Corrupt Police Frame David Bain? A NZ CT?

PhantomWolf

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Okay so most people on the forum won't have any idea to this, but the case is major headline news over here (NZ) again.

The basics are that David Bain was convicted of murdering 5 members of his family and has been in Jail for the last 12 years. His case was heard in the Privy Council in England last week and his convictions were set aside and a new trial suggested. He was released on bail yesterday,

This is a page with information about the case.

Okay so to the theory.

Recent events have come to light about the Dunedin Police and their behaviour in the 80's and 90's, including allegations of them frequenting the brothel where Laniet worked. Since Protitution was illegal at the time, it seems that they were able to force the workers to give them free sex. It is also claimed that Laniet kept a black book with her client's names in it, though this was apparently never found.

The theory goes that with a number of the CIB officers having been involved in the above practice and particularly Laniet, that their names were in that book. It was reasoned by them that should the more likely reason for the murders, Robin's abuse of Laniet and her going to come clean about it, surfaced, that her life would become a major aspect of the investigation, including her clients and thus their own involvement in the pressuring of prositutes to give them free sex. Face with such a scandel, they conspired to fabricate and hide evidence in such a way that the finger of guilt would be pointed at David and he'd be the scapegoat while they made Robin look like a saint so as to prevent the truth of Laniet's abuse and prostitution from ever coming to light.
 
I saw this on the news yesterday (im in South Australia)....is there to be an investigation into the case being done now by anti corruption officers?
 
It was illegal at the time? Heck why didn't the cops just say they were conducting an investigation and had to "go all the way" to prove guilt? It worked great over here.:D
 
Hrm... it's an interesting angle.

It is really quite a weird case. I only have one question, why keep David alive?

Oh, and was she actually a prostitute? I have heard this whispered, but never really seen if there's actually any evidence to support it.

-Gumboot
 
Okay so most people on the forum won't have any idea to this, but the case is major headline news over here (NZ) again.

The basics are that David Bain was convicted of murdering 5 members of his family and has been in Jail for the last 12 years. His case was heard in the Privy Council in England last week and his convictions were set aside and a new trial suggested. He was released on bail yesterday,

This is a page with information about the case.

Okay so to the theory.

Recent events have come to light about the Dunedin Police and their behaviour in the 80's and 90's, including allegations of them frequenting the brothel where Laniet worked. Since Protitution was illegal at the time, it seems that they were able to force the workers to give them free sex. It is also claimed that Laniet kept a black book with her client's names in it, though this was apparently never found.

The theory goes that with a number of the CIB officers having been involved in the above practice and particularly Laniet, that their names were in that book. It was reasoned by them that should the more likely reason for the murders, Robin's abuse of Laniet and her going to come clean about it, surfaced, that her life would become a major aspect of the investigation, including her clients and thus their own involvement in the pressuring of prositutes to give them free sex. Face with such a scandel, they conspired to fabricate and hide evidence in such a way that the finger of guilt would be pointed at David and he'd be the scapegoat while they made Robin look like a saint so as to prevent the truth of Laniet's abuse and prostitution from ever coming to light.

As it went to the Privy Council recently, presumably there were previous NZ appellate court decisions before that, no? I would like to see the NZ appellate court decisions and the Privy Council decision, if you have links to them. It is always prudent to know the legal basis for judicial decisions before forming an opinion about them.

There is no conspiracy. Don't buy into the woo. Whatever the government says happened, trust it.

Don't be silly. There is certainly no shortage of wrongful convictions all over the world, nor is there any shortage of "government" errors, deliberate and otherwise.
 
As it went to the Privy Council recently, presumably there were previous NZ appellate court decisions before that, no? I would like to see the NZ appellate court decisions and the Privy Council decision, if you have links to them. It is always prudent to know the legal basis for judicial decisions before forming an opinion about them.

I can't find anything from the New Zealand Court of Appeal online, however the Privy Council judgement is in .doc format here (No.33 David Cullen Bain Vs The Queen) and this includes summaries of the initial trial as well as the appeals.

-Gumboot
 
Hrm... it's an interesting angle.

It is really quite a weird case. I only have one question, why keep David alive?

Oh, and was she actually a prostitute? I have heard this whispered, but never really seen if there's actually any evidence to support it.

-Gumboot

From the Crime.co.nz site I linked to with an outline of the case

Eighteen-year-old Laniet was regarded by her mother as most like herself. Though portraying the happy child image to some, she was a confused adolescent. Laniet's crying out for help seems to have been manifested in her stories of having borne a chil, of a suicide attempt and of being an incest victim.

It was displayed by her leaving the family a year before her death, taking drugs and becoming a prostitute. She was a sad girl who somehow lost the opportunity to experience happiness.
 
Just an interesting "coincidence."

Wayne Idour seems to have been heavily involved with the police sex scandel in some way (see the Police Corruption article) and was also involved in the (mis)handling of the Dean Cottle where Idour claims to have given Cottle a subpoena to testify and Cottle says that he never got it and instead had to ring the police, where he was told he wasn't needed.

I'm not saying that this is fishy, but it certainly would be enough for your average CT to make the link and convict, lol.
 
It was illegal at the time?

Prostitution was decrimalised in NZ in 2003 with the Prostitution Reformation Act.

Heck why didn't the cops just say they were conducting an investigation and had to "go all the way" to prove guilt? It worked great over here.:D

Apparently they were getting freebies in return for not arresting them and closing them down. Going all the way to prove guilt then arresting them would have removed the ability to use their services.
 
I can't find anything from the New Zealand Court of Appeal online, however the Privy Council judgement is in .doc format here (No.33 David Cullen Bain Vs The Queen) and this includes summaries of the initial trial as well as the appeals.

-Gumboot


Thank you, both. I have downloaded and saved the linked docs and will read them, hopefully tomorrow as it is 0025 here so I won't be able to get through them tonight, but I have a keen interest in wrongful convictions so I will be sure to give them the attention they deserve.
 
Apparently they were getting freebies in return for not arresting them and closing them down. Going all the way to prove guilt then arresting them would have removed the ability to use their services.

Well what they were doing in Virginia and North Carolina (and most likely all other states with illegal brothels) was using tax payer money in the sting, arresting them when people started questioning where the money went, arresting the girls, making them pay the fines/bail to put the tax payer money back, **The following is second hand info that I got from reliable sources (Two high school buddies who became cops and a college buddy who at the time was a public defender) never the less said sources/buddies would joke about this so insert grain of salt here.*** then "deporting all who were not American citizens", (In other words sending them to other cities) then starting over.

BAD COP! No doughnut!
 
I hadn't actually read the entire Privy Council judgement previously, but have now. It was quite an interesting read.

The matter is of some specific interest to New Zealand, in that 5 appeals to the Privy council have been judged in favour of the appellant in the last 6 years. Given that appeals to this level are rare, and that New Zealand is a small country with a low crime rate, I see this as alarming.

Other potential upcoming cases of a miscarriage of justice (the case of Peter Ellis springs to mind) simply underline my concerns.

The main concern being, New Zealand has removed the Privy Council from our Judiciary, replacing it with a solely New Zealand Supreme Court.

Anyway...

Certainly the conspiracy theory proposed has more weight than any 9/11 CT, and indeed, there is evidence supporting this CT, however circumstantial. For example the misrepresentation of an expert witness' opinion, the events previously described regarding Mr Cottle, non-disclosure that a key witness had given additional testimony, and the police Detective's incorrect testimony at trial as to the location of the lens from the glasses.

These all specifically involve the police investigating team hindering a fair trial. The question is whether this hindrance was a result of honest mistakes, incompetence, or malice.

-Gumboot
 
Well what they were doing in Virginia and North Carolina (and most likely all other states with illegal brothels) was using tax payer money in the sting, arresting them when people started questioning where the money went, arresting the girls, making them pay the fines/bail to put the tax payer money back, **The following is second hand info that I got from reliable sources (Two high school buddies who became cops and a college buddy who at the time was a public defender) never the less said sources/buddies would joke about this so insert grain of salt here.*** then "deporting all who were not American citizens", (In other words sending them to other cities) then starting over.

BAD COP! No doughnut!

Wow, conspiracies DO exist after all!

Did these bad cops get busted?
 
Wow, conspiracies DO exist after all!

Did these bad cops get busted?

Nope. Not that I know of. (And yes, conspiracies do exist!)

"The minute God crapped out the third caveman a conspiricy was born against one of them!"

~Hunter
 
The local (Sydney) News ran with this last night. Rather than the prostitute angle they claimed there was evidence the father suffered depression and was about to be revealed as a sex offender with his daughter
 
The local (Sydney) News ran with this last night. Rather than the prostitute angle they claimed there was evidence the father suffered depression and was about to be revealed as a sex offender with his daughter


Yes these were two of the 9 key pieces of evidence presented to the Privy Council.

All of the victims were shot once except for the daughter who was about to come clean about the incest - she was shot three times.

-Gumboot
 

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