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Imus be an idiot . . .

Imus was fired. I could care less. Those whining that he was fired can go find their own cheese.
 
hgc said:
Hi Randfan, I wish you were around yesterday.

Here's my take on this argument: Imus' employability is based directly on the money advertisers provide, and only indirectly on ratings. Advertisers don't like controversy, and Imus is the one that lit this controversy. If Sharpton inflamed it, then I don't consider that my problem. I don't care for either one of them, but I certainly think that Sharpton has just as much a right to make a public stink about Imus as Imus does to do whatever it is he is doing in public to get this thing going in the first place. And when I say "every right," I don't mean just in the legal sense, which is obvious anyway, but in any political-moral sense too.

Why do I have to wait for ratings to find out who has pull? I don't care who has pull. I don't have any way to know in this case who's the "majority" or who's the "minority." What matters is that Imus' real employers, the advertisers on his shows, decided that he was bad for business. If anyone doesn't like the way that Sharpton made that happen, if indeed he did, I don't see why. Did he lie? Did he cheat? Not that I know of. He gave his opinion, and vociferously. Sure a lot of people, including myself, don't agree with that opinion in whole or in part. But his right to air it is not inferior to Imus' rights.
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Hi Hgc,

I really appreciate your tone. I think we have much common ground. I agree with a lot of what you are saying.

Here is the problem. In the early days following the Duke case emotions were riding high and a mob gathered and they wanted a pound of flesh. The mob didn't want to think or act rationally. They wanted to act as a group and extract vengeance.

This is my problem. These boycotts are often emotional and lack any objectivity. They viscerally destroy lives to placate our outrage. In the end they send a chilling wind to those who would think to speak out and invite such ire.

What can be said? Do you know? People have been fired for saying innocent things. Andy Rooney, a man who marched with civil rights workers was branded a racist for making a sincere statement. I don't like that.

The Sharptons of this world have far too much power to inflame passions to make effect political outcomes that have a real negative effect.
 
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RandFan said:
By "ilk" I was talking about demogauges and liars who play on emotions for political and financial purposes.

?

Sorry Mephisto, I'm not sure I can even take you seriously.

The BS in the Duram case almost put three innocent men in jail for life.

Who would lead a counter protest against the potbangers in the early days of the mob frenzy? No one.

That's the problem. Idiots like Sharpton know how to ride the wave. Let's not forget that Jessie Jackson tride to ride the wave of the Duke case early on.

Same damn thing.

Your argument just does not wash with reality.
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It is really quite simple.

A black woman accuses three white teenagers of rape, and she is assumed to be truthful and honest. A witch hunt ensues. The facts come out that her facts weren't straight. A decade ago, witch hunting was ruled wrong in the US military, by Congress, in the "don't ask don't tell" policy (or sorta policy) but since the Duke dudes weren't in the military, such protection does not apply. Sucks to be them.

Mr Imus cracks an offensive joke about teenaged and early twenties, black women. Since he was once a Marine, grew up on a farm, and is a generally non perfect demographic sample, he is assumed a newly discovered Klansman, even though he made CBS and others a load of dough for over a decade or more by being a prick, and even though he endorsed Al Gore for President.

All of a sudden, he is a pariah.

No double standard, sure, and Jesse Jackson offers to send the only actual ho involved to college. At least Jesse is consistent: he is a political whore, and he takes care of his own. The rest of them do not share his being true to his own personal values. They don't have his moral frame of reference.

America: is this a great country or what?

DR
 
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thaiboxerken said:
Imus was fired. I could care less. Those whining that he was fired can go find their own cheese.
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I'm assuming you mean you couldn't care less. That being said, the issue isn't really about Imus. It is about the hypocrisy which is so pervasive in our society and misplaced hysteria.
 
What hysteria? Some people complained, sponsors pulled their ads and Imus was fired because of it.
 
thaiboxerken said:
What hysteria? Some people complained, sponsors pulled their ads and Imus was fired because of it.
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Well, the hysteria of Sharpton and a few others that are getting incredibly inflamed over this issue...

I won't deny that there are some crazies out there. My U.S. Government instructor said that Sharpton should be sued for every penny he had, for Defamation of Character. He also seemed quite ignorant as to the whole Imus issue, so... I dunno, really.
 
thaiboxerken said:
What hysteria? Some people complained, sponsors pulled their ads and Imus was fired because of it.
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"scarred for life"? Round the clock coverage? Sharpton whining on many if not most major news shows?

Why are you here? I thought you could "care less"?

This thread isn't really about people who don't care about the thread. Go away.
 
RandFan said:
"scarred for life"? Round the clock coverage? Sharpton whining on many if not most major news shows?
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Meh, I'm not watching the television, and really it sounds like I'm better off.

I do agree that this is getting a bit out of hand.
 
Lonewulf said:
Meh, I'm not watching the television, and really it sounds like I'm better off.

I do agree that this is getting a bit out of hand.
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Yeah, and I fear I've gotten myself too far into these stupid threads.

It will all blow over in a few weeks. :)
 
if CBS wants to fire him, they can. This man made a LOT of money for himself and a lot of others.

Now he's a liability. No one is going to want to sponsor him any more than most universities want the Bushling library.

In a way it shows what rules not just in the US, but in much of the world. You may think you can get away with anything, but when money is involved all bets are off.
 
GroundStrength said:
How so if it is not true?

Why would this matter if it is not true?

How so? Someone calls you a "sh#t-eater", it should be obvious to your friends and co-workers that you are or are not.
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To me it's pretty simple. I am offended because you disrespect me enough to call me names. It doesn't matter if the names fit me or not. You were disrespectful to me, and I find you were being offensive.

Think about the word for a moment. Offense...what's it mean in sports, in battle? It means to be aggressive, to push forward, to attempt to score a victory over your opponent. For you to subject me to name-calling, true or not, is a form of attack: a verbal attack. You are on the offensive, and I find myself having been offended by your act.



To others why would you care?
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Speaking only for myself, I care because of the hostility being shown by the name-calling. Someone is trying to attack me--the method hardly matters.

How does the measure of the speaker's cruelty measure against the truth of a statement?
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You see no cruelty in calling people names? That's a kind, mature gesture in your opinion? Come on.

You are or you are not a thing.
If I am called a "bad-father" I do not take offense, because I am not.
If I am called fat I do because I am (slightly).
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Doesn't matter what words are used. The fact you're being attacked and disrespected is the offensive part.

Arguements do not change truth.
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That's a strawman argument. You can tell because the answer to a statement like yours almost always begins: "I never said."

Ahem.

I never said arguments change truth. I said the fact that we appear to have differing versions of truth, equally true to each of us but not to the other, reveals the frequently subjective nature of truth.

Absolute truths are few, and far between. Even science rarely claims to know absolute truths.

Good, because I truly mean none.
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Aw! Seriously, that was really nice of you. Thanks. :)
 
I've never liked Don Imus. Never thought he was really that funny or thought provoking in any way. I also despise racism. It really drives me up the wall. I simply have no patience for it.

That being said, what Don Imus said was not racist. He was parroting black culture. While this was completely inappropriate and still fairly offensive, the only people he should have appologized to are the Rutgers Women's Basketball team, which truly didn't deserve the comment.

However, if we really want to start firing people for parroting black culture, why not start with the Wayans Brothers? Or maybe Eddie Griffin? Or Mike Meyers? Just about anything by this man? How about the Wayans Brothers again?

Sharpton and Jackson need to find something more productive to do with their time. I don't think firing Don Imus is really making a positive impact on the African American community. I also don't believe it's helping to stamp out racisim in any way, shape, or form. Finally, I believe the African American community deserve better than a crutch and a pat on the back for percieved signs of inequity from the likes of Sharpton and Jackson. IMO, as always.
 
bob_kark said:
I've never liked Don Imus. Never thought he was really that funny or thought provoking in any way. I also despise racism. It really drives me up the wall. I simply have no patience for it.
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Agreed.

That being said, what Don Imus said was not racist. He was parroting black culture.
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He was parroting black culture? Really? I was not under that impression.

While this was completely inappropriate and still fairly offensive, the only people he should have appologized to are the Rutgers Women's Basketball team, which truly didn't deserve the comment.
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Agreed.

However, if we really want to start firing people for parroting black culture, why not start with the Wayans Brothers? Or maybe Eddie Griffin? Or Mike Meyers? Just about anything by this man? How about the Wayans Brothers again?
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Who's "we"? I'm not firing anyone, MSNBC fired him. They could easily have chosen not to. It was all up to them; there was no force behind it.

Sure, there was some boycott that Al Sharpton came up with, but a boycott is only effective in one of two conditions:

1) There is enough in the boycott for the company to risk losing massive amounts of profit.

2) The boycott seems to be far more effective than it really is.

It seems to be 2, in this case. The company (and more specifically their investors) perceived a feint, took it as a direct and deadly attack, responded, and Don Imus got fired for it.

Though I agree with Randfan that emotions were overly charged in this situation, and Al Sharpton attempted to charge them even more. Regardless, if I put blame anywhere, it's on MSNBC and their investors, notably the latter. They chickened out and weren't willing to stand behind their man.

However, if the people that hired any of those people that you just mentioned decided to fire them, then I support their right to.

Sharpton and Jackson need to find something more productive to do with their time. I don't think firing Don Imus is really making a positive impact on the African American community.
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This is a good point.
 
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