Derren Brown Trick or treat

skipjack said:
You were wrong; I am a lot older than that.
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18 and a half?

skipjack said:
Why, then, doesn't he make sure the revolver is in shot when he fires it, and why have the loader seated where he is in the line of potential fire and doesn't have an unobstructed view?
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My opinion on this is the loader doesn't have an obstructed view,it's a TV thing.The angle and depth of field of the picture suggests he does but really if you consider it correctly he doesn't/He is directly in line with the sandbag.
I watched again, as you requested, but couldn't pause the video at the key point. Even if I had done so, and had managed to see smoke, that wouldn't establish the smoke had come from the revolver, since Derren's entire hand and the revolver are off-screen.
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Where does the smoke come from ,is there someone else in the room with a smoke machine?! See the angle of the gun at 9:31,bottom left corner.Smoke comes from bottom left corner.I see no reason why the gun should deliberately go out of frame,it just does.
There are plenty of recordings available of real gunshots, so the quality of the bang proves nothing as to whether it is pre-recorded
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So the gun has two pre-recorded bangs does it?.Once when the armourer fires it then when Derren does? Don't you think the loader would notice this.If there was no bang the second time why does James(the loader) react with relief and mime his heart beating fast at 9:54 as I posted earlier! You are just repeating yourself now,with nothing to back up your fantasies.
 
For the benefit of us all on here ,who are tired of your arguments which go round in circles,maybe you could clear a few points.

1.The gun clearly fired when the armourer fired it.There was smoke a bang and a hole in the sandbag.
Therefore this same gun was fired by Derren and we have to assume it also fired ,made a bang and produced smoke(as seen and heard on YouTube video at 9:31)

2.What purpose would it serve to add a sound effect in place of real shot?
3.The Jersey Police made no statements until after the show had aired.Only because of the media fuss did they break silence.Why?
4.What purpose would there be to restrict the views of James? TV audience could clearly see everything anyway.

These points I see as the crux of the matter.
 
Azrael 5 said:
1.The gun clearly fired when the armourer fired it.There was smoke a bang and a hole in the sandbag.
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There was no recoil and the police said no live ammunition was used, so the armorer fired a blank (assuming he fired), which wouldn't be able to produce a hole in a sandbag some distance away. So the hole, if it was there, wasn't due to the armourer's shot.

Azrael 5 said:
Therefore this same gun was fired by Derren and we have to assume it also fired, made a bang and produced smoke (as seen and heard on YouTube video at 9:31).
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It was off-screen when apparently fired, so we can't assume it fired; a bang and smoke are simple effects to accomplish.

Azrael 5 said:
2. What purpose would it serve to add a sound effect in place of real shot?
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What purpose is served by not making sure that the gun was on-screen when Derren "fired" it, not having the loader sitting in a clearly safe position with a clearly unobstructed view, not showing the state of the gun chambers at the end, and not asking the loader which chamber he loaded at the end? Using a dummy round and a sound-effect allows the stunt to be absolutely safe.

Azrael 5 said:
3.The Jersey Police made no statements until after the show had aired.Only because of the media fuss did they break silence. Why?
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Because of the media fuss, as you said. The armourer may have been genuine, but Derren and the loader couldn't be guaranteed to be safe with a genuinely loaded gun, and it's very unlikely that either had a firearm permit anyway. The police couldn't just say nothing, but they said as little as possible.

Azrael 5 said:
4.What purpose would there be to restrict the views of James? TV audience could clearly see everything anyway.
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They didn't even see Derren pull the trigger on the crucial final occasion. At least James might have been asked to confirm that, but he wasn't asked to confirm anything at all at the end. I don't think he's been asked by the media about his side of things either.
 
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skipjack said:
At least James might have been asked to confirm that, but he wasn't asked to confirm anything at all at the end. I don't think he's been asked by the mdeia about his side of things either.
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Damn media (or mdeia)!!! How can they ignore something as important to the world as uncovering the fact that magician might have used a trick and didn't allow every step of the trick to be evaluated every step of the show! How can they ignore the fact that Skippy could be right if everything he assumes happened to be true (and if the moon is made of green cheese).

How can they doubt the importance of this breaking story to at least one person in the world???
 
The whole point of the stunt was to make it look real and properly witnessed, so failing to show or verify that the gun was fired at the end was not just a minor matter.
 
Bob Klase said:
Damn media (or mdeia)!!! How can they ignore something as important to the world as uncovering the fact that magician might have used a trick and didn't allow every step of the trick to be evaluated every step of the show! How can they ignore the fact that Skippy could be right if everything he assumes happened to be true (and if the moon is made of green cheese).

How can they doubt the importance of this breaking story to at least one person in the world???
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Those pesky magic people! Leading us up the garden path like that! I thought Derren was using real NLP and everything.I bought a five week course "How to be Derren Brown" off the internet.Im so angry at being fooled!!
At least I know how to make people pick the Daily Mail(get a 14 in your head) so that bit must be real.
 
Azrael 5 said:
At least I know how to make people pick the Daily Mail.
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Azrael, you have too much integrity to ever knowingly make someone choose the woo ridden Daily Mail. :D


E.T.A. Just remembered that the Mail was chosen with the specific intention of being torn up. Ignore me.
 
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skipjack said:
The whole point of the stunt was to make it look real and properly witnessed, so failing to show or verify that the gun was fired at the end was not just a minor matter.
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Of course you are absolutely correct. Who knows what adverse impact this will have on your life if you don't get to the bottom of it. I can't believe you haven't contacted the police yourself to clear up some of these questions.

Perhaps you could just phone the queen and demand that she get the answers you need. Or maybe Prince Charles (I believe he might be wacky enough to think you're right).
 
Ah no Bob,Prince Charles is a member of the Magic Circle and Derren consulted him on the finer points of ear defenders.
 
There was no recoil and the police said no live ammunition was used, so the armorer fired a blank (assuming he fired), which wouldn't be able to produce a hole in a sandbag some distance away. So the hole, if it was there, wasn't due to the armourer's shot.
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So now you see the chance that the armorer did fire a blank, with the exact same gun that Derren used later.. hmmmm. Didn't you say earlier that you need to use a real gun to shoot blanks? So I believe you DO admit they might have used a real gun, which is different than all your stupid claims it wasn't real!

Your nonsense last week:

I didn't suggest Derren should say it wasn't a real gun. If it fires a blank, it is a real gun
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That was around the time you kept denying the gun was real.

Your nonsense today:

It was off-screen when apparently fired, so we can't assume it fired; a bang and smoke are simple effects to accomplish.
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You always whined about him faking the sound and that there was no indication Derren fired anything.. now you suddenly say the SMOKE was an effect as well? Do you even listen how stupid you sound? You keep making mistakes, and then you realise those mistakes, you just make lame exuses about it.


What purpose is served by not making sure that the gun was on-screen when Derren "fired" it
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Remember that the cameramen left the room and they used remote cameras, so perharps that's why the filming wasn't perfrect. The smoke was clearly visible (the same kind of smoke the armorer fired) so we are led to believe they both shot it the same way. And they both used the same gun. You always said the gun wasn't fired, now that maybe you realise it did, you change your storyline. Pathetic.

They didn't even see Derren pull the trigger on the crucial final occasion. At least James might have been asked to confirm that, but he wasn't asked to confirm anything at all at the end. I don't think he's been asked by the media about his side of things either.
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We already explained why they didn't say anything at the end, it would ruine the entire climax of the effect. They ended it just in the right time, the same way you should stop with your ******** in the right time.

And I believe the media in the UK has better things to talk about rather than asking that person what happened there. Like going after Posh Spice again for example.
 
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DJM said:
Your nonsense last week:

Quote:
I didn't suggest Derren should say it wasn't a real gun. If it fires a blank, it is a real gun
That was around the time you kept denying the gun was real.
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Of course Skippy is as knowledgeable about that as he has been about everything else. You can fire a blank with a real gun (by 'real' I mean one that will also fire actual bullets). You can also get guns that are made to fire blanks and will not fire a real bullet such as a starter pistol (note these are also 'real' guns in that they exist).

So obivously Skippy is correct in that:

It might have been a blank round with a real gun- or
It might have been a real round in a fake gun- or
It might have a blank round in a fake gun- or
It might have been fake round in a fake gun- or
It might have been fake people with fake guns and real rounds- or
etc, etc, etc.

Looks like Skippy is changing tactics- he's just going to claim that every thing could have been anything. How can he go wrong?
 
I disagree with your last line, Skippy will always find a way to be wrong no matter what.. ;)
 
I saw an episode of Skppy once.A man got stuck in a well and skippy went to fetch resuce.
Problem being no one could make sense of what he was saying and no one went to help.
I think there might have been gun involved too.
 
I remember that episode, it was obvious Skippy was just using a fake hand to do that effect!
 
Bob Klase said:
You can fire a blank with a real gun (by 'real' I mean one that will also fire actual bullets). You can also get guns that are made to fire blanks and will not fire a real bullet such as a starter pistol.
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The gun Derren held could not fire live rounds, since such a gun would require Derren to have at least a firearm permit, but he didn't.
 
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