Attempted' copyright infringement

asmodean

Turing Complete
asmodean
Joined
May 23, 2005
Messages
797
Just saw this on Another Board(tm):
http://news.com.com/8301-10784_3-9719339-7.html

Is this for real? More wiretaps, easier to seize computer equipment, longer penalties (1-10 yrs not enough), and for "attempted" or "intended" copyright infringment, alerting homeland security if pirate music or movies are found?

Sounds like a bad joke to me. Or is it just a ruse to take heat away from other issues?
 
asmodean said:
Just saw this on Another Board(tm):
http://news.com.com/8301-10784_3-9719339-7.html

Is this for real? More wiretaps, easier to seize computer equipment, longer penalties (1-10 yrs not enough), and for "attempted" or "intended" copyright infringment, alerting homeland security if pirate music or movies are found?

Sounds like a bad joke to me. Or is it just a ruse to take heat away from other issues?
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Criminalize "attempting" to infringe copyright. Federal law currently punishes not-for-profit copyright infringement with between 1 and 10 years in prison, but there has to be actual infringement that takes place. The IPPA would eliminate that requirement. (The Justice Department's summary of the legislation says: "It is a general tenet of the criminal law that those who attempt to commit a crime but do not complete it are as morally culpable as those who succeed in doing so.")
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So, if I am on a P2P share service and attempt to download a copy of Spiderman 3 that some guy recorded with a camcorder hidden in his jacket, I can get busted even if all I really get is a recording of someone's wedding video.
* Create a new crime of life imprisonment for using pirated software. Anyone using counterfeit products who "recklessly causes or attempts to cause death" can be imprisoned for life. During a conference call, Justice Department officials gave the example of a hospital using pirated software instead of paying for it.
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Now that is a stretch.
 
rtalman said:
So, if I am on a P2P share service and attempt to download a copy of Spiderman 3 that some guy recorded with a camcorder hidden in his jacket, I can get busted even if all I really get is a recording of someone's wedding video.
Click to expand...

A lot of that article is a real stretch, if not downright disturbing, but I don't have a problem with this one. It's consistent with the way other laws are enforced. If you're busted trying to buy drugs from a cop, it's still a crime even if they weren't real drugs. If you try to pay an undercover officer for sex, it's still a crime even though she's not a real prostitute.

Now that is a stretch.
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Yeah, now that one made no sense to me at all. I think it may be a case of exaggeration by the blog reporting on it, actually.
 
toddjh said:
A lot of that article is a real stretch, if not downright disturbing, but I don't have a problem with this one. It's consistent with the way other laws are enforced. If you're busted trying to buy drugs from a cop, it's still a crime even if they weren't real drugs. If you try to pay an undercover officer for sex, it's still a crime even though she's not a real prostitute.
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True, if the transaction is with a police officer. If said police officer nabs you making an apparent MJ buy from a third party, you cannot be charged for a drug offense if all that is in the baggie is oregano.
 
I'm really happy that we've won the war on drugs, and the one on terror, and solved all the rapes, kidnappings, and murders in the country, that our beloved Attorney General has time for this insanity.

Is there a precedent for trying officials criminally for wasting the public's time and money?
 
TragicMonkey said:
I'm really happy that we've won the war on drugs, and the one on terror, and solved all the rapes, kidnappings, and murders in the country, that our beloved Attorney General has time for this insanity.

Is there a precedent for trying officials criminally for wasting the public's time and money?
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Unfortunately I think we'd be hard pressed to find anyone willing to take on "Big Media" and do something pro-active like that.
 
Attorney General Alberto Gonzales is pressing the U.S. Congress to enact a sweeping intellectual-property bill that would increase criminal penalties for copyright infringement, including "attempts" to commit piracy.
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Including "attempts"?

George Orwell called this Thoughtcrime, if I remember correctly.
 
I dunno.... The law allows for attempted rape, attempted kidnapping, attempted murder, doesn't it?

I think I need much more context. If I'm trying to DL Pirates 3 (hee! pirating Pirates), and the company stops me, or some authoritative 3rd party, I think I'm absolutely guilty of attempted piracy. I just got busted before I could finish.

But if I start the DL and then change my mind and terminate it, I don't...I can't really say I committed a crime. Can I?

I want to kill my neighbor. I grab a weapon. I leave my house with the weapon and the intent to kill. I walk up the street. I enter his grounds. I step onto his porch. I enter his house. I confront my neighbor. I aim my weapon, or otherwise threaten him with it.

Provided I don't kill him, that I change my mind, at what step in that process did I commit attempted murder? Did I miss a step? Should I have included striking him, but not killing him?

Considering it, I feel I've not committed attempted murder until I actually enter his house. Up until that point, I can turn around and go home with no one likely the wiser.

Hmmm. So.....if I simply enter the "house" where the download resides, with the intent to download, have I committed attempted piracy? Or is my analogy too dissimilar for comparison? If so, what's a better one?
 
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rtalman said:
Now that is a stretch.
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Well yes because the relivant section isn't really talking about software so that would be a bit of an edge case. The section is meant to deal with cases such as:
For example, a counterfeit pharmaceutical may be ineffective or harmful, or a substandard electrical cord bearing a counterfeit UL certification mark may pose a fire hazard.
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see

http://politechbot.com/docs/doj.intellectual.property.protection.act.2007.051407.pdf

page 6

However as computers control more and more stuff such as say pharmaceutical manufactoring lines the risks of faulty software do increase.
 
Criminalize "attempting" to infringe copyright.

Yep first section of the bill. Untill there was some case law it would be pretty much imposible to predict what this would mean (interestingly it doesn't appear to be targeted at DRM circumvention which is what I originaly assumed they were getting at).

Create a new crime of life imprisonment for using pirated software

True but it doesn't apear to be really aimed at software.

Permit more wiretaps for piracy investigations

Yup.

Allow computers to be seized more readily.

Maybe. The word "harmonise" is used a lot in this section so quite probably

Increase penalties for violating the Digital Millennium Copyright Act's anticircumvention regulations

Eh the section about this is written in messy legalise but I think the provisions are a bit wider than the article suggests

Oh and the whole thing appears to have rather a lot in common with the proposed Intellectual Property Protection Act of 2006.
 
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Life in prison for a pirated $16 DVD?

Can we say "Cruel and Unusual Punishment" ?
 
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