Bigfoot - The Patterson-Gimlin Film

[carcharodon]

Lyndon, I'm not trying to downplay the job Titmus, Green, Dahinden, Patterson or Gimlin did. I just have questions. It's okay to question, right?

Fair enough. It just seemed to me like you were criticizing Bob Titmus' efforts, just like Herman the German in his funny helmet was. In my opinion Titmus did a hell of a lot to obtain what he did and I don't know offhand of any of today's researchers who would have done what he did to go all that way on his own. Dahinden was another go getter. There aren't many like them anymore. I personally wouldn't have camped all on my own in the middle of nowhere in an area where apparanetly a sasquatch had not long been filmed. Not on your nelly.

If you weren't downplaying Titmus and criticizing his research then no problem. It did seem like it though.

If you read one account, and one only, then everything falls absolutely in place, but if you read multiple accounts of the same instance and find they are different then it all becomes confusing to me and I wonder whose account is the correct one.

That's true, but the accounts gel in most ways and they don't differ in the main. It's only natural that they differ in some aspects, especially in the heat of the moment. From my experience researching and analysing shark attacks it's rare that multi witnesses agree on every single instance and detail.

Patterson does seem to have had a natural youthful exaggeration as part of his nature. You can see that in some of the drawings he made of sasquatch in his book. Sometimes in his drawings they are giants almost semi King Kong like LOL. That doesn't mean he was a liar.

The scoftics completely and utterly forget or ignore the fact that, to the best of my knowledge, Roger Patterson never again claimed to have himself found another set of sasquatch tracks, nevermind a sighting of a sasquatch itself, after the Patty incident. A pretty boring climax to the life of a confirmed liar and hoaxer hey??? He never made another sasquatch yarn/hoax in the remaining years of his life. He did get almost suckered into the Bossburg Marx fiasco and a wild goose chase with the Yeti. Patterson seems to have been sincere, even gullible.

He wasn't a hoaxer. The evidence is squarely against this.

I do not have Krantz book, matter of fact I don't have but perhaps three books and one of those was the 50 years with bigfoot book which in my opinion was a joke. I haven't spent a lot of money to obtain a library of bigfoot related books. My interest isn't that strong in the subject. I've said for quite some time that my main claim to fame is that I have friends who are quite interested in bigfoot. I'm interested in the researchers. LOL I've hung out on bigfoot boards because I made a lot of friends in the BFRO and I enjoy their company. I had no idea that a skeptics board existed. I'm still going to hang around on the bigfoot boards, but it's nice to see a skeptic board! (Except for two forums)

Ok, but it would be worth your time if you are continuing to have an interest to try and get some of the books mentioned, if only for your own reference when it comes to discussions like these on various forums. I wasn't aware you didn't have the Krantz book so didn't know you hadn't seen Titmus' map.

 

[William Parcher]

Titmus/Krantz Map

 

[LTC8K6]

Imagine trying to walk across ground where your feet sink 1 or 2 or even 3inches into the soil. Picture how you have to walk. Picture what your toes do with the dirt. Picture the prints you are going to leave.

 

[carcharodon]

Yes, they look like a man walking.

Men walking UNCOMFORTABLY and certainly not at home with big fake feet on, you mean.

Something experts said when they saw the film. It's a human gait.

Some others note the differences. They have been talked about before here.

How do you know that? You have no idea what sasquatch looks like, or if it's fur is shaggy, or anything else.

I know that I haven't read too many eyewitness reports that claim the head is almost as large as the shoulder spread or that the fur is so shaggy that almost no definition in body shape can be made out.

Have you??

For all you know, Marx's silly suit may be more accurate than Patty. Sasquatch may grow a shaggy coat for the winter. Chewbacca may be accurate for all you know.

Not according to eyewitness reports and seeing as I'm convinced Patty is the real deal then I'll go along wth that.

For all you know, sasquatch is real, but it looks nothing at all like Patty.

I am of the opinion that sasquatch is real and that female sasquatches look like Patty generally, though there are probably individuals who look somewhat different.

Believers keep forgetting that there is no standard bigfoot look or footprint.

Actually there is a pretty common consensus in body shape and proportions. The real debate is the face but then not too many witnesses get close enough to minutely examine the facial features to tell for sure.

Descriptions are all over the place

Oh absolute codswallop. Where are you getting this stuff from???

and tracks vary considerably.

Depending on size, weight and sex...they should do.

 

[Teresa.Hall]

Now you know when you splain something to me you can't use page numbers. LOL I have Raincoast Sasquatch that Rob Alley sent to me autographed, the Sierra Sounds both volumes that Ron Morehead sent me autographed, the 50 years book after it has been passed around the BFF and somebody used it for a drink coaster that Bob Strain gifted me with (and I thank him) and On the Track of Bigfoot by somebody named Marian T. Place and I have no idea where that one came from. That's the grand sum total of what I've accumulated other than a few recorded documentaries from some friends, one of whom is on this forum (you know who you are . If the material you're making a point with doesn't come from any one of those three then I'm SOL.

Oh I did splurge and get a copy of the Legend of Boggy Creek on DVD LOL

 

[carcharodon]

I would certainly have documented where she squatted...

I suspect you wouldn't have gotten off your arse to travel 1,000 miles, then walk 14 to 16 miles on your own up a creek system in the middle of nowhere and then camp the night all on your own in an area where a sasquatch had reputedly recently been filmed.

I suspect all this. I suspect you would deny it.....but I wouldn't believe you.

It's supposedly the discovery of the century, and Titmus finds evidence that Patty squatted there and watched Roger and Bob, but doesn't document it.

Titmus never wrote a book and he never really published or gave away much of his findings. He was a doer, not a writer. He seems to have been a man who shunned the limelight and did things for himself rather than for people like you or me. Remember, he even upped sticks and moved to the back of beyond to Kitimat, British Columbia. He was a man who stayed in the background when it came to the media and publicity.

By the way, you never commented on the first second or two of the P/G footage and the screen grab I provided. Can you see the downfall tree system on the left and the forest in the background?

Do you still dispute that it was these trees that Patterson said the animal was backed against??? Are you still claiming Patterson meant the trees in the forest way in the background??

 

[LTC8K6]

Men walking UNCOMFORTABLY and certainly not at home with big fake feet on, you mean.

Looks comfortable and at home to me. I see no discomfort in the actor portraying Patty, if it's an actor. Nor did I see any discomfort in the actor that duplicated Patty's walk on TV recently.

 

[LTC8K6]

Does anyone know whay Napier said Patty's feet weren't visible? What film did they show him?

 

[carcharodon]

Parcher,

Do you really think it was amazing how Bob Titmus was able to distinguish Roger Patterson's smaller tracks from the other larger human tracks in the area. Why do you think this???

 

[carcharodon]

Looks comfortable and at home to me. I see no discomfort in the actor portraying Patty, if it's an actor.

There isn't any discomfort apparant The subject moves and walks naturally. That's because it's not a man in a suit.

Nor did I see any discomfort in the actor that duplicated Patty's walk on TV recently.

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat? An actor duplicated Patty's walk on t.v recently? Where was this?? Did he have on a bulky padded suit with huge fake feet and was he walking along a dried river bed at the time? Did he turn to look back in this bulky suit wearing his big fake feet withouit looking down and without ever once breaking his stride??

Now this I've gotta see. Can you give me a link or some stills??

 

[carcharodon]

Does anyone know whay Napier said Patty's feet weren't visible? What film did they show him?

Don't know, but he did think a rock was a Yeti.

 

[LTC8K6]

By the way, you never commented on the first second or two of the P/G footage and the screen grab I provided.

Are you sure? I'm sure I sarcastically pointed out that I'd seen it quite often before you posted it, and I'm sure I responded to your post that included it. Maybe you made an error?

 

[LTC8K6]

W: Now, okay, so you then gave up . you took the plaster tracks . How deep were these tracks by the way, in inches? . Inch and a quarter or .

B: Some of them were down as far as three and a half inches deep into the softer soil. These particular ones we took here were, weren't quite so deep because they were flatter tracks.

3.5 inches... Think about walking in that again, folks.

 

[LTC8K6]

Don't know, but he did think a rock was a Yeti.

And John Green thought Ivan Marx's wife stumbling around in a suit was a real sasquatch.

 

[William Parcher]

John Green interviewed by Gerry Matthews, 2004:

For example, right now, we have the proof - absolute and indisputable - that the Patterson film is genuine. The newspapers refuse to carry anything of that. It can't be sold so therefore they're not going to be taken in therefore they're not going to run the story.

 

[carcharodon]

Are you sure? I'm sure I sarcastically pointed out that I'd seen it quite often before you posted it,

Nope, you didn't. You wrote this:

Yeah, maybe I ought to look at that...

Where are you pointing out you'd seen it often then?

and I'm sure I responded to your post that included it. Maybe you made an error?

Nope, you didn't make yourself clear. You simply said you were aware of it years ago (the tree pile). You never once mentioned the screen grab of the tree pile that I posted.

You quoted the wrong paragraph. You should have quoted my first paragraph regarding the screen grab. The one where I talk about the first few seconds of the P/G footage.

Oh well nevermind. I see you are still playing games and trying to claim that Roger Patterson meant that Patty was backed up by the forest and not backed up by the downfall tree pile. I think I'm done here. You'd say the moon is bright purple with pink dots on it if it meant poo pooing the P/G footage, regardless of whether or not you are wrong.

Scoftic, stubborn cuss in the extreme. I'm not wasting any more of my time on you especially as you can't contribute much more than simple one liners.

See ya.

 

[LTC8K6]

Yeah, maybe I ought to look at that...

That means Ive already seen it too many times.

 

[drapier]

Has Hollywood ever produced a convincing gorilla suit? (By "convincing" I mean that viewers would likely believe that an actor in a gorilla suit was a real animal if that actor was captured on a shaky 16mm camera at a distance of 80-190 feet.)

If so, can anyone present an example? (Maybe even from the samples that Corea Neto have directed our attention to.)

If so, why do you think Hollywood has been successful at portraying gorillas but not bigfeet? Is there something special about bigfoot morphology that makes the task particularly difficult? What is that difference (say, compared to gorillas)? (It would seem to me that gorillas are more unlike humans than supposed bigfeet are unlike humans.)

If not, why not? Are Hollywood special effects artists so unskilled that they can't even create a convincing gorilla? (Maybe when a Hollywood studio creates a gorilla or a bigfoot costume the purposes are different than achieving scientific accuracy.)

Just some thoughts.

 

[LTC8K6]

Don't know, but he did think a rock was a Yeti.

Yeah, sarcastic one liners are bad.

 

[LTC8K6]

Has Hollywood ever produced a convincing gorilla suit? (By "convincing" I mean that viewers would likely believe that an actor in a gorilla suit was a real animal if that actor was captured on a shaky 16mm camera at a distance of 80-190 feet.)

Drapier, the problem with that is that Gorilla anatomy and behavior are very well known. This could go either way. On the one hand, it allows the actor to study his subject and get the look and behavior right. On the other hand, the experts who will see the film know gorillas very well and will spot errors easily.

With sasquatch, you don't have these conditions.