OEM versions of XP. Why so cheap?

[Soapy Sam]

Having been forced to acquire a new laptop, which came with Vista, I'm considering a dual boot setup with an XP partition. Even allowing for the inevitable new user frustrations, I find the laptop very slow for it's spec when running vista. I'd like to see how it runs under XP.

The XP version I have on CD is an upgrade. The laptop has an NTFS filesystem, so I can't load Win 98 then upgrade.
I need a full, installable version.

XP is still on sale in the UK, but for about £190. Too expensive.
I see versions on both ebay and Amazon at one third of that, which , though new and boxed are OEM versions- for sale according to an OEM licence.

Does anyone know what this entails? Would I be in any way illegal if I buy one of these and install it on my own laptop?

 

[cgordon]

I know of at least one company (tigerdirect.com) selling OSes at OEM prices (I think XP Pro is going for about $129) as long as you buy a piece of hardware that could/would normally be added to an XP machine.

Personally, for an alternate OS, I'd suggest Ubuntu (http://www.ubuntu.com/).

 

[gnome]

My understanding is they're perfectly legal, it is sold with hardware under a bundling license of the type that allows windows to be pre-installed on PC's--but can actually be attached to any piece of hardware. The reason it is cheaper is support. A windows XP installation under an OEM license must be supported by the vendor, not Microsoft. So you can install it, and it's a legal copy, but you can't phone Microsoft for technical support on it--you have to rely on what the person that sold you the hardware offers.

An excellent choice for those who do not need technical support... if you fit the bill, go for it.

 

[ChristineR]

I have to disagree on this. Most software sold as OEM is in fact pirated. The OEM installation disks are designed to install on multiple different machines, so it is difficult to impossible for the vendor to determine whether any given OEM installation is legal.

As for attaching the license to any piece of hardware (as opposed to a brand new Dell laptop) I suppose it is theoretically possible to sell your software that way, but I doubt whether Microsoft licenses that.

I visited Microsoft, and I'm pretty sure that they do NOT sell OEM software for redistribution.

Q:


When I purchase OEM Windows from a reseller, what should I receive?

A:


Genuine OEM Windows desktop operating system software is designed exclusively for computer manufacturers to pre-install on their computers. Genuine OEM software always comes with a Certificate of Authenticity (the OEM COA is different from an orange retail Proof of License label) and a manual or Quick Start guide. Some major manufacturers provide an OEM disc for re-installing programs, while smaller manufacturers are required to provide a Microsoft Windows edge-to-edge hologram disc. OEM software cannot be downloaded and may not be unbundled or re-bundled from sources other than the OEM selling you the computer. Visit our Counterfeit Gallery for more information at http://www.microsoft.com/resources/howtotell/en/counterfeit.mspx.

To help determine whether the copy of Windows installed on your computer is genuine, visit http://www.microsoft.com/genuine.

 

[Nick Bogaerts]

The XP version I have on CD is an upgrade. The laptop has an NTFS filesystem, so I can't load Win 98 then upgrade.
I need a full, installable version.

If you have a license for Win98, and a license for the upgrade from Win98 to WinXP, and you don't have it installed on another machine, then you don't need to buy yet another license.

 

[Kaylee]

I know of at least one company (tigerdirect.com) selling OSes at OEM prices (I think XP Pro is going for about $129) as long as you buy a piece of hardware that could/would normally be added to an XP machine.

Personally, for an alternate OS, I'd suggest Ubuntu (http://www.ubuntu.com/).

Thanks for that suggestion cgordon. I just saw this article and perhaps others will also find it useful:
InformationWeek's Ubuntu Vs. Vista

If I understand this article correctly -- the Home Vista edition will not allow one to backup an entire directory, which AFAIK essentially makes it impossible to create a recovery disk which indludes current data files and new programs that one invariably adds to their computer over time. I think this is one of the basic functions of an OS and I really resent that MS is making this a "feature" that only comes with one of the premium editions of Vista.


I'm replacing my computer soon and so far am considering partitioning my new system into three sections for:
Win XP Pro (my current OS)
Ubuntu or another Linux OS
Vista (Simply because I'm looking for a inexpensive laptop and expect that it will come preloaded.)

 

[Starthinker]

The XP version I have on CD is an upgrade. The laptop has an NTFS filesystem, so I can't load Win 98 then upgrade.
I need a full, installable version.

This has worked for me in the past: Start the install of WinXP Upgrade, when it asks where the Win98 files are just put in a Win98 startup disk. It then installs WinXP to the partition. It's just looking for proof you had 98, it doesn't necessarily use any Win98 files. This worked for me a few times way back when XP first came out.

OEM WinXP is supposed to come pre-installed on systems, selling it with a "piece of hardware" is false and perpetuated by the same people who think it's okay to download movies and not pay your taxes.

 

[Kaylee]

If you have a license for Win98, and a license for the upgrade from Win98 to WinXP, and you don't have it installed on another machine, then you don't need to buy yet another license.

I hope Soapy Sam won't mind my piggy backing onto his thread as I have a similar situation.

I personally find MS policies very confusing. I plan on buying a new laptop soon and expect that it will come preloaded with Vista. I also plan on partitioning the HD and loading my Win XP Pro OS into one of the partitions.

I have a copy of the Win XP Home Edtition from Toshiba as part of the recovery disks that came with my old laptop. I also have a copy of the Win XP Pro upgrade that I bought from a retail outlet.

The Toshiba disks came with a legal disclaimer that they are only to be used on the system that was sold to me and not on any other computer.
The disclaimer also says that it will not work on any other system. I don't expect that the drivers would, but I would of course expect that I should be able to install the OS on any other computer that I purchase and then download the drivers I needed from that manufacturer.

It seems there is this there is this expectation by MS and the manufacturers that my purchase of a software system has to be linked permanently to a hardware system, and I resent it. I agree that it should be illegal for me to make pirate copies, but if I decide to replace my laptop I should not be forced to also have to buy a duplicate eopy of an OS that I already paid for.

At any rate, when I get my new laptop, I intend to try to install Win XP Pro using my existing disks (ETA ) using the method Starthinker suggested.

 

[Smike]

The XP version I have on CD is an upgrade. The laptop has an NTFS filesystem, so I can't load Win 98 then upgrade.
I need a full, installable version.

Surely you could just change the filesystem?

 

[Wudang]

I have to disagree on this. Most software sold as OEM is in fact pirated. The OEM installation disks are designed to install on multiple different machines, so it is difficult to impossible for the vendor to determine whether any given OEM installation is legal.

As for attaching the license to any piece of hardware (as opposed to a brand new Dell laptop) I suppose it is theoretically possible to sell your software that way, but I doubt whether Microsoft licenses that.

I visited Microsoft, and I'm pretty sure that they do NOT sell OEM software for redistribution.

Completely wrong. OEM versions are restricted to a single motherboard. If you want to install on a second machine or replace your motherboard you're supposed to have to contact microsoft to plead with them.
See for example http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2087792,00.asp

 

[Kaylee]

Completely wrong. OEM versions are restricted to a single motherboard. If you want to install on a second machine or replace your motherboard you're supposed to have to contact microsoft to plead with them.
See for example http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2087792,00.asp

Interesting article Wudang. Some cuts and pastes:

One system builder pointed out, however, that Microsoft's OEM license forbids the software from being transferred to a whole new machine, from scratch, once it is installed on the original target machine.

<snip>

"One reader, who identified himself as a system builder in an email, said he felt that receiving an activation code was not the same as adhering to the terms of the OEM license.

"Even though you can phone an activation rep overseas to activate the software you're violating the EULA and committing piracy," said the builder, who posted a similar note in the discussion forums attached to this story.

It's important that people understand the OEM EULA when it says that your OEM Vista (XP is the same) can not be transferred to a new computer, and a new (upgraded) motherboard is also considered a new computer," the system builder added. "I've activated hundreds of PCs over the years and have never had an activation rep ask if I am transferring the OEM software to a new PC. The only question that you must answer correctly (no) in order to receive the activation code is: "Is this version of Windows on more than one PC?". Therefore the end user assumes that since they received an activation code they must be legal."

Emphasis mine.

It seems that MS realizes that its OEM license requirement is over the top and only enforces it to the extent that the user must have one license per machine (but not necessarily the original machine).

Even so, every year I personally find MS business practices to be more and more obnoxious and plan on learning how to use one of the Linux flavored OS systems.

ETA: It's really too heavy handed and overbearing for MS to dictate what hardware a user can and cannot replace. That is simply none of their business. I'm expecting them to eventually try to turn their operating system into a subscription service again, but this time across the board and not just for large corporations.

 

[Dragon]

Interesting thread - this computer I'm using now is a bit of a mish-mash formed a year or so ago following the demise of a motherboard about a year ago. I installed XP using the Upgrade Version plus an original ME CD (all properly purchased by me and only installed on this machine). I used the activation code I already had - no problems. I can't for the life of me see that this could be wrong.

 

[Soapy Sam]

If you have a license for Win98, and a license for the upgrade from Win98 to WinXP, and you don't have it installed on another machine, then you don't need to buy yet another license.

Not so sure.
98SE was the original OS on the old laptop, which I upgraded to XP. I'm quite happy to uninstall XP from that laptop, the days of which seem to be numbered, and revert to 98.
But if I attempt to install XP on the new harddrive, there are two problems-
First, what am I upgrading? There is no 98 on this harddrive.

and second-

Surely you could just change the filesystem?

Nope. Vista comes on an NTFS formatted drive. While Vista has the ability to partition a drive, it will only format a partition as NTFS. At least mine gives no other option.

What is rather intriguing is - where have all the copies of XP gone? Does microsoft recall and destroy them?

My Vista experience so far is less than happy. I will persevere with it, but unlike the upgrade to XP I have yet to find anything- one single thing- I find worth having over XP in terms of an OS. Yes, it handles partitions, but I had a utility for that. Many things have moved tonew locations, for no obvious reason.
A duo core processor with 2GB of Ram should run faster in virtually every application than an early athlon with 512MB. It doesn't.

 

[Beanbag]

I like the OEM versions of XP because they don't come with all that essential "crap" that manufacturers insist are necessary on your hard drive. No AOL offers, advertising, Quicken, Encarta, or MS Works (just to name a few).

Most of my systems are XP, most of them either HP or Compaq, with a few I threw together from parts. When I got an honest-to-Ed OEM system install disk, I reinstalled XP on every machine I had, using the authentication key that came with each machine originally. Each and every machine came up from bare metal just fine, called home to MS Mama, and authenticated itself just fine, and ran better because they didn't have all that garbage the system manufacturers threw in for good luck.

I'm lucky in a way. There's an electronics flea market the first Saturday of each month where I can get an honest OEM XP disk, plus matching authentication sticker with number for about $70 USD. Full version with SP2 installed. I suppose I should get another for when I build the next video editing system (Vista pretty much sucks for video work right now -- driver conflicts, editing software confused, different directory structures).

There's a program called WinKey out there that will read the authentication key from the registry, so if you can beg or borrow a set of OEM disks, you can re-install and activate for an existing system that you've lost the ID sticker for.

Beanbag

 

[voidx]

Microsofts OEM licensing is a little inconsistent, and understandably so. Essentially their trying to reduce piracy by making sure you're not using a license, which is only good for use on one physical machine, and not using that one license to run say 4 machines.

However, realizing that being overly strict on their activation requirements, which their not, would only cause headaches and backlash amongst their customers, you can seemingly activate most copy of Windows XP multiple times without it causing a fuss.

OEM is meant for system builders, or, to be provided to a customer purchasing parts and OS license from a single vendor to build their own PC. This last one is a little iffy though I'll admit.

However, at the end of the day, so long as you buy 1 piece of OEM rated hardware, and pay for an OEM license AND receive the Microsoft Certificate of Authenticity with that license and install media, you're essentially fine. The license is the certificate. Without it, you're not legit. And there are ways or places to call if you think your certificate is a fake, to have it verified.

 

[moopet]

OEM WinXP is supposed to come pre-installed on systems, selling it with a "piece of hardware" is false and perpetuated by the same people who think it's okay to download movies and not pay your taxes.

This is actually one of my pet peeves. One of my coworkers insists this is the case and sells people our OEM disks and forces them to buy some hardware to "make it legal" - usually a mouse or something they don't have any use for. And they lap it up, thinking they got a bargain. It's such a common misconception. I've pointed out the licence information that comes on the side of the OEM boxes to no avail.

 

[carlvs]

OEM WinXP is supposed to come pre-installed on systems, selling it with a "piece of hardware" is false and perpetuated by the same people who think it's okay to download movies and not pay your taxes.

Well then, perhaps you should inform Micro Center, NewEgg,ZipZoomFly, as well as the aforementioned TigerDirect that they are nothing but no-good pirates then (heck, I was even able to purchase a "System Builders" OEM version of Vista from Fry's a few months ago when I picked-up a new Hard Drive...)

Of course, these are all major companies that do a lot of business with the "PC Builder" community (i.e.: those who build their own systems.) If you're talking about some seedy storefront operation, however, then some caution is WELL advised (I recently had to fix a system from one of my father's friends which - among other problems - had a pirated version of XP installed by one such place...)

 

[MortFurd]

I have to disagree on this. Most software sold as OEM is in fact pirated. The OEM installation disks are designed to install on multiple different machines, so it is difficult to impossible for the vendor to determine whether any given OEM installation is legal.

As for attaching the license to any piece of hardware (as opposed to a brand new Dell laptop) I suppose it is theoretically possible to sell your software that way, but I doubt whether Microsoft licenses that.

I visited Microsoft, and I'm pretty sure that they do NOT sell OEM software for redistribution.

Different type of OEM.

The description above is accurate. You can buy (in Europe, don't know about US) a CD with unique number (the sticker with the license number on it) from a number of above-board legal places.
Here's where I buy software. They list Windows XP Home (in German) for 74 Euro. English will cost you 5EUR more.

As mentioned above, this is software that is intended to be bought and used on a PC that will be supported by whoever sold you the system. Like this:

I buy parts and build a PC. I also buy a system builder version (the OEM version being discussed here) and install that on the PC. I sell you that PC and copy of Windows. You get the computer, the CD, and the license sticker. You also get your support from ME, not Microsoft.

I can also put together a frankenstein monster PC out of parts I have laying around the house, and buy a system builder copy of Windows XP to install on it. I get no support from MS, but then I don't need it. I built the crappy thing, so it's my problem to make sure it runs.

On the other hand, I'm much more likely to buy a copy of some Linux system and use it on all my PCs. Right now, I've got SuSE 8.2, 9.2, and 10.2 on various systems in my house. I'm moving them all to 10.2 one at a time. It's got pretty much all the software I need (and whatever else I need is available for free) and it's got eye candy that makes Vista look pathetic - and that eye candy runs on old hardware.

 

[stormer]

MS Windows

Everyone here is somewhat right on the licensing terms for OEM software, but not entirely. That's because MS has different licensing terms for OEM software, as well as different types of OEM software.

My company is registered as a system builder with MS. I can buy OEM Windows XP from a distributor and install it onto my customer's pc when I sell it to them. I must install the software using the OEM preload method, and the customer must have the Out Of Box Experience when they turn on the pc for the first time. If they do not buy an entire pc, then there are qualifying products, which are a hard disk or a mainboard.

Should this pc catch fire, the customer may transfer this license to another unit, as long as the entire package is transferred, ie the CD, the booklet and the Certificate of Authenticity (COA)

This is an open OEM license, and generally costs about US$130 in this country.

There is a closed OEM license also. These are the OEM licences that are sold to vendors like Dell, HP, etc. In the licensing terms, the customer is not allowed to transfer the COA to another pc except to hardware from the same vendor. In other words, if my Dell pc caught fire, I could buy another Dell pc without windows, and install the previous software on it.

Although the terms of the closed OEM license says NO to installing to other hardware, MS so far has not rejected, say a Dell COA to a HP pc transfer.

There is also a Volume Licence OEM. These Windows XPs are popularly known as "Corporate editions", where one license key can be used for multiple installs. This is usually the type of software that is counterfeited - a counterfeit CD, COA and booklet is sold to you. It will activate, but it will not validate for windows updates. Example

Support for all the above is from the vendor.

There are Windows upgrade packs. The license is only valid if you upgrade from a qualifying software product, and you must have that product for the license to be valid. So, if you get Windows XP upgrade from Windows 98, then you must have both Win 98 with you (but not installed anywhere), as well as Win XP upgrade COA. You can transfer the license, as long as terms for both the products are kept. There are no OEM upgrade packs.

Finally, there is the retail version of Windows. Comes in a box, manual, etc. Expensive, but you can buy it without a qualifying product, and you may transfer the license any time and to any hardware. Support is from MS.

An open OEM key is interchangable with a closed OEM key and vice versa, but they are not interchangable with a VL OEM, nor with a Retail key.

All basic versions of windows are the same. How they behave and the license key they accept is determined by the contents of "setupp.ini" in the i386 folder of the install CD. Of course a vendor may install other software and customise the OOBE.

Hope this helps.

 

[Soapy Sam]

It does. Thanks.