9/11 Conspiracy - Motives and aims

[uk_dave]

Dues to popular demand (well me) a thread to discuss the possible motives for the government conspirators and/or the arab terrorists

 

[uk_dave]

If one assumes that a powerful cabal of US officials, business leaders etc etc plotted the 9/11 attacks then what were their motives?

As far as I can see the general feeling amongst CTers is that they wanted a mid-east war to -

Grab Oil
Increase Defence Spending

And apparently they wanted something like the patriot act so that they could keep tabs on all you pesky americans.

On the other hand, if it was planned and executed by arab terrorists what were their motives?

Well, they had a stated aim to remove US bases from the holy land, but then why not attack those bases?

They view the US and the West in general as being decadent and contrary to the teachings of their religion. This plays well with the impoverished of countries close to the west, such algeria and morocco where the western lifestyle can be viewed on tv and aspired to, but is ultimately unattainable. Sometimes what we can't have we grow to hate.

Power is also an issue. Without an enemy the self proclaimed leaders of radical islam see their power draining away. War is much more fun than getting a day job, especially when you don't have to do the fighting.

 

[Pardalis]

And America is also supporting Israel...

 

[uk_dave]

Israel is certainly a powerful part of the motivation. But I feel it is more to do with molding the opinions of the masses than any great desire to help the palestinian people.

The average arab has enormous sympathy for the palestinians (as well they should inho) but those in power in the region have seldom been quite so welcoming to them. Of course one reason for this is that to give the paletinians a home in another arab country would legitimise Israels actions and remove the imperative to give the palestinians their land back.

So Israel is definately a factor, or more accurately the US support for Israel come hell or high water.

 

[uk_dave]

So motivation for arab extremists to hit the US-

Anger over the holy places
Hatred of liberal western lifestyles
Anger over the US support for Israel

and I would add-

Anger over the US support for other regimes in the region such as saddams Iraq, to the detriment of the ordinary arabs living in those countries.

 

[uk_dave]

Let's have some input here!!

Motives for a Government Conspiracy:

To cause war in the mid-east leading to occupation of oil rich nations and control of their oil

To terrify the population into believing that people following a religion not quite like theirs are out to kill them, therefore giving an excuse to conjure up draconian legislation giving more power to the state

To destroy two tall buildings which were past their sell by date and needed expensive asbestos removal before demoltion

To test drive some fantastic new weaponry

To cover up/steal trillions of dollars from the vaults of the WTC towers

To get re-elected

 

[defaultdotxbe]

Well, they had a stated aim to remove US bases from the holy land, but then why not attack those bases?

part of the reasont hey dont attack the bases directly is the same reason they dont want them there in the first place, they are opposed to fighting in the holy land

plus theyd rather mess up our land than their own

 

[Ripley Twenty-Nine]

Let's have some input here!!

Motives for a Government Conspiracy:

To cause war in the mid-east leading to occupation of oil rich nations and control of their oil

To terrify the population into believing that people following a religion not quite like theirs are out to kill them, therefore giving an excuse to conjure up draconian legislation giving more power to the state

To destroy two tall buildings which were past their sell by date and needed expensive asbestos removal before demoltion

To test drive some fantastic new weaponry

To cover up/steal trillions of dollars from the vaults of the WTC towers

To get re-elected

To further the ultimate goal of Zionism and/or the New World Order?

 

[Pardalis]

The conspiracy theorists should take a moment and think about it. If they are wrong, they could be indirectly helping the real 9/11 culprits by minimizing their importance (or blantantly denying their existence), by influencing the general public's opinion and therefore affecting America's resolve to fight them.

Think about it.

 

[negativ]

Not long ago, I heard the author of "The Looming Tower: Al Qaida and the Road to 9/11" interviewed on my local NPR station. I did not catch the entire interview, and I have not yet read the book.

The author stated that *part* of the motive behind 9/11 was actually to incite an overthrow of the Saudi government. If I recall correctly, Osama's premise was that a huge, spectacular attack on the US would force the Saudi government to publicly pledge support to the US, thereby rallying good Muslims to rise up and overthrow the Saudi royal family.

Now, I'm fairly sure that I'm grossly oversimplifying what was said, but it was a very interesting point nevertheless.

ETA: Transcript of a different interview with the same author here.

 

[jhunter1163]

Let's have some input here!!

Motives for a Government Conspiracy:

To cause war in the mid-east leading to occupation of oil rich nations and control of their oil

To terrify the population into believing that people following a religion not quite like theirs are out to kill them, therefore giving an excuse to conjure up draconian legislation giving more power to the state

To destroy two tall buildings which were past their sell by date and needed expensive asbestos removal before demoltion

To test drive some fantastic new weaponry

To cover up/steal trillions of dollars from the vaults of the WTC towers

To get re-elected

To justify GWB's personal score-settling with Saddam

To give GWB's Texas oil pals a new pipeline route in Afghanistan

To justify new restrictions on civil liberties (suppression of dissent)

 

[apathoid]

To invoke the Patriot Act so Bush could torture and molest some kids....

 

[uk_dave]

The conspiracy theorists should take a moment and think about it. If they are wrong, they could be indirectly helping the real 9/11 culprits by minimizing their importance (or blantantly denying their existence), by influencing the general public's opinion and therefore affecting America's resolve to fight them.

Think about it.

Possibly, but don't give too much credit to the influence of the CTers.

I often wondered if one reason why there had not been any successful attacks in the US since 9/11 was that to do so would see a 'coming together' of the american people in just the same way they did immediately after 9/11. But the polarisation of american politics means that cohesion is very fragile and soon dissipates.

Of course this is also taken as a motive for the government conspirators to fabricate another terrorist attack, except that it is a two edged sword for while the american people (or people of any nation attacked in such a way) would most likely come together, they would also be extremely pissed at the government in power which has ultimately failed to protect them after all the powers and money the people have invested.

Of course there were conspiracy theories floating around just before the mid-terms, of how there would be a staged terror attack....but as the election day came round, the best the CTers could muster was some mumblings about the timing of the verdict on saddam.

And basically those in power in congress and the senate lost that power and there was no terror attack, staged or otherwise.

 

[PerryLogan]

Go ask Alex

Alex Jones says the motive for staging 9/11 was world government.

Alex says the bad guys want a fascist world government, and they use terror to scare us into submission. They are...or were...going to stage terror attacks until martial law is...or was...declared.

We would then be herded into "compact cities" (?) and mostly killed. (Vaccines are part of this plot, but Alex Jones is the only person in the world clever enough to notice. Illegal immigration and tollroads are also involved.)

Stop laughing. I'm paraphrasing Alex.

Alex said they were going to stage terror attacks, declare martial law, herd us into these compact cities, and then kill 80% of us.

They want to kill 80% of us because they now have the technology to live forever. (No, I don't understand the logic of this either. Go ask Alex. I think he knows.)

Special bonus fact: The secret ruling elite who can live forever have openly announced their intention of doing all this to us. But Alex Jones is the only person in the world to can see/understand these public announcements. Everyone else is too stupd to see it, which is why Alex Jones yells so much. And bullhorns pregnant women.

(Phew! Hard to believe millions of angry white guys with IQ's in the mid-80's believe all this, huh?)

Anyway, using these well-documented facts and this steel-trap reasoning, Alex Jones has been wrongly predicting more big domestic terror attacks in the U.S. ever since 9/11.

It's all about world government. And killing most of us. And taking away our guns. The United Nations is in on it. The Pope is in on it. Your mother is in on it. You're all fools and shills.

 

[GlennB]

From the terrorist point of view -

1. To give the smug, arrogant Americans a mighty slap round the face to remind them they are not all-powerful and may have to reap what they have sown.

2. To become holy martyrs and ascend to everlasting life with 72 houris.

 

[uk_dave]

I would say that AQ also blieved that:

1. Based on what happened in vietnam, lebanon in the 80's and Somalia in the 90's the US would scuttle away from the mid-east with it's tale between it's legs

2. They arrogantly believe that they (the arabs) defeated the soviets in afghanistan and caused the collapse of a superpower. If they can do it once.....

 

[28th Kingdom]

What's gonna happen when the US government releases a suitcase nuke or dirty bomb on a major US city - so that they can (motive) turn America into one big police state, where you have to ask permission to leave your house, and go through 5 road blocks just to make it to the supermarket?

Step back for a second...it's only getting worse:

1993 WTC Bombings: Death Toll - 6

Oklahoma City: Death Toll - 168

9/11: Death Toll - 2973

Suitcase Nuke: Death Toll - 100,000+

Then, the US can proceed to invade Iran...and take control over more of the earth's most precious oil supplies...wherein - expanding the American Empire. (Remember, just like they kept telling us OBL was gonna attack...now they are saying Iran wants to nuke us. Connect the dots)

BTW, when did the idea of an Arab terrorist seep into the consciousness of the American people anyway? When and how? Was it the movies? Has anyone ever seen, "The Siege," with Bruce Willis?

http://imdb.com/title/tt0133952/

Tagline: On November 6th our freedom is history

Plot Outline: The secret US abduction of a suspected terrorist leads to a wave of terrorist attacks in New York that lead to the declaration of martial law.

That's a movie they made about 9/11 before 9/11. (Didn't you think the events surrounding 9/11 always seemed like something right out of a movie? Well, it was.)

Well, who runs Hollywood? The same people who run mainstream media including: all magazines, newspapers and television channels. They are all Jewish owned. Who is Israel's number 1 combatant in the Middle-East? Arab Muslims? What kind of opinion do you think Israel would want the American people to have about Islam and Arab Muslims? Do you think Israel wants Americans to like Arab Muslims? Or do you think Israel wants to spread propaganda to gain the support of the American people to back an American lead force to systemically eliminate all the Arab countries in the Middle-East, so that Israel can expand its borders and power?

Got Motive?

 

[stateofgrace]

Al Quada motive for the attack was simple, to wake up America. They announced their intentions years before Bush came into office.

UBL 1995

The urgent thing was communism, but the next target was America... This is an open war up to the end, until victory."

UBL 1996

What happened in Riyadh and [Dhahran] when 24 Americans were killed in two bombings is clear evidence of the huge anger of Saudi people against America. The Saudis now know their real enemy is America.

UBL 1997.

We declared jihad against the US government, because the US government is unjust, criminal and tyrannical. It has committed acts that are extremely unjust, hideous and criminal whether directly or through its support of the Israeli occupation."
"For this and other acts of aggression and injustice, we have declared jihad against the US, because in our religion it is our duty to make jihad so that God's word is the one exalted to the heights and so that we drive the Americans away from all Muslim countries.As for what you asked whether jihad is directed against US soldiers, the civilians in the land of the Two Holy Places (Saudi Arabia, Mecca and Medina) or against the civilians in America, we have focused our declaration on striking at the soldiers in the country of The Two Holy Places.

UBL 1998.

We--with God's help--call on every Muslim who believes in God and wishes to be rewarded to comply with God's order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it. We also call on Muslim ulema, leaders, youths, and soldiers to launch the raid on Satan's U.S. troops and the devil's supporters allying with them, and to displace those who are behind them so that they may learn a lesson

From these guys in 1998

Shaykh Usamah Bin-Muhammad Bin-Ladin
Ayman al-Zawahiri, amir of the Jihad Group in Egypt
Abu-Yasir Rifa'i Ahmad Taha, Egyptian Islamic Group
Shaykh Mir Hamzah, secretary of the Jamiat-ul-Ulema-e-Pakistan
Fazlur Rahman, amir of the Jihad Movement in Bangladesh.

All these crimes and sins committed by the Americans are a clear declaration of war on Allah
On that basis, and in compliance with Allah's order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims:

The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies -- civilians and military -- is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty Allah, "and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together," and "fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah."

http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/980223-fatwa.htm
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sh...who/edicts.html

Nice guys the twoothers defend.

 

[apathoid]

What's gonna happen when the US government releases a suitcase nuke or dirty bomb on a major US city - so that they can (motive) turn America into one big police state, where you have to ask permission to leave your house, and go through 5 road blocks just to make it to the supermarket?

Oh please. I know that you desperately want this to be the case, just like you people desperately want to believe that FEMA death camps are being built to punish dissenters. But the reality is that you're just going to have to keep dreaming and fantasizing about it, because thats the closest youre going to get to living in a police state or being hauled away to a FEMA camp(giggle)

Well, who runs Hollywood? The same people who run mainstream media including: all magazines, newspapers and television channels. They are all Jewish owned.

Oh jeez, not another one.......

 

[28th Kingdom]

Those who control the media...are the masters of reality. You will see what they want you to see...you will think what they want you to think. Arab Muslim Terrorists do NOT exist. Just like al Qaeda doesn't exist.

They're nothing more than a string of well orchestrated images and sound bytes, that (when played ad infinitum...24 hours a day on television and in newspapers) create the illusion of something that isn't even there.