Loose Change - Part IV

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The_Fire said:
Anyone mind taking a look at this and tell me what you think?

And no, that's not the articleseries I've been planing for a while, but I had to rant a bit.
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Well, not to be rude, but I find rather ironic to speak positively of deities and witchcraft while simultaneously dissing CTers. It's your thing, of course, but the first thought that came to mind, and I didn't even realise you wrote it at that point, was "credibility ?".

Sorry about that, but as your sig says : "evidence first, woo later". To me, it's "evidence first, woo never."
 
Belz... said:
Again, a great show of maturity and responsability by the twoofers...
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Is it just me, or after reading that whole post does it seem like it's sarcastic and mocking to the whole idea of the thread? I think it may be made by one of us, or we may have just found a CTer with some wit!
 
mrfreeze said:
... or we may have just found a CTer with some wit!
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Thanks for putting a smile on my face this morning MrFreeze. :)

Unfortunately, CTers/ists are far too focused on imagining how important they and their cause are to bother with anything resembling a sense of humor.
 
Good old Barrie. I remember seeing him a few years ago and thought was a nut.

Should be interesting to watch. I love the whole "planned from a cave" bit already. I can tell this guy already needs a thick blunt object to the head.
 
MarkyX said:
Good old Barrie. I remember seeing him a few years ago and thought was a nut.

Should be interesting to watch. I love the whole "planned from a cave" bit already. I can tell this guy already needs a thick blunt object to the head.
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Is there actually any credible evidence that OBL actually planned 9/11?
Approved of- defiantly, ordered- most probably, funded- almost certainly, responsible for- absolutely, but actually planned?
Given AQ's loose organisation, is OBL really such a "hands on" manager?
Does any official body actually claim that OBL had a direct hand in arranging the specific attacks of 9/11?
 
I really hate to bring this up, but I uploaded the history document on the Hamburg cell on YouTube.

Bascailly they get their story from one of the hijackers who was replaced by Hani (and he didn't get into the US) who was captured in Pakistan.

Osama Bin Laden called 9/11 the "Planes Operation" and wanted to go after the White House, the Pentagon, and the Two Towers. He really wanted the Two Towers mainly two things:

- Lots of Jews would be killed
- One messed up economy

The problem is that the information is second hand information, so they can't really use it as proof (hard evidence yet again). But Osama Bin Laden did want the planes to be used as missiles at certain points.
 
Kent1 said:
Does anyone know where this video came from?
Or have anymore of it?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcRs1fv8i3I
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The thing I notice is that at least one of the towers had already collapsed at that point. I looked for clues that could indicate whether both towers had already collapsed, but couldn't see anything to judge by. I think this video is being used to show that there were bombs in the towers, right?
 
brodski said:
Is there actually any credible evidence that OBL actually planned 9/11?
Approved of- defiantly, ordered- most probably, funded- almost certainly, responsible for- absolutely, but actually planned?
Given AQ's loose organisation, is OBL really such a "hands on" manager?
Does any official body actually claim that OBL had a direct hand in arranging the specific attacks of 9/11?
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I see that as part of the obfuscation (not on your part) but on the CT crowd) that look and see that OBL is not charged with 9/11 on the FBI's 10 most wanted list.

They see 9/11 not as an act of war, but as a crime to be prosecuted.
 
60hzxtl said:
I see that as part of the obfuscation (not on your part) but on the CT crowd) that look and see that OBL is not charged with 9/11 on the FBI's 10 most wanted list.

They see 9/11 not as an act of war, but as a crime to be prosecuted.
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I see it at both, but (as an analogy) Jerry Adams and Martin McGuiness where never prosecuted for the rocket attack on 10 Downing street, that doesn’t men they didn’t authorise it, it's just that those that carried out the attack where probably not directly order to do so by the IRA army council, like all effective management structure, delegation is key in terrorist organisations. Hopefully the US will show a little ore backbone, and when you finally catch OBL, you won't be giving him a seat in your senate.
 
Sorry to derail, but has anyone looked at the events that Dylan & Co have planned for the weekend of the 11th?

Friday, Sept.8th
7:00 – 7:30 Welcome/Introduction/Actions
7:30 – 8:00 Al Fonz of 9/11 Vets For Truth: 9/11 As Pretext For Iraq Invasion
8:00 – 8:45 Korey Rowe veteran of the Iraq and Afganistan War.
8:45 – 10:00 Ralph Schoenman: 9/11 and the Attack on Lebanon

Saturday, Sept.9th
3:00 – 5:30 Jim Marrs, Tom Foti, Chris Emery, Howie Hawkins
7:00 – 8:00 Barry Zwicker
8:00 – 9:00 First responders
9:00 – 9:30 9/11 Victims Family Members

Sunday Sept. 10th
11:30 – 12:15 9/11 Truth Breakthrough Press Conference to feature all major speakers
1:00 – 5:00 Judy Wood, Jim Fetzer, Jesse Richard, Ralph Schoenman, Jim Marrs, Barry Zwicker, Ian Wood , Kevin Barrett, Faiz Kahn, Carl Person, Les Jamison.
6:30 – 7:00 Introduction and Ground Zero Plan
7:00 – 7:30 Alex Jones – progress in the movement
7:30 – 9:30 Preview of LC Final Cut


If my math is correct, that's over 15 hours of speakers and video. And how much of that time is given to the family members of the people that the film is "dedicted to"?

Exactly one half hour.

Glad they squeeze them in.

(Of course, considering how ridiculous Loose Change is, it may be impossible to find anyone to fill that half hour)
 
I would say the plan went something like this.

OBl, AL-Zwahiri, and KSM, all sitting around in a room. KSM speaks to OBL...

KSM: Most wonderful. We have devised a plan that will bring great honor to Allah.

OBL: Go on.

KSM: We have the logistics in place to set up a number of hijackings or US airplanes.

OBL: Yes...

KSM: The Matyrs, Allah be praised, will then take these hijacked aircraft and crash them into buildings of your choice.

OBL: A most wonderful plan. I should think the towers of New York, their financial capital, as well as the pentagon and the residence of their leader would all be excellent choices.

KSM: As you wish...

Well, maybe not exactly like that, but that is the extent I see Osama being involved in 9/11. Still guilty, as the leader, and should suffer the same fate as those who planned the whole thing and carried it out...
 
T.A.M. said:
I would say the plan went something like this.

OBl, AL-Zwahiri, and KSM, all sitting around in a room. KSM speaks to OBL...

KSM: Most wonderful. We have devised a plan that will bring great honor to Allah.

OBL: Go on.

KSM: We have the logistics in place to set up a number of hijackings or US airplanes.

OBL: Yes...

KSM: The Matyrs, Allah be praised, will then take these hijacked aircraft and crash them into buildings of your choice.

OBL: A most wonderful plan. I should think the towers of New York, their financial capital, as well as the pentagon and the residence of their leader would all be excellent choices.

KSM: As you wish...

Well, maybe not exactly like that, but that is the extent I see Osama being involved in 9/11. Still guilty, as the leader, and should suffer the same fate as those who planned the whole thing and carried it out...
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Osama helped pick the location and some of the hijackers according to the testimony from KSM and Ramzi Binalshibh.
http://usinfo.state.gov/media/Archive/2005/Jan/14-610042.html

... KSM acknowledges formally joining al Qaeda, in late 1998 or early 1999, and states that soon afterward, Bin Ladin also made the decision to support his proposal to attack the United States using commercial airplanes as weapons.

... Bin Ladin summoned KSM to Kandahar in March or April 1999 to tell him that al Qaeda would support his proposal. The plot was now referred to within al Qaeda as the "planes operation." (p. 154)

... KSM's original concept of using one of the hijacked planes to make a media statement was scrapped, but Bin Ladin considered the basic idea feasible. Bin Ladin, Atef, and KSM developed an initial list of targets. These included the White House, the U.S. Capitol, the Pentagon, and the World Trade Center. According to KSM, Bin Ladin wanted to destroy the White House and the Pentagon, KSM wanted to strike the World Trade Center, and all of them wanted to hit the Capitol. No one else was involved in the initial selection of targets.

Bin Ladin also soon selected four individuals to serve as suicide operatives: Khalid al Mihdhar, Nawaf al Hazmi, Khallad, and Abu Bara al Yemeni. (p. 155)
 
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brodski said:
Is there actually any credible evidence that OBL actually planned 9/11?
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IIRC, Khalid Sheik Mohammed actually planned 9/11, and he was captured in Pakistan and is currently in US custody.
 
VespaGuy said:
Sorry to derail, but has anyone looked at the events that Dylan & Co have planned for the weekend of the 11th?


Saturday, Sept.9th
3:00 – 5:30 Jim Marrs, Tom Foti, Chris Emery, Howie Hawkins
7:00 – 8:00 Barry Zwicker
8:00 – 9:00 First responders
9:00 – 9:30 9/11 Victims Family Members

If my math is correct, that's over 15 hours of speakers and video. And how much of that time is given to the family members of the people that the film is "dedicted to"?

Exactly one half hour.

Glad they squeeze them in.

(Of course, considering how ridiculous Loose Change is, it may be impossible to find anyone to fill that half hour)
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Yes, I noticed that, too. 16 hours of 9/11 deniers and video, and a paltry 30 minutes for the as-yet-unidentified family members.

Pretty pathetic, isn't it?
 
LashL said:
Yes, I noticed that, too. 16 hours of 9/11 deniers and video, and a paltry 30 minutes for the as-yet-unidentified family members.

Pretty pathetic, isn't it?
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Is it wrong of me to hope that that 30 minutes with the famliy members will be primaily Dylan getting kicked in the crotch by the famlies?
 
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