Star Wars Beam Weapon and the WTC Bathtub

[stateofgrace]

Yes. Please tell me what round ojects these might have been. I'm not aware of any. Seems they would have to be spherical. Cylinders would do it, but only if they fell straight down. Also, they would have to be moving faster than the rest of the stuff, because they must have self-disintegrated on impact, unlike the perimeter sections, which are strewn about all over.

Please read through the rest of the thread, I’m pretty sure this question has been answered some 10 to 15 times now, if you missed it though. Let me answer it for you again.

FALLING DEBRIS DID IT

and again, just incase you have missed it.

FALLING DEBRIS DID IT

Has it sunk in yet ?

 

[TruthSeeker1234]

Please read through the rest of the thread, I’m pretty sure this question has been answered some 10 to 15 times now, if you missed it though. Let me answer it for you again.



and again, just incase you have missed it.



Has it sunk in yet ?

No. The debris would have to be spherical, would it not? What spheres do you imagine were present? And what became of the debris that supposedly did this? The holes are deep and sharply cut.

 

[Horatius]

FALLING DEBRIS DID IT

Oh, and while we're at it: FALLING DEBRIS DOESN'T HAVE TO BE ROUND TO MAKE ROUND-ISH HOLES.

Seriously, I think we need to horsewhip Chuck Jones and his Ilk for having started the Coyote&Roadrunner School of Impact Science.

 

[Horatius]

Damn! Too late!

 

[TruthSeeker1234]

Why is it you think the object (or objects) that hit the structure had to be the same shape as the hole (or holes)?

Holes, plural, lots of them. Go look. I think the object that drilled these holes had to be round because that is the nature of things. Paper punches cut round holes because the blade is cylindrical. Same with drill bits.

Otherwise, we have to believe that there were cylindrical patterns of weakness running vertically through roofs and multiple stories of building, and also in the rubble, and also in the road. And we have to believe that the impacting debris disappeared after triggering this damage. Is this what you guys think?

 

[Minadin]

You don't need a round piece of debris, or a round object, to create a round-looking hole in the roof structure there. The apparent shape of the hole is more dependant upon -

-which structural members failed, and how (I hypothesize they were hit by debris)
-the size, shape, and placement of the roof decking that evidently caved in
-the type of roofing material(it looks like a built-up rubber roof in the pictures)
-the camera angle

You see, when something or things fell and impacted that area of the roof, it may have punctured or cut that roof membrane, damaged the decking, and even caused internal columns or joists to fail, right? But that would not necessarily have to be one single object. It might even have been several relatively small objects over the course of a few seconds, causing a hole in the flexible rubber membrane. The deck members and insulation underneath the membrane fall out of the picture in what may or may not be a round-ish manner. But, the flexible rubber that makes up the roof will stretch over those areas and that hole will still appear to be round.

 

[chipmunk stew]

Holes, plural, lots of them. Go look. I think the object that drilled these holes had to be round because that is the nature of things. Paper punches cut round holes because the blade is cylindrical. Same with drill bits.

Otherwise, we have to believe that there were cylindrical patterns of weakness running vertically through roofs and multiple stories of building, and also in the rubble, and also in the road. And we have to believe that the impacting debris disappeared after triggering this damage. Is this what you guys think?

If I pushed you onto a frozen lake in the early winter and you fell through the ice, what shape would you expect the hole to be?

(After this thread, I'm almost getting nostalgic for Christophera's concrete core. At least he has the excuse of having a completely unhinged mind. This is just stupid.)

 

[Gravy]

Holes, plural, lots of them. Go look. I think the object that drilled these holes had to be round because that is the nature of things. Paper punches cut round holes because the blade is cylindrical. Same with drill bits.

The holes aren't round. Glad to clear that up for you. Next.

 

[Belz...]

Yes. With steel pans underneath them, and trusses underneath that. Yes. Haven't found even one. 220 floor assemblies missing.

You're wrong. And stupid.

I'm sure a thin concrete floor dropping onto another one after 20 others have dropped onto it will remain intact. That was sarcasm, by the way.

No. The debris would have to be spherical, would it not?

Er... no. Again with the cartoon vision of the universe.

Holes, plural, lots of them. Go look. I think the object that drilled these holes had to be round because that is the nature of things. Paper punches cut round holes because the blade is cylindrical. Same with drill bits.

Holy ****! The man's trying to compare paper punches to x-ton-weighing debris falling hundreds of feet.

Otherwise, we have to believe that there were cylindrical patterns of weakness running vertically through roofs and multiple stories of building, and also in the rubble, and also in the road.

Gosh, you should really get out more. Lots of non-round objects cause round-ish holes.

 

[chipmunk stew]

The holes aren't round. Glad to clear that up for you. Next.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/87904550bc7e52bc9.jpg​

Yes, they look more kitten-shaped to me.

 

[Horatius]

Yes, they look more kitten-shaped to me.

You kitten-hating Ba***d!

 

[Spins]

Holes, plural, lots of them. Go look. I think the object that drilled these holes had to be round because that is the nature of things. Paper punches cut round holes because the blade is cylindrical. Same with drill bits.

Otherwise, we have to believe that there were cylindrical patterns of weakness running vertically through roofs and multiple stories of building, and also in the rubble, and also in the road. And we have to believe that the impacting debris disappeared after triggering this damage. Is this what you guys think?

No, you are making the fatal mistake of assuming one huge object made each hole.

There was so much debris falling that day its easily plausible that a large cluster of debris punched its way through the roof and formed what looks like a round hole from a certain angle and distance. It's all irrelevant anyways because it's been shown the holes were not perfectly round.

Can you tell me why in the pictures posted above by Gravy there is a considerable amount of debris near the holes, wouldn't common sense dictate that the debris and damage are related?

 

[Trigood]

No, you are making the fatal mistake of assuming one huge object made each hole.

There was so much debris falling that day its easily plausible that a large cluster of debris punched its way through the roof and formed what looks like a round hole from a certain angle and distance. It's all irrelevant anyways because it's been shown the holes were not perfectly round.

Can you tell me why in the pictures posted above by Gravy there is a considerable amount of debris near the holes, wouldn't common sense dictate that the debris and damage are related?

Nope. The holes had to have been made by Star-Beams(TM). I have a prototype, but it made a hole in the garage roof and I think the rain ruined it.

 

[CurtC]

And we have to believe that the impacting debris disappeared after triggering this damage. Is this what you guys think?

No, I think the debris that caused those holes is sitting at the bottom of them.

Do you have any ideas about what could have caused the holes?

 

[chipmunk stew]

Nope. The holes had to have been made by Star-Beams(TM). I have a prototype, but it made a hole in the garage roof and I think the rain ruined it.

No no no. Ace said they had to have been made by spherical objects. Judy Wood's Beam Weapon paper is analogy; her first one is theory. The holes were made by giant billiard balls.

 

[Spins]

And we have to believe that the impacting debris disappeared after triggering this damage. Is this what you guys think?

OK, lets use the hole shaped like a pacman in the roof on that picture posted above, by Gravy, as an example.

As you can see the debris punched its way through the roof all the way into the building and because there was no light source from within to illuminate the debris it can't be seen on the photograph, that's why the hole is black. Just because you can't see the debris that caused the hole on that picture doesn't mean it wasn't there.

 

[chipmunk stew]

You kitten-hating Ba***d!

You have me all wrong. I LOVE kittens! Especially in a thread this silly. I have a great recipe for BBQ kitten tips.

 

[Horatius]

Unfortunately I don't have the resources here to draw lines on this picture, but I suggest people print it out and draw a few lines on it. You'll notice that most of the "round" holes actually have one or more segments of their circumference that are actually straight.

Consider the "PacMan" hole on the upper right. The leftmost edge seems to be fairly straight, and roughly parallel to the rightmost edge of the hole to its left, which is also kind of straight. I surmise that there is a roof beam right there, that acted as a fulcrum to the collaping roof material. Does anyone have blueprints of this building to check?

Then take a look at the four holes in a row that are just down and to the left of those holes. They all have straight edges, that are spaced very regularly. Again, it looks like the roof material collapsed around the support beams. Also, it's a bit hard to tell because of the angle the photo is at, but if draw a line parallel to the rightmost edge of the rightmost hole in the line of four, it matches almost perfectly with the leftmost edge of the hole at the top, which edge is again kinda-straight. If you draw a similar line for the left edge of the same hole, it matches the left edge of the hole just above it.

There are similar features for most of these holes, which indicates to me that the roof beams acted as "stops" for the collapsing roof materials, almost like using a ruler to rip a straight edge in a piece of paper, or breaking a tile on the edge of a workbench.

If anyone has photoediting software, perhaps they could paint a few lines to show these things.

 

[Horatius]

You have me all wrong. I LOVE kittens! Especially in a thread this silly. I have a great recipe for BBQ kitten tips.

Don't make me come over there! If I do, I'll be bringing my Ninja Cat with me (see photo at left, and cower!).

 

[Spins]

No no no. Ace said they had to have been made by spherical objects. Judy Wood's Beam Weapon paper is analogy; her first one is theory. The holes were made by giant billiard balls.

I'm assuming Trigood's prototype fires a circular beam of death and destruction onto its chosen target so would in theory cause a circular hole rather like a drill bit or a hole punch through paper.