Fire, steel, and 911.

28th Kingdom said:
NISTer...get ready for your minds to implode on themselves. LISTEN UP! And if you don't address what I'm about to say...than please just remove yourself from this debate.

I WANT all of you...TO TELL ME...given the fact that the government has destroyed the evidence...what evidence is left...that ONE - such as I - could ever present to you (NISTers) that would actually make you question NIST's report and/or seriously consider the PET as a reasonable theory?

BE SPECIFIC! I bet you can't even think of such potential evidence can you? I bet you've never even viewed it from this point have you?
Click to expand...


Bring forward the person(s) that set-up the explosives. How they did it, what they used, how they detonated the charges, how much they were paid, who paid them, how long did it take to set-up. Bring us the people that planned executed the demolition...and we'll be very interested in listening.
 
28th Kingdom said:
Jimben....and I bet everyone else will be just as stumped as you...NO ONE is gonna come up with any answers for this one...BUT, still TRY. My last post is still on the table....

JUST ADMIT IT....there is NO EVIDENCE, that would convince you against the NIST....NOT EVEN A VIDEO OF BUSH OR CHENEY OR SILVERSTEIN DIRECTLY ADMITING THEY HAD INVOLVEMENT WOULD CONVINCE YOU.

There is NO evidence...because you refuse to accept anything that disagrees with the NIST report.
Click to expand...

Oh, no, I'm not stumped. I'm MOCKING you!

Sheesh, IQ over 150? REALLY?

Think you misplaced a decimal point...
 
28th Kingdom said:
I WANT all of you...TO TELL ME...given the fact that the government has destroyed the evidence...what evidence is left...that ONE - such as I - could ever present to you (NISTers) that would actually make you question NIST's report and/or seriously consider the PET as a reasonable theory?

BE SPECIFIC! I bet you can't even think of such potential evidence can you? I bet you've never even viewed it from this point have you?
Click to expand...

You lose.

Since you haven't named any stakes in this bet, how about we just make it the Traditional $100 Donation to JREF? Or weren't you serious about betting?

Oh, and since there were two bets there, make it $200.....
 
28th Kingdom said:
Jimben....and I bet everyone else will be just as stumped as you...NO ONE is gonna come up with any answers for this one...BUT, still TRY. My last post is still on the table....

JUST ADMIT IT....there is NO EVIDENCE, that would convince you against the NIST....NOT EVEN A VIDEO OF BUSH OR CHENEY OR SILVERSTEIN DIRECTLY ADMITING THEY HAD INVOLVEMENT WOULD CONVINCE YOU.

There is NO evidence...because you refuse to accept anything that disagrees with the NIST report.
Click to expand...

I would accept as valid evidence anything besides eyewitness testimony or misinterpretations of photos/videos. If you have photo/video evidence that proves something unequivocally that would be acceptable.

Also acceptable would be calculations proving the official story impossible.
 
28th Kingdom said:
JUST ADMIT IT....there is NO EVIDENCE, that would convince you against the NIST....NOT EVEN A VIDEO OF BUSH OR CHENEY OR SILVERSTEIN DIRECTLY ADMITING THEY HAD INVOLVEMENT WOULD CONVINCE YOU.
Click to expand...
wrong again, a video of bush or cheney or anyone confessing would suffice

(no, "pull it" doesnt count, i want silverstein saying "i had the firefighters intentionally destroy building 7 so i could collect the insurance money")
 
28th Kingdom said:
LISTEN UP! And if you don't address what I'm about to say...than please just remove yourself from this debate.
Click to expand...

And while we're at it, why are you acting like we're the ones who ignore posts? Pretty much every assertion you've made has been addressed by multiple posters, which posts have largely been completely ignored by you.

Just another case of a twoofer projecting his own actions and beliefs onto others...
 
28th Kingdom said:
JUST ADMIT IT....there is NO EVIDENCE, that would convince you against the NIST....NOT EVEN A VIDEO OF BUSH OR CHENEY OR SILVERSTEIN DIRECTLY ADMITING THEY HAD INVOLVEMENT WOULD CONVINCE YOU.
Click to expand...
Actually, that would convince me quite throughly. Please produce said video.
There is NO evidence...because you refuse to accept anything that disagrees with the NIST report.
Click to expand...
Or there is no evidence because none exists that the WTC towers were brought down by controlled demolitions. And note, I define evidence as strong evidence such as:
  • Confessions by guilty parties
  • Proof that people have been paid off
  • Orders or directives signed by people in power
  • The confessions of non-participating conspirators such as NIST scientists reporting that they falsified evidence
  • Missing stores of explosives or weaponry
NIST lists, in great detail, the raw data, equations and principles used to determine their collapse initiation theory in the dozens of appendices and supporting works that accompany the NIST NCSTAR reports.
 
28th Kingdom said:
Jimben....and I bet everyone else will be just as stumped as you...NO ONE is gonna come up with any answers for this one...BUT, still TRY. My last post is still on the table....

JUST ADMIT IT....there is NO EVIDENCE, that would convince you against the NIST....NOT EVEN A VIDEO OF BUSH OR CHENEY OR SILVERSTEIN DIRECTLY ADMITING THEY HAD INVOLVEMENT WOULD CONVINCE YOU.

There is NO evidence...because you refuse to accept anything that disagrees with the NIST report.
Click to expand...

You still have no specific problems with the NIST report?

I doubt most need the NIST report to figure out the impact and fires brought down the WTC towers. But then I am an engineer, my brother is an engineer, and we try to not cloud our observations with biased political blindness! Brother is demotoid I must be a reptoid, but we really are independent. Why do you make up stuff and have no facts?

What is your problem? Show us your hard and overwhelming physical evidence of Pathetic Explosive Theory?
 
28th Kingdom. I've read these couple threads you've been involved with, and it appears to me that even though you've been inundated with posts from a lot of people which makes it hard to respond properly to each one, you have been given a great deal of why we believe the official story.

The preponderance of evidence supports for the most part the official story. People here not only believe that, but unlike you they are able to support their belief with solid, logical reasons for that belief. You have been given a ton of that here, and links to a ton others.

You on the other hand just think a few videos you've seen look like CD, and have supported that belief with nothing but unfounded conjecture, unreasonable layman's expectations, and a certain arrogant ideological bias.

Perhaps that would suffice on some conspiracy web sites or in your local pub, but not here.
 
28th Kingdom said:
NISTer...get ready for your minds to implode on themselves. LISTEN UP! And if you don't address what I'm about to say...than please just remove yourself from this debate.

I WANT all of you...TO TELL ME...given the fact that the government has destroyed the evidence...what evidence is left...that ONE - such as I - could ever present to you (NISTers) that would actually make you question NIST's report and/or seriously consider the PET as a reasonable theory?

BE SPECIFIC! I bet you can't even think of such potential evidence can you? I bet you've never even viewed it from this point have you?
Click to expand...

P D'oh the 28th, listen up! I want you to change the way I view 9/11. Forever!
 
28th Kingdom said:
Jimben....and I bet everyone else will be just as stumped as you...NO ONE is gonna come up with any answers for this one...BUT, still TRY. My last post is still on the table....

JUST ADMIT IT....there is NO EVIDENCE, that would convince you against the NIST....NOT EVEN A VIDEO OF BUSH OR CHENEY OR SILVERSTEIN DIRECTLY ADMITING THEY HAD INVOLVEMENT WOULD CONVINCE YOU.

There is NO evidence...because you refuse to accept anything that disagrees with the NIST report.
Click to expand...

To date and to the best of my knowledge, since you have joined this forum, you have accussed the following of being involved in mass Murder of 3000 US citizens.

NIST.
NORAD.
BUSH.
CHENEY.
SILVERSTEIN.
THE ENTIRE USG.
THE CLEAR UP CREWS AT GROUND ZERO.
SOMEBODY WHO FAKED UBL VIDEO TAPES.

You have also gone on to suggest the firemen who dealt with WTC 7 were ordered to pull back from this building by some mysterious higher ups and have been keeping quiet about the fact they were ordered to do so.

You have done this without the slightest bit of hard evidence and with the full knowledge you are accusing people of mass murder.

Is there anybody else you want to accuse of being involved in mass murder or anybody else you may wish to accuse of lying ?

THE CIA ?
THE FBI ?
THE US MILITARY ?

They are always good to have a go at also.
 
Last edited:
One point I am trying to enlighten you all to...is the fact that the term, "DEBUNKED," has been grossly misused to refute and completely dismiss evidence provided by people who support a PET.

The fact remains...since, the evidence was destroyed....Please, don't say we have some scraps of metal...CAN YOU proof this steel is from the WTC Towers? If not, than drop it. I HAVE proof that the government was destroying lots of key evidence:

http://fe.pennnet.com/Articles/Arti...n=Display&PUBLICATION_ID=25&ARTICLE_ID=131225

You don't have any evidence to prove that any of the metal still exists from the WTC towers...anyway, since all the key evidence was destroyed...as mentioned in the article above...SINCE, this happened...everything from this point forward MUST - by default - be categorized as a THEORY!

YOU CANNOT debunk a THEORY (PET) with a THEORY (NIST) - they're both theories...meaning, they are conjectures...based out of complete hypothesis...NOT fact.
 
28th Kingdom said:
One point I am trying to enlighten you all to...is the fact that the term, "DEBUNKED," has been grossly misused to refute and completely dismiss evidence provided by people who support a PET.

The fact remains...since, the evidence was destroyed....Please, don't say we have some scraps of metal...CAN YOU proof this steel is from the WTC Towers? If not, than drop it. I HAVE proof that the government was destroying lots of key evidence:

http://fe.pennnet.com/Articles/Arti...n=Display&PUBLICATION_ID=25&ARTICLE_ID=131225

You don't have any evidence to prove that any of the metal still exists from the WTC towers...anyway, since all the key evidence was destroyed...as mentioned in the article above...SINCE, this happened...everything from this point forward MUST - by default - be categorized as a THEORY!

YOU CANNOT debunk a THEORY (PET) with a THEORY (NIST) - they're both theories...meaning, they are conjectures...based out of complete hypothesis...NOT fact.
Click to expand...
your resorting to a sort of god of the gaps fallacy, you claim you cant prove your theory (or be proven wrong) because all the evidence was destroyed

this places your theory in the same boat as the theory that aliens destroyed the tower from space, the USS enterprise beamed out the core columns, and that elvis was seen pushing the detonator button to blow up the towers
 
A PETer and NISTer walk outside together on a starry night with a full moon in the sky:

PET: Hey, check out the moon.

NIST: Where?

PET: Right there.

NIST: Where?

PET: You don't see that HUGE round looking thing in the sky?

NIST: I don't see it.

PET: RIGHT THERE...It's huge...the round ball giving off all that light.

NIST: I don't see it.

PET: BUT YER LOOKING RIGHT AT IT!

NIST: I don't see it.


That's what it feels like sometimes.
 
28th Kingdom said:
One point I am trying to enlighten you all to...is the fact that the term, "DEBUNKED," has been grossly misused to refute and completely dismiss evidence provided by people who support a PET.

The fact remains...since, the evidence was destroyed....Please, don't say we have some scraps of metal...CAN YOU proof this steel is from the WTC Towers? If not, than drop it. I HAVE proof that the government was destroying lots of key evidence:

http://fe.pennnet.com/Articles/Arti...n=Display&PUBLICATION_ID=25&ARTICLE_ID=131225

You don't have any evidence to prove that any of the metal still exists from the WTC towers...anyway, since all the key evidence was destroyed...as mentioned in the article above...SINCE, this happened...everything from this point forward MUST - by default - be categorized as a THEORY!

YOU CANNOT debunk a THEORY (PET) with a THEORY (NIST) - they're both theories...meaning, they are conjectures...based out of complete hypothesis...NOT fact.
Click to expand...


No, you have an article that alleges the evidence was being destroyed.

We have a report from NIST that actually deals with samples of steel that were collected from the towers. I'd mention the records that were kept of where and when the debris was collected, but you'll just dismiss that as manufactured evidence, won't you?

So, why should we discount the reports of NIST? Give us some reason greater than "Becasue I don't like them! They're mean and use big words 'n stuff!"

Oh, and just to note, so you don't think you're putting one over on us ('cause you're so smart TeeHee!), I'll point out that you've completely ignored the several posters who answered your "bet" that we couldn't name any evidence that could convince us of your PET hypothesis.

The fact that you've chosen to ignore us can only mean that you don't have any of the evidence we asked for. Prove me wrong*.





*Oh heck, who am I kidding? He'll ignore this just like everything else......
 
YOU CANNOT debunk a THEORY (PET) with a THEORY (NIST) - they're both theories...meaning, they are conjectures...based out of complete hypothesis...NOT fact.
Click to expand...

Actually, since a theory is a proven hypothesis (it's what you get after a hypothesis has gone through a fair level of scientific inquiry - tests, mathematical calculations, peer review, etc - and been affirmed) a theory would normally supercede an hypothesis, as an hypothesis is an educated guess that hasn't yet been exposed to the full rigors of the scientific process, and may be disproven.

I'm not sure that what you have there even qualifies as an hypothesis, let alone a valid theory.

(My apologies to the rest of you for this over-simplification in terms, I know there are some real scientists among you and this may appear sophomoric, but I stopped taking science after college chemistry / physics, because I could.)
 
28th Kingdom said:
A PETer and NISTer walk outside together on a starry night with a full moon in the sky:

PET: Hey, check out the moon.

NIST: Where?

PET: Right there.

NIST: Where?

PET: You don't see that HUGE round looking thing in the sky?

NIST: I don't see it.

PET: RIGHT THERE...It's huge...the round ball giving off all that light.

NIST: I don't see it.

PET: BUT YER LOOKING RIGHT AT IT!

NIST: I don't see it.


That's what it feels like sometimes.
Click to expand...

Yeah, except it's the new moon.
 
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