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Has Anyone Seen A Realistice Explanation For Free Fall Of The Towers?

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Wrong again. That's not what the blueprints show that I link to. One central hallway with elevator access. Access also on the outside core.

You're done.

You know what's funny Chris? You've failed to convince ANYONE of your theories. I've read many of the other forums and you have nobody but yourself on your side. Nobody is taking your side. You're alone on this.

That's proof in itself that your "evidence" stinks.

Keep posting your three pictures. As the past dictates, they'll convert nobody and you'll still be by yourself with your own beliefs.

The blueprints you are using are absolete and it is well known that FEMA never accessed the real ones.

http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/blueprints.html

The NYC mayor took the cities WTC documents and put thim in his warehouse and courts will not force their return.

http://www.nyclu.org/g_archive020602.html
 
We have not seen any image of the ground floor which shows direct elevator access through the outside of the core wall despite what smith says.

WTC 2 had 2 hallways in each direction and they were quite which could create the "lobby feel" and give the impressson that elevators were accessed from outside core walls when in fact the elevators were accessed from inside the core only.

Video from the tom hanks movie was posted which shows exactly how I entered the elevators from outside the core

The blue prints scanned were not used for construction. Look at the date. Also note the steel columned core is not detailed in any way. It was never designed, only conceived and the elevator access possible with it was not possible with a concrete core.

I never entered any hallway. standing at the elevator door and exiting you only had to look up to see the the perimeter column trees and widows to the outside over the setback mezzanine above. Sadly i took very few pictures as I thought the trade center would be there as long as i lived. In fact I thought it silly when my wife took a picture of me standing under the doors on the east side to the escalators which went to the shopping concourse below under the trade center sign. I also have a few pictures taken from windows on the world but they are only prints which need to be scanned.
 
How the hell is this thread still alive?

Chris, did you ever get a reply from Beverly Ballin Smith or Denys Pringle?
 
My Point Is There Is Only 25 Feet Between The Core And Perimeter

Video from the tom hanks movie was posted which shows exactly how I entered the elevators from outside the core

I explain what is seen in the movie here. There is no shot showing that.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=2308814#post2308814

I never entered any hallway. standing at the elevator door and exiting you only had to look up to see the the perimeter column trees and widows to the outside over the setback mezzanine above.

Excuse me, "you only had to look up". You would have to turn around also.

The Hanks movie does NOT show people going in and out of elevators on the core face. At 4:08 a segment starts that is as close as it gets to what you are saying and the people appear to be coming and entering a hallway on the long side of the WTC 2 core which had 2 hallways in each direction. The last of the video shows they are in tower 2.

At 4:58 a few seconds where people are standing in front of a stainless relieved area does not show them going in or others coming out.

MY POINT IS THERE IS ONLY 25 FEET BETWEEN THE CORE AND PERIMETER
 
I hang my head in shame. I'm sorry, Chris: I really thought you were going to listen to all this new stuff from someone who really visited the WTC.

Instead, you just tell him he's a liar. I thought even you were beyond that knee-jerk reacton.

I'm sorry I ever thought you would listen to reason.

I also apologise to all those who demanded that this thread be killed: you were right.

Chris, I'm not quitting because you have conviced me of your delusion: I want to make that clear. I am not a member of the U.S. Government, the New World Order or the Secret Service. I am not even a U.S. citizen. I have no vested interest in keeping secret the supposed U.S. government conspiracy to kill 3,000 innocent people in order to justify a was that was going to happen anyway.

The ONE THING I wanted you to offer was a sensible reason for why the Port Authority or whoever decided in THE MID-SIXTIES that it was a good idea to line the buildings with C-4 so they could blow it up thirty years later.

You have never answered that, and I see you never, ever will. There IS no answer to that: it's a ridiculous premise.

I will continue to follow this thread in the vain hope that reason will prevail: however, this is my last post here.

Vale, Christophera. I promise you I don't hate you; I hope you find peace and tranquility in your life: you need it. If you are prepared to believe that I (as a non-U.S. citizen) am not complicit in a vast U.S. goverment plan to deceive the shocked American people, them please give me a P.M.
 
Chris all you have to do is count the exterior column trees which are tridents at the top with the forks 40" o/c. That makes 40"X3=10' o/c including the space between them. Notice there are 6 of them in the hanks long shot. Sorry chris that equals 60 feet to the core from the exterior wall. Fine if you think I am lying. I have no need to. I was there. I rode the elevators. Being as I have been in the construction industry all my adult life I tend to notice details. Sorry you don't believe me.
 
Sounds like someone is purposly avoiding the facts.

Your a lost cause Chris. The video clearly shows people entering and exiting the elevators from the lobby.

Your pathetic. You've lost. You are lost.

You must cite the exact time you think you see this in the video or your words are empty.
 
Chis look for the items I pointed out in the pictures below in the reflections on the elevator doors in the video above posted by Bonavada.

Face it Chris, You're wrong.
 

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Different Features Reflected-Wrong Point-No Changing Subject

Chis look for the items I pointed out in the pictures below in the reflections on the elevator doors in the video above posted by Bonavada.

Face it Chris, You're wrong.

The features reflected in the doors of the video are different.

The point you are trying to make you are not making. Smiths recall is not supported by images.

Your efforts to change the subject fail.

The point is that there is a 25 foot wide lobby on the narrow end of the core as shown in this image.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/wtc/images/wtc_19aug2000_lobby.jpg

Not only do efforts to change the subject fail, no one in nearly 11,000 posts has ever provided a logical explanation for what this is, if it is NOT concrete.

 
Not only do efforts to change the subject fail, no one in nearly 11,000 posts has ever provided a logical explanation for what this is, if it is NOT concrete.


Of course they have. It's the remnants of the steel framed core, choked with debris and dust, momentarily suspended in mid-collapse. Since the core columns were pressed upon by thousands of tons of falling buildings, all exposed core beams snapped and fell away, probably at their welds - known to any in construction as the weakes part of such a structure. What remains in this picture is, most likely, a portion of the steel framed support, as shown in all construction photos, with probably 20-40 feet of debris piled atop it - resulting in a rounded-edged flat shape at the top - and smoke and debris filling the spaces within; indeed, and with heavy smoke/dust all around it, washing out all observable details, further determination of what this is becomes nearly impossible. What it cannot be is, it cannot be concrete. Why? Because there are no photographs, videos, or other references detailing the use of concrete as a core construction material in existence anywhere. Because concrete on rebar, when the rebar is mounted on some kind of plastic coating, defeats the purpose of the rebar. Because a concrete core would have to be so thick at the base, it would take up enormous amounts of office space - which visitors to the towers have never seen. Instead, they describe open space, and a smaller core area, than Chris needs to have existed.

And it certainly cannot be C-4-coated rebar in side of concrete. Why not? C-4 could not have been used, as it has a shelf life, in sealed containers at optimal temperatures, of just 10 years. Inside of curing concrete, the combination of heat, moisture, and air would drastically reduce that lifespan - DRASTICALLY. C-4 in slurry form is non-explosive. C-4 coating the rebar would defeat the purpose of the rebar. A building experiencing swaying of even a few feet, with rebar coated in some sort of plastic/rubber substance, would flex far too much, allowing the concrete to crack and split. The concrete would have to be poured over the rebar directly, for the rebar to have the necessary reinforcing capacity. Otherwise, all you've done is created flaws in the concrete; flaws which, in any stress, would result in the total failure of the concrete.

This description - of the building core with mounds of debris atop it, choked with dust, smoke, and debris - momentarily standing during the total structural collapse, is completely logical and rational, and further, is consistant with the observable evidence which shows the building to be constructed with a steel core, rather than with concrete.

Sorry, Chris, but it IS a logical explanation. It is COMPLETELY logical, rational, and reasonable. It is also supported by the evidence at hand.

What is NOT logical is that this mound is concrete with C-4 coated rebar, which somehow failed to detonate during the initial demolition. What is NOT logical is C-4 surviving for more than twice its optimal shelf life while being exposed to air, moisture, and temperature ranges beyond its capacity to maintain its chemical consistancy. What is NOT logical is attempting to determined what happened, using low-resolution pictures taken a significant distance from the event, during the event, and making claims which are in direct conflict with all available evidence. What is NOT logical is clinging to a documentary which never existed, a book which never existed, a magazine article which never existed, and some speculative ponderings on construction and architecture based upon a layman/ditch-digger's level of knowledge. That's an awful lot like a local mechanic speculating about how the engines on the Mars Rover work. Worse... like the guy next door who's tinkering with his engine - but has no mechanics training whatsoever - speculating about the Mars Rover. At least the mechanic finished some kind of school.

I have tried hard not posting in this thread, because I do agree that it accomplishes nothing; but this repeated claim that 'no one...has ever provided a logical explanation for what this is, if it is NOT concrete' is simply a lie. A lie.

This statement is a LIE, Christopher.

It's time for the lies to stop, Christopher. If you cannot back your statements with clear, actual, real, tangible evidence, you should retract them.

Shall we start with this one? Obviously, a logical explanation for what that is has been provided - repeated.

Or shall we start with your lie about the PBS documentary? The one that doesn't exist in archives of TV Guide, of PBS's video records, or anywhere else?

Or the lie about C-4? Or the lie about the Oxford publication that Oxford never published?

When do the lies end, Chris?

Ignorance can be forgiven. Stupidity can be looked beyond. But this is simply lying.

Either back your apparent lies with actual evidence, or retract them. It's that simple.
 
Not only do efforts to change the subject fail, no one in nearly 11,000 posts has ever provided a logical explanation for what this is, if it is NOT concrete.



Of course they have. It's the remnants of the steel framed core, choked with debris and dust, momentarily suspended in mid-collapse.

Easily said.

I noticed you posted no corroborative evidence or images from the towers moments of demise which show the supposed steel core columns.

Do this, or just be so much accusatory rhetoric.

I shall post another image showing concrete. Now you have two to logically explain because so far, you aven't even explained one.

Concrete shear wall supporting an interio box columns which is outside the core.

http://algoxy.com/psych/images/corewallspirearrows.gif
 
Easily said.

I noticed you posted no corroborative evidence or images from the towers moments of demise which show the supposed steel core columns.

That's not what you asked for. You wouldn't see these superlong steel columns. They snapped apart and collapsed with the rest. As it is, tons of photographs exist at ground zero that shows the remains of the shattered columns.

And I don't need to post corroborative evidence or images. You asked for a logical explanation. I provided one. Deal with it.

Do this, or just be so much accusatory rhetoric.

Just as soon as you do the same for your imaginary concrete core, shown during the construction process.

How about it? Show me one - JUST ONE - image clearly showing any of the supposed concrete core during construction. Show me any of this alleged 3' rebar used during construction. Show me ANY of the forms in place during construction.

"Do this, or just be so much accusatory rhetoric."

I shall post another image showing concrete. Now you have two to logically explain because so far, you aven't even explained one.

Again, the lies. I've explained the first. That you don't like the explanation is irrelevant. It is a logical explanation, which makes you a liar.

As for standard image number 2: I see no concrete evident in those pictures. I see the remains of something steel - whether interior structural core column, or exterior support steel, I'm not certain. If anything, I'd call that an image from the demolition showing a steel support column in a state of collapse, and a ton of dust and debris. If anything, that seems to support the official story, not your imagination and lies. Your arrow that you think points to concrete, appears to be pointing to dust. Nothing more.

Sorry, Chris. You've been pretty much laid bare. Your lies exposed. Your imaginings revealed.

You really do have nothing left, Chris.

Still, since I'm posting here, I'm practically begging for you to agian, and again even, post your psychotic ramblings yet again.

But I've made my point, rather clearly now. Chris, you're a blatant liar. A logical explanation has been presented, and now you're trying desperately to move the goalposts.

Too late, numbnutz. Touchdown. Cincinnati 343, Santa Barbara 2.
 
The features reflected in the doors of the video are different.

The point you are trying to make you are not making. Smiths recall is not supported by images.

Your efforts to change the subject fail.
The reflection shows exactly what I pointed out Chris.
You denying the facts is pathetic.
You're simply closing your eyes and putting your fingers in your ears purposly ignoring the truth.

The point is that there is a 25 foot wide lobby on the narrow end of the core as shown in this image.

http://www.wirednewyork.com/wtc/images/wtc_19aug2000_lobby.jpg
Chris that is a picture of the mezzanine level. The escalators lead down to the elevator lobby.

Not only do efforts to change the subject fail, no one in nearly 11,000 posts has ever provided a logical explanation for what this is, if it is NOT concrete.


You are that one who is trying to change the subject here because YOU KNOW what the video is showing and you can't handle it. The video is proof that you are wrong. AND YOU KNOW IT.


Face up to the truth Chris. YOUR WRONG and everybody knows it.
 
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That's not what you asked for.

True, but reason calls for it.

You wouldn't see these superlong steel columns. They snapped apart and collapsed with the rest. As it is, tons of photographs exist at ground zero that shows the remains of the shattered columns.

Sure is blatantly inadequate that you didn't post any images of shattered columns from ground zero if there are so many.

Notice all the below columns are straight. To get tempered steel columns to shatter you have to bend them hard.

8748454a8c1e46c64.jpg


Notice that the ends of most of those columns look like Sheared Columns.
 
True, but reason calls for it.



Sure is blatantly inadequate that you didn't post any images of shattered columns from ground zero if there are so many.

Notice all the below columns are straight. To get tempered steel columns to shatter you have to bend them hard.

Unless they break at the joining points
 
True, but reason calls for it.

So you do concede, then, that a logical explanation for your picture was given, that did NOT involve a concrete core?

Thank you.

Sure is blatantly inadequate that you didn't post any images of shattered columns from ground zero if there are so many.

Nah - there's plenty of them. You posted one, in fact.

Notice all the below columns are straight. To get tempered steel columns to shatter you have to bend them hard.

No, you just have to stress the joints beyond their breaking point. No bending required.

(And what makes you think these were tempered steel columns?)

Notice that the ends of most of those columns look like Sheared Columns.

No, they look like columns that sheared at their welds. Pretty consistant with what we know.

Thanks for conceding! There's hope yet.
 
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