disagree that religion is a cause of evil. Counter-insurgent theorists are now telling us that the causal agent behind a suicide bomber is not what he or she reads in the koran, rather it is the societal network surrounding them that pulls them in.

I guess I'm getting a bit off topic here. Anyway that's my 2 bit analysis.

ETA: sorry chillzero!
 
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I am bumping this thread for old school.

There are a number of unresolved claims I would love to see evidence of.

* I doubt the claims made by 'old school' in this thread

Regarding your education, we can judge your success of your education in literature through your posts. Whether or not you have the degree is not as important as the education to yourself such a degree could bring. Also previous discussion of it has lead to Ad homs.

However you mention several puzzling claims.

As I'm extremely familiar with how the CIA functions they're by far the most powerful and secretive organization in the world. Any field agent, up to and including the highest ranking member of the CIA, can take any action or break any law and doesn't have to report too his superior, unless he deems it vital to national security.
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Considering his <John Edwards I assume> position, at the time, as an active member of the CIA, his response was surprising.
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Even though, by law, CIA agents aren't allowed too conduct operations within the United States, the law is broken on a regular basis.
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I met a retired NSA agent once
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Members of congress who recieve reports from the CIA are members of the CIA.
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I spent two years writing a variety of reports for a variety classes relating to the CIA.
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Although I did recieve an A the final report, which I completed detailing the CIA's most horrific deeds, was seized by federal agents moments after she was done grading it.
Click to expand...

Can you provide evidence of these incredible claims?
Also considering you wrote many reports and had only the one seized, could you provide the others please?

Cheers
 
Sabrina said:
I'll go you one better, OldSchool; here's a list of EVERY agency that does intelligence work (the sixteen main ones and some auxiliary agencies) in the United States. Each of which is just as important as the others in the intelligence community; there is no ranking.



Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_intelligence_agencies#U

And it should be noted that doesn't even include the TSA's intelligence section, or NCTC (National Counterterrorism Center), or the private contractors that do intelligence (SAIC, Booz Allen Hamilton, Boeing, Northrup Grummon, Lockheed Martin, etc). And trust me when I say the CIA is NOT more important than any of the others. They each have their own independent mission that is just as important. This idea you have that the CIA runs the IC is ludicrous on the face of it. If anything, the ODNI (Office of the Director of National Intelligence) runs the IC; the CIA has to answer to them the same as any of the other agencies since 9/11 and the commission that recommended the establishment of such an office. I don't know where you got your sources, but clearly they didn't know a damn thing about the workings of the IC. And do me the following courtesy; DON'T tell me I don't know what I'm talking about. Considering that I WORK within the community and you don't, I think I'm MUCH more qualified to detail how the IC works than you are.
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So another words you're part of the most evil institution in the world. I could care less what you're opinion is and no ammount of money would cause me to lower my standards to work for any american intelligence firm. As I have a conscience and am glad I can still sleep at night. I could care less who the CIA reports to. The National Security Council is the most powerful group of men and women in the world.
Your view of the CIA is wrong though. The National Security Council,the same as the NSA's National Security Agency, has a Director. The director presides over voting by the council however doesn't have a vote. The director doesn't work in the field as a field agent. The director only gets information, the same as select members of congress and the President. The chain of command, which is the structure of the CIA, continues from the Deputy Director to the Director and on to the President and members of Congress. Whether or not they are considered members by insiders, such as yourself doesn't, really doesn't change the facts. Our intelligence agencies are no more than glamorized international terrorists.

Any intelligence should have to report to a secret court. A secret court in which the judge is voted into his position. This judges position should be treated the same as a presidential election. All secret agencies should have to report to this court full disclosure to ensure our agencies are operating within Federal and International Law.

I could sit here and link atrocities committed by our intelligence for hours. It won't change your mind though. The paycheck the government sends you is obviously enough to sway your thoughts. The CIA knows how to run politics. When Bill Clinton challenged the institution, which is the CIA, attemping to disband and restructure, he found himself in an impeachment trial. When threatened by an elected politician the CIA knows how to defend itself and cover its tracks.

Although the joke has been made comapring George Bush to King George our country has been comparable to the British Empire for some time. Our Country, no different than the Old English Empire, secretly has overtaken and controls many countries through out the world. The only difference between England and the current United States is our expanding empire isn't front and center stage with its power. Do not attempt to justify the instituion you work for you'll only turn my stomach or anybody who is aware of there practices.
 
Sword_Of_Truth said:
DISCLAIMER: I was never anything more than an untrained volunteer worker. My knowledge of mental illness is limited. I am just giving my own observations from my experiences and not "laying down the law" as it were.

When they are not in a lucid state, you generally won't see them making asses of themselves on message boards like this one. Furthermore, their delusions and hallucinations won't have the internal consistency that OldSchool and Max Photons do. Actual schizophrenic delusions don't follow any sort of pattern and are most often just a series of random unrelated concepts strung together by the misfiring of neurons in the brain.

An actual shcizoid delusion would make absolutely no sense at all, something along the lines of "The Sponge Demons warned me the driver of the #8 bus is working for the Invisible Robot Fish.". OldSchools claims, on the other hand, do make sense in a saturday morning cartoon sort of way. OldSchool's claims follow the pattern of a rehashed old spy movie plot. It's tired, predictable and obviously B.S., but it doesn't have the "all-over-the-map" quality of a schizoid delusion.

I don't see even the crazier seeming CTs we get around here as being insane. Most of them are quite sane... if less than perfectly honest.

Christophera is an exception and is most certainly ill. I don't think anyone doubts that. That he doesn't follow the pattern I've observed doesn't mean that he has a perfect bill of mental health.
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If anybody is ill it is you. You're a product of propaganda which leads to a growing disease, especially found on this forum, know as Government Niavity. Do any kind of research on the CIA you'll find the facts are on our side and you sound ignorant and uniformed to any who has. I keeping this one short and sweet because you're obviously willing to turn your back on our international terrorists. We are no better than they are accept the fact or you're the sickest of them all.
 
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