Sappers Infiltrate U.S. Compound

[Mephisto]

I suppose it was just a matter of time. Too bad that adapting to changing tactics still means you're a step behind. So much for "high-level" U.S. personnel passing through security checkpoints without security screening.

Karbala attackers posed as U.S. military officials

POSTED: 8:59 a.m. EST, January 22, 2007

KARBALA, Iraq (CNN) -- Attackers who killed five U.S. troops at a government building in Karbala posed as U.S. military officials to get past Iraqi guards, a Karbala police spokesman said.

The attack happened Saturday as the U.S. military convened a meeting to discuss security for Ashura, the upcoming Shiite pilgrimage to Karbala.

According to police spokesman Abdul Rahman al-Mishawi, about 30 gunmen traveling in a convoy of at least seven SUVs with tinted windows -- similar to the vehicles used by top U.S. military officials -- drove up to the Karbala Provincial Joint Coordination Center wearing uniforms similar to those worn by the U.S. military.

About a dozen U.S. troops were inside the compound at the time, al-Mishawi said.

Around 5:45 p.m., the gunmen cleared an Iraqi police checkpoint outside the center by flashing fake identification badges and speaking some English, al-Mishawi said.

Al-Mishawi said it is standard procedure for U.S. troops not to jointly man the checkpoint. He said U.S. personnel insist on passing without going through a security screening.

The attackers went through three checkpoints to enter the center, he said.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/01/22/iraq.karbala/index.html

 

[rikzilla]

The Trojan Horse still works.

 

[Darth Rotor]

I suppose it was just a matter of time. Too bad that adapting to changing tactics still means you're a step behind. So much for "high-level" U.S. personnel passing through security checkpoints without security screening.

Karbala attackers posed as U.S. military officials

Attackers who killed five U.S. troops at a government building in Karbala posed as U.S. military officials to get past Iraqi guards, a Karbala police spokesman said

In war, the enemy is trying to win too. What is your point, Meph? Is it your point that the enemy should in some magical way be prevented from being determined, and using any ruse that may work?

How, pray tell, do you propose to do that?

By the way, the article does not portray the base as a US compound, but as a "government building" (as in Iraqi government) which means that once again, you post what looks to be a falsehood in the headline.

. . . drove up to the Karbala Provincial Joint Coordination Center wearing uniforms similar to those worn by the U.S. military.

About a dozen U.S. troops were inside the compound at the time, al-Mishawi said

Ever since CJTF-7 was turned into MNCI and MNFI, the security leaks have been increased due to having to trust locals. Given the reality of tribal and factional relationships on the ground in Karbala (OK, my point of ref is a couple of years old) I suggest that this has decent odds of being a bit of "an inside job."

When asked why Iraqi police did not intervene to stop the gunmen from fleeing, al-Mishawi said "they assumed it was American-on-American violence and wanted to stay out of it."

That's almost funny. It's also an interesting data point on the ISG's insistence of embedding more US troops in more Iraqi units. There's considerable risk in doing that.

DR

 

[Mephisto]

In war, the enemy is trying to win too. What is your point, Meph? Is it your point that the enemy should in some magical way be prevented from being determined, and using any ruse that may work?

How, pray tell, do you propose to do that?

Maybe we could have anticipated, maybe a little foresight?

Of course, if we had that ability, we wouldn't be in Iraq to begin with.

 

[drkitten]

In war, the enemy is trying to win too. What is your point, Meph? Is it your point that the enemy should in some magical way be prevented from being determined, and using any ruse that may work?

Well, the enemy should certainly not be presented with opportunities to use ruses....

Al-Mishawi said it is standard procedure for U.S. troops not to jointly man the checkpoint. He said U.S. personnel insist on passing without going through a security screening.

In particular, this seems like an obvious flaw in the security.

How, pray tell, do you propose to do that?

Fixing "obvious flaws in the security" would be a good start.

 

[Darth Rotor]

Maybe we could have anticipated, maybe a little foresight?

Of course, if we had that ability, we wouldn't be in Iraq to begin with.

Meph, I am amazed that you presume that "we" don't anticipate that the enemy (who that morning may well have been made up of a squad of our "friends" in Iraq) will attempt an infiltration.

Why do you think there are security checkpoints in the first place?

Reality, check, Meph: in war, the enemy gets a vote. They vote with their guns, bullets, bombs, and most importantly their brains.

DR

 

[drkitten]

Reality, check, Meph: in war, the enemy gets a vote. They vote with their guns, bullets, bombs, and most importantly their brains.

Yes. The problem is that in this particular war, while the enemy votes "with their guns, bullets, bombs, and most importantly their brains.," the US forces do not. They simply vote with guns, bullets, and bombs.

Starting with the Commander-in-Chief.

 

[Darth Rotor]

Yes. The problem is that in this particular war, while the enemy votes "with their guns, bullets, bombs, and most importantly their brains.," the US forces do not. They simply vote with guns, bullets, and bombs.

Spoken like an ignoramous. I suggest you do a little homework, and look up Tal Afar, McMaster, and Third Armored Cavalry Regiment for one of many examples where the brain leads.

Starting with the Commander-in-Chief.

Not much to argue with there.

DR

 

[Cylinder]

In particular, this seems like an obvious flaw in the security.

Fixing "obvious flaws in the security" would be a good start.

So, you think US forces should be stooped outside the wire for a search?

PVT Hump: Sir, there's a couple of Iraqis standing by the road signaling the convoy.

1LT W.P. Ring: Okay, let's dismount the convoy. Be certain to safe your weapons and prepare for a search.

 

[drkitten]

So, you think US forces should be stooped outside the wire for a search?

Er, "yes." Because otherwise someone else will pretend to be US forces and be waved through the security perimeter and kill lots of people.

 

[Mephisto]

Er, "yes." Because otherwise someone else will pretend to be US forces and be waved through the security perimeter and kill lots of people.

Gosh! We never thought of THAT before.

 

[Darth Rotor]

Er, "yes." Because otherwise someone else will pretend to be US forces and be waved through the security perimeter and kill lots of people.

My guess would be that drkitten has never been in an environment with snipers in it IRL, nor drive by shootings, nor VBIED's.

Would I be guessing correctly? What you just recommended comes from How To Make Yourself A Target 101. It is in the capter a few pages after the one that addresses hanging around the radio operator, and his various antennae, with your silver bars on your collar in The Bush.

DR

 

[Mephisto]

My guess would be that drkitten has never been in an environment with snipers in it IRL, nor drive by shootings, nor VBIED's.

Would I be guessing correctly? What you just recommended comes from How To Make Yourself A Target 101. It is in the capter a few pages after the one that addresses hanging around the radio operator, and his various antennae, with your silver bars on your collar in The Bush.

DR

Still, the whole affair could have been curtailed if U.S. forces had accompanied Iraqi forces AT THE CHECKPOINT. A simple password of the day would have sufficed to stymie the ruse.

Sometimes, "rank (or importance) having it's privileges" can trip up the most sound security practices. Vehicles and contents could easily be inspected inside a covered area that would make an accurate shot nearly impossible.

 

[drkitten]

My guess would be that drkitten has never been in an environment with snipers in it IRL, nor drive by shootings, nor VBIED's.

Would I be guessing correctly? What you just recommended comes from How To Make Yourself A Target 101. It is in the capter a few pages after the one that addresses hanging around the radio operator, and his various antennae, with your silver bars on your collar in The Bush.

.... and about two chapters after the one entitled "Take Someone's Word If They Claim to be Friendly Forces."

 

[Darth Rotor]

Still, the whole affair could have been curtailed if U.S. forces had accompanied Iraqi forces AT THE CHECKPOINT. A simple password of the day would have sufficed to stymie the ruse.

Sometimes, "rank (or importance) having it's privileges" can trip up the most sound security practices. Vehicles and contents could easily be inspected inside a covered area that would make an accurate shot nearly impossible.

Glad you feel empowered to write combat zone procedures for a zone you aren't serving in. Ever hear the term REMF? I suspect you have. Well, my funny and fine friend and IIRC vet, what you are doing here does not even meet the RDA for REMF level quality.

DR