Loose Change - Part IV

[Brainster]

Well there is the obvious Naudet brothers footage which they used I believe 15 times in the original LC. Not sure the status of the alleged suit on that one.

What we were discussing above was the intro music in the current and previous LC films.

the heavy Piano you hear as they are helicoptering around the Statue of liberty is from the 1966 film "Navajo Joe" and was written and performed by Ennio Morricone. That song in particular, is translated into english as "Silluoette of Doom" I believe...

If it was written after copyright laws were in effect, which I believe it was, than even if their guy...SWAE hammered out the piano chords himself, they still need to get permission to use the music, as far as I know...

Yes, the people to contact in this case are ASCAP. They are very agressive about pursuing unauthorized use of music.

 

[MarkyX]

Hey guys, just a little heads up.

I have not recevied the AVI file yet for my Screw Loose Change video.

I am, however, very impatient (and angry) because it's been nearly three days since I contacted him.

I'm splitting the files into ten nubytes segments and hopefully upload all of them (I'm guessing around 30 parts) on YouTube hopefully today.

They are going to be 320x200, while the original AVI should be 640x480.

EDIT: I really hope that when I actually put the Google Video up, it will be promoted heavily. We are getting closer to Sept 11. Promoted twice if it has to. I just hope HotAir and Little Green Footballs doesn't jump the gun too early like they did with 9/11 Deniers Speak.

 

[T.A.M.]

http://www.current.org/doc/doc0521fairuse.shtml

Interesting article. According to this, I think Dylan is probably in the clear for most of his footage, as long as he gives each piece of footage credit in his end dredits. As to how this would effect is use of the "Navajo Joe" Soundtrack music in LC, I am unsure. Seems that he would have to identify it as "Sillouette of Doom", as well as credit the original writer, and then the current artist who performed it. Whether he would need to get "performance" rights, I am not sure after reading the above article.

 

[negativ]

Now playing at the Loose Change forum:

Bush Is Not A Christian, Secrets Of The NWO And Bohemian Grove

In a heart warming tribute to the magic and grandeur of human intelligence, user sleepy2k16 offers up the following:

First In 1962 Operation Northwoods was Introdused to JFK, He said no, and was killed in 1963, I think because he stood in the way of the NWO and People in the Govt killed him and may have framed Lee Oswald. After his death in 1963. Something happened in 1964, Not to familar with it, But in 1964 I think America attacked its own people. I also heard something similar may have happened in 1967. I am 100% Possitive it happened in 1953.

Meanwhile, Bush is a DevilWorshipper

http://www.theresistancemanifesto.com

Well, somebody call up OJ, because with obvious investigative prowess like that, The Real Killer could be found in no time. Hell, it was probably Karl Rove anyway.

The man-on-the-street video at the above URL is disapponting for its utter lack of mob violence, especially at the end. I was hoping to see tasers, nightsticks, pepper spray, and maybe a hyped-up Belgian Mallinois or two, but alas it was not to be. Anyway, sleepy continues:

Christians Arent Members of Bohemian Grove and meet every July and go nude in a coffin and get born again to Lucifer.. And practice Mock child sacrices to the owl (Which is on the $1 Bill)

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False Religions/Wicca & Witchcraft/bohemian_grove_exposed.htM

(Scroll down to 1/2 the page)

These people Meet Every July in northern Calirfornia and do this crap, I also heard in the 80's People were murdered on camera for fun.

At this point, I'm breaking in to point out that I heard sleepy2k16's bedsheets smell like pee.

These people believe lucifer is God, and Believe he will rein for 1000 years. This is what the New World Order is about.

Bush said "You are with us...Or you are with the terrorist"

If you arw christian You are considered the terrorist. They want everybody to join this Lucifer Worshipping NWO.

In order to Prove YOU ARE NOT a TERRORIST you will have to take an RFID Verichip IN your RIGHT HAND or FOREHEAD, and Pleage Alliance to Lucifer and the NWO.

They are 600-800 Consentration Camps in america Ready to go.

I think it may already be starting:

First let me tell you all to check out http://www.nbc10.com/news/4077250/detail.html

Hmm, note the name of the spokesman: Michael Marcavage. Note the too-eerie-to-be-coincidental similarity!!

Now, I'm more than capable of some truly demented logical gymnastics at times, but even I can't come up with a response to the whole "Bohemian Grove" thing other than to shrug and say, "so what?"

Before I start Talking about Bohemian Grove, I just want you all to know that I strongly Recommend that you do not discuss this in public or Talk about this where People can hear you. This is something that people who participate in Bohemian Grove, do not want anybody to know about what goes on in Northern California Every July. I can not be held responsible for any Illegal actions taking by evil politicians or members of Bohemian Grove.

Note to sleepy2k16: Just because you lowered the Cones of Silence over your monitor and keyboard when you typed your post does NOT mean that nobody else can see what you wrote.

There are rituals that go on inside Bohemian Grove, supposedly by Pagans and Satanists Alike. These go on for a period of 2 weeks, and the rituals include owl worship and worship of other false gods. Bohemian Grove started in 1872, However these Satanist rituals and owl worship didnt begin until 1873. The Owl worship is an Owl statue appox. 40 feet high and is called Moloch. There is also talk these people either wear black and white robes or do not wear any clothes at all. About 20% of the members engage in public homosexual activities. There Main headquarters is in the Bohemian building in San Francisco.

Do you have a dollar bill in front of you? Take a dollar Bill and on the Front of the dollar near the One, The owl that is worshipped is located between the 1 and the Leaves.

Also notice how the Owl of Bohemian Grove is on the 1 Dollar Bill. I will tell you how 9/11 is on the 10 and 20 Dollar Bills, when I talk about 9/11 in a future Conspiracy, Most people already know there its there, But I will re-share it anyways, just in case you do not know. It tells me how 9/11 was an inside job. I will talk about that in about 2 weeks from now. As for now lets continue with Bohemian Grove.

I've read about the allegedly "occult" ceremony called "The Cremation of Care". I'm not real big on ceremony and ritual, but I think Cremation of Care is actually kinda cool. Maybe I'm a blind, sleeping zombie sheep, but I just think it sounds like a somwhat ostentatious way to say, "this is our playground and in here we shrug off all day-to-day worries and concerns."

Hell, where do I sign up?

I don't understand the fascination with the Freemasons, the Skull & Bones, the Hellfire Club of Ben Franklin's day, and all the rest. As far as I know, none of the "secret societies" have ever been credibly linked to anything other than just being cryptic and having rich and powerful people as members. I'd hate to think that it all boils down to distrust of the rich and powerful, flavored with a pinch of resentment and garnished with a sprig of paranoia.

I wonder, are there any 9/11 CTers who do not also believe in EVERY other conspiracy theory? I've yet to hear anyone say, "oh yeah, the Warren Commission got it mostly right, but the 9/11 Commission, wow. What a pack of viscious lies. They will soon pay for their crimes!"

 

[StoneWT]

Interesting article. According to this, I think Dylan is probably in the clear for most of his footage, as long as he gives each piece of footage credit in his end dredits. As to how this would effect is use of the "Navajo Joe" Soundtrack music in LC, I am unsure. Seems that he would have to identify it as "Sillouette of Doom", as well as credit the original writer, and then the current artist who performed it. Whether he would need to get "performance" rights, I am not sure after reading the above article.

Is it retroactive or can he still be sued for the old versions of LC that didn't give proper credit?

 

[LashL]

http://www.current.org/doc/doc0521fairuse.shtml

Interesting article. According to this, I think Dylan is probably in the clear for most of his footage, as long as he gives each piece of footage credit in his end dredits. As to how this would effect is use of the "Navajo Joe" Soundtrack music in LC, I am unsure. Seems that he would have to identify it as "Sillouette of Doom", as well as credit the original writer, and then the current artist who performed it. Whether he would need to get "performance" rights, I am not sure after reading the above article.

Hmm. I'm not so sure. The exceptions seem to apply only to documentaries and Loose Change is hardly that, given the following definition:

Movies, Television. based on or re-creating an actual event, era, life story, etc., that purports to be factually accurate and contains no fictional elements

 

[defaultdotxbe]

Movies, Television. based on or re-creating an actual event, era, life story, etc., that purports to be factually accurate and contains no fictional elements

dylans loophole?

 

[T.A.M.]

Stone:
I am not sure. I don't think he gives credit wrt the "Navajo Joe" song, as last I saw him write, he simply recognized it as "another song given to him by Swae on a CD"...I think he is ignorant to the fact that it is someone elses music...so let him be...his fault...hist trouble.

wrt: Bohemian Grove etc...

So what is right. Where the hell do the CTers get off criticizing others for being excentric...talk about the ultimate pot calling the kettle.

wrt: Factual Documentary...

If the plaintiff were to get a hold of the Korey Rowe "Intentional Errors" quote, they'd be in deep doo-doo.

TAM

 

[brodski]

http://www.current.org/doc/doc0521fairuse.shtml

As to how this would effect is use of the "Navajo Joe" Soundtrack music in LC, I am unsure. Seems that he would have to identify it as "Sillouette of Doom", as well as credit the original writer, and then the current artist who performed it. Whether he would need to get "performance" rights, I am not sure after reading the above article.

I don't think he has any "fair use" defence for his use of "Navajo Joe". From that article

Fair use can’t be a cheap way to cop a soundtrack.

he is not using a sample of "Navajo Joe" to make a point, there is is nothing intrinsic in the music which is relevant to 9/11 or loose change. He may be able to claim "fair use" with some of his footage, but the theft of music is indefensible.

 

[60hzxtl]

http://www.current.org/doc/doc0521fairuse.shtml

Interesting article. According to this, I think Dylan is probably in the clear for most of his footage, as long as he gives each piece of footage credit in his end dredits. As to how this would effect is use of the "Navajo Joe" Soundtrack music in LC, I am unsure. Seems that he would have to identify it as "Sillouette of Doom", as well as credit the original writer, and then the current artist who performed it. Whether he would need to get "performance" rights, I am not sure after reading the above article.

Uh, no. As a film maker for 20+ years, that is not what this means. Otherwise the stock footage business has just been put out of business.

You still have to pay - but if it has been put before the public, the owner no longer has the right to refuse your permission to buy it and use it. It is not 'help yourself' and a group hug all around. (I was once refused the use of "Gloria" from Van Morrison's publisher.)

We pay for stock footage, often in terms of dollars per second what fair use means is that if it's been broadcast, I can't refuse to sell it to party B if I've made money on it myself, or have sold it to party A. I can't collect money for a song I own on the radio, and then refuse to sell it to you, even if you are a jerk making Loose Change. Or, if the Naudet's sold their footage to CBS, they can't refuse to sell it to the dopes in Oneonta. But the owner sets the price. You aren't buying it by the pound.

Stock footage and resale of music are a source of income, often for years to come. It may be pennies per use, but as the author of "Summer in the City" once told me, "that 3 cents per radio play adds up every year. I like a hot summer." I once had to pay twice for an image of Woody Gutherie. Once to the owner of the picture, (Getty Images) and to the Gutherie estate for his image. I gladly paid, laughing that I paid for the private property of a man who didn't believe in private property!

Irving Berlin is dead, but his estate continues to profit on "White Christmas" and "Easter Parade." Not bad for a dead Jewish guy.

Keep up the pressure about copyrighted material and Dylan and the stooges. It is the responsibility of the copyright holder to protect it. Let them know. They'll want their piece. It ain't show art - it's show business.

 

[LashL]

dylans loophole?

No, because of the connecting and; in other words, it must both purport to be factually accurate and it must contain no fictional elements.

In addition, given that the loosers are on record as saying that they know it is not factually accurate, I don't think they could use the potential loophole.

 

[LashL]

Uh, no. As a film maker for 20+ years, that is not what this means. Otherwise the stock footage business has just been put out of business.

You still have to pay - but if it has been put before the public, the owner no longer has the right to refuse your permission to buy it and use it. It is not 'help yourself' and a group hug all around. (I was once refused the use of "Gloria" from Van Morrison's publisher.)

We pay for stock footage, often in terms of dollars per second what fair use means is that if it's been broadcast, I can't refuse to sell it to party B if I've made money on it myself, or have sold it to party A. I can't collect money for a song I own on the radio, and then refuse to sell it to you, even if you are a jerk making Loose Change. Or, if the Naudet's sold their footage to CBS, they can't refuse to sell it to the dopes in Oneonta. But the owner sets the price. You aren't buying it by the pound.

Stock footage and resale of music are a source of income, often for years to come. It may be pennies per use, but as the author of "Summer in the City" once told me, "that 3 cents per radio play adds up every year. I like a hot summer." I once had to pay twice for an image of Woody Gutherie. Once to the owner of the picture, (Getty Images) and to the Gutherie estate for his image. I gladly paid, laughing that I paid for the private property of a man who didn't believe in private property!

Irving Berlin is dead, but his estate continues to profit on "White Christmas" and "Easter Parade." Not bad for a dead Jewish guy.

Keep up the pressure about copyrighted material and Dylan and the stooges. It is the responsibility of the copyright holder to protect it. Let them know. They'll want their piece. It ain't show art - it's show business.

Thanks for the excellent info, 60hzxtl, and for the interesting anecdotes, too.

 

[MarkyX]

Uploading the video files on Screw Loose Change: Not Freakin' Again edition.

19 parts of this. I will be removing the older Screw Loose Change editions on Google Video and YouTube once I'm done uploading.

 

[T.A.M.]

60hzxtl:

Thanks for the info. Not only for here, but one of my side hobbies is I help produce my brother's independent films (fictional narratives) and it is good to have that perspective before he or I make any errors in that regard, unwittingly.

If that is the case, than I think D.A> is up the creek, for his entire movie, with minor exception is a collage of other people's footage. The song is just the icing on the cake, so to speak.

TAM

 

[JamesB]

Now playing at the Loose Change forum:

Bush Is Not A Christian, Secrets Of The NWO And Bohemian Grove

In a heart warming tribute to the magic and grandeur of human intelligence, user sleepy2k16 offers up the following:



Well, somebody call up OJ, because with obvious investigative prowess like that, The Real Killer could be found in no time. Hell, it was probably Karl Rove anyway.

The man-on-the-street video at the above URL is disapponting for its utter lack of mob violence, especially at the end. I was hoping to see tasers, nightsticks, pepper spray, and maybe a hyped-up Belgian Mallinois or two, but alas it was not to be. Anyway, sleepy continues:



At this point, I'm breaking in to point out that I heard sleepy2k16's bedsheets smell like pee.



Hmm, note the name of the spokesman: Michael Marcavage. Note the too-eerie-to-be-coincidental similarity!! [qimg]http://67.15.129.139/6014/152/emo/rock.gif[/qimg][qimg]http://67.15.129.139/6014/152/emo/rock.gif[/qimg]



Now, I'm more than capable of some truly demented logical gymnastics at times, but even I can't come up with a response to the whole "Bohemian Grove" thing other than to shrug and say, "so what?"



Note to sleepy2k16: Just because you lowered the Cones of Silence over your monitor and keyboard when you typed your post does NOT mean that nobody else can see what you wrote.




I've read about the allegedly "occult" ceremony called "The Cremation of Care". I'm not real big on ceremony and ritual, but I think Cremation of Care is actually kinda cool. Maybe I'm a blind, sleeping zombie sheep, but I just think it sounds like a somwhat ostentatious way to say, "this is our playground and in here we shrug off all day-to-day worries and concerns."

Hell, where do I sign up?

I don't understand the fascination with the Freemasons, the Skull & Bones, the Hellfire Club of Ben Franklin's day, and all the rest. As far as I know, none of the "secret societies" have ever been credibly linked to anything other than just being cryptic and having rich and powerful people as members. I'd hate to think that it all boils down to distrust of the rich and powerful, flavored with a pinch of resentment and garnished with a sprig of paranoia.

I wonder, are there any 9/11 CTers who do not also believe in EVERY other conspiracy theory? I've yet to hear anyone say, "oh yeah, the Warren Commission got it mostly right, but the 9/11 Commission, wow. What a pack of viscious lies. They will soon pay for their crimes!"

Korey Rowe talked about that once during a radio interview.

 

[LashL]

Uploading the video files on Screw Loose Change: Not Freakin' Again edition.

19 parts of this. I will be removing the older Screw Loose Change editions on Google Video and YouTube once I'm done uploading.

Terrific! I'm looking forward to watching them, Mark.

 

[T.A.M.]

Funny...
so now Stephen Jones is concentrating of Flourine and Zinc. What's next...

S.Jones: Now we are focusing on quantities of paper and ash, as well as elements consistent with there being large amounts of excrement in the rubble. This will conclusively show the towers wer brought down by BULLSHAITE!"

 

[T.A.M.]

Oh, and he is recently working on this magnificent scientific study...

Scholars "shavings and woodchip" experiments

In an attempt to disprove the NIST "orange glow" theory, Jones et al have performed "experiments" where they add shavings and chips of various organic materials, to molten aluminum, to see if it glows "orange".

Seems the Scholars were quite annoyed by the NIST report, as there are suddenly numerous articles on it to be found at their site...

 

[Kent1]

Funny...
so now Stephen Jones is concentrating of Flourine and Zinc. What's next...

S.Jones: Now we are focusing on quantities of paper and ash, as well as elements consistent with there being large amounts of excrement in the rubble. This will conclusively show the towers wer brought down by BULLSHAITE!"

Actually it would be a good thing to pin down.
What would be the best answer for Flourine and Zinc?

 

[T.A.M.]

For starters, he must mean Fluorine in its ionic form, fluoride. Elementally, Fluorine is extremely unstable and explosive.

In its ionic form you can find it in tap water, toothpaste, insecticides (fluoride), air conditioning, refridgerators (fluorochlorohydrocarbons).

Zinc - well beyond its use to galvanize nails and screws to prevent corrosion, it is used in batteries, paint, rubber, medicines...in general in tonnes of things. It is the 4th most common metal.

oh...and it is the metal used to make "cents".