Why do people hate Jews?

[aerosolben]

That's because the Jews control the money!

And they never give it back!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vb3IMTJjzfo

 

[bob_kark]

I have never seen anyone view mexican * IMMIGRANTS* this way, and I live in a border state

Perhaps like the media you are tyring to mix criminal tresspasser with immigrant?

Yes in the case of criminal tresspassing thief, "invaders" would be a good term, but immigrant? Evidence?

We are proud of our mexican heritage

Do not pollute that pride by wishing criminals upon us

I'm sorry if I offended you. However, I do see people who view Mexican immigrants in a derogatory way whether legal or illegal. I don't agree with them. However the discrimination exists. Also I do mean immigrant:

immigrant.
im·mi·grant ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-grnt)
n.

1. A person who leaves one country to settle permanently in another.
2. A plant or animal that establishes itself in an area where it previously did not exist.

I do not wish to disrespect your Mexican heritage. However, if one moves from Mexico to live in the United States permanently, they are an immigrant. While I understand what your point, I refuse to stop using the proper term to describe someone who immigrates to this country simply because it may offend someone.

 

[davefoc]

Banking is surely part of the reason why the Jews became a target for the Nazis, but I don't think it explains why 6 millions of them were murdered - including women and children.
This was also a conflict between socialism and the Jewish family-fortune system. The family is less important for the individual under a socialistic ideology, because you no longer need depend on children and forefathers to be financially secure. I.e. the government keep you above waters in troublesome times despite your age and family background.

That the common German Jews (not the bankers) did so well in general compared to the "splitting" German families, was cause of envy, and a dark spot on the quality and future of socialism in Germany. Remember the Nazis were: The National Socialist German Workers Party.

You say the Germans had no one else to blame during the inflation than the Jews, I don't find this to be correct, because it was all caused in great part by the heavy demands of the reparations placed upon the Germans following their loss in World War I. So they could easily blame the winners of this war, and as you know, they also tried to obtain revenge.

The Jewish families were viewed as vampires sucking on a bleeding country because they remained above waters and traded within closed networks. And let's of course not forget the very well off, the bankers. So,

• The people didn't like them from financial envy and because they had strong families and closed networks.
• The government didn't like them because the family-fortune system indirectly opposed the socialistic working class structure and made it look bad. Furthermore, the Jews didn't fit in with the pure race program the Nazis had in mind.
• There were some money to be collected for the state.
• From history, nobody seemed to like them anyway.

Now it must sound like I hate socialism, and actually I don't. I praise the parts of socialism that carries the financial freedom and the indepence it gives the individual (compared to forced family dependence). I enjoy many things about European socialism, but I'm also aware that the family-fortune structure seems to be stronger when in competition with socialism.

Read my last post in this thread on how this clash between socialism and family-fortune structures still is evident and a problem today in vast parts of Europe. Today it is just the Middle East immigrants who represent the old ways, if you like. Remember we used to have strong family dependence here in Europe, too.

I am sure there is truth to the above but there are also other facts which suggest a more complicated situation.

1. The Jews in Germany prior to the rise of Hitler seemed to have been significantly integrated into the normal German society. They served in the military and often married gentile Germans. This suggests to me that at least part of what went on was the unigue result of a ruthless, charismatic leader that played a very significant role in exacerbating any anti-semitism that existed prior to his rise to power.

2. Several other groups were targetted by the Nazis for destruction. These included the Jehovah's Witnesses and the Roma (Gypsies). This suggests to me that at least part of what was going on here was that a racial purification paradiigm became established and the transgressions of a particular group were less important than the fact that they just weren't ethnically pure German by the standards of the Nazis.

 

[Thomas]

I am sure there is truth to the above but there are also other facts which suggest a more complicated situation.

1. The Jews in Germany prior to the rise of Hitler seemed to have been significantly integrated into the normal German society. They served in the military and often married gentile Germans. This suggests to me that at least part of what went on was the unigue result of a ruthless, charismatic leader that played a very significant role in exacerbating any anti-semitism that existed prior to his rise to power.

Agreed. But it was those who didn't want to integrate that stole the picture from the integrated ones. This is what usually happens for immigrants world wide.

2. Several other groups were targetted by the Nazis for destruction. These included the Jehovah's Witnesses and the Roma (Gypsies). This suggests to me that at least part of what was going on here was that a racial purification paradiigm became established and the transgressions of a particular group were less important than the fact that they just weren't ethnically pure German by the standards of the Nazis.

Definately so. I mentioned the pure race program race briefly in my last post, but it is again a large issue, and I will now try to make it short.

That the Germans had just lost World War 1, was a crisis for the population. Not only did they have to deal with massive inflation, they also had to deal with the defeat itself. So to restore the national pride, they looked back in history and naturally focused strongly on events like The battle in the Teutoburger forest around the year 9 CE where the Roman Northern Legions were annihilated in an attempt to invade Germania. And Roman writtings like Tacitus' Germania which praised the Germanic tribes for their ethics and culture became very popular among those who sought to regain their pride. Tacitus' Germania speaks of a pure race with high courage and solid ethical standards (compared to the Romans), and this became a guideline of sorts, and to the Nazis, this guideline justified cleaning the house in a most brutal manner. The Nazis could blame unpure races for a lot of things in Germany, because according to Tacitus it had all once been more or less perfect.

In short, they dwelled in history to restore their pride, but sadly it became one of the most gruesome restorations in the history of mankind. I for one like to study the Germanic tribes as I come from one of them, but I often fear that people consider me a Neo-Nazi when I try to demolish the myth of club swinging, fur dressed cavemen that still lives on in movies like Gladiator. And I can thank the Nazis for that.

I'm sure we can keep on adding reasons for the holocaust, but I believe we got some of the most important factors on the table now.

 

[davefoc]

Thanks for the reply Thomas. The article that you linked to about Tacitus interesting.

One slightly off the topic thought I have had for awhile is how the relationship between the Arabs and the Germans might have evolved if Germany had not been defeated.

Genetically, the Arabs might have been viewed as pure Jews (or visa versa). The Jews that Hitler were killing were genetically mixed with European ancestry. So what exactly was Hitler targetting? The Jewish genes? It seems so based on the racial stereotyping that was going on. How would he have dealt with the Arabs who he was making alliances with when the shooting stopped?

The craziness of the Nazi goals makes a question like this impossible to answer I suppose. Looking back on this situation, even given a Hitler non-defeat it seems that murder and destruction that he initiated would have gone on almost unabated until Germany was eventually destroyed by the costs of maintaining their empire.

 

[pipelineaudio]

I'm sorry if I offended you. However, I do see people who view Mexican immigrants in a derogatory way whether legal or illegal. I don't agree with them. However the discrimination exists. Also I do mean immigrant:

immigrant.
im·mi·grant ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-grnt)
n.

1. A person who leaves one country to settle permanently in another.
2. A plant or animal that establishes itself in an area where it previously did not exist.

I do not wish to disrespect your Mexican heritage. However, if one moves from Mexico to live in the United States permanently, they are an immigrant. While I understand what your point, I refuse to stop using the proper term to describe someone who immigrates to this country simply because it may offend someone.

Well if we go by that then, if you ever had sex I call you a rapist

I mean, rape means to have sex with someone right? Same as to invade means to go somewhere eslse right?

Invaders and LEGAL immigrants are two different things

 

[bob_kark]

Well if we go by that then, if you ever had sex I call you a rapist

I mean, rape means to have sex with someone right? Same as to invade means to go somewhere eslse right?

Invaders and LEGAL immigrants are two different things

Wrong.

rape ( P ) Pronunciation Key (rp)
n.

1. The crime of forcing another person to submit to sex acts, especially sexual intercourse.
2. The act of seizing and carrying off by force; abduction.
3. Abusive or improper treatment; violation: a rape of justice.

I certainly agree that there is a difference between legal immigrants and illegal immigrants. However, they are both immigrants.

 

[pipelineaudio]

Wrong.

rape ( P ) Pronunciation Key (rp)
n.

1. The crime of forcing another person to submit to sex acts, especially sexual intercourse.
2. The act of seizing and carrying off by force; abduction.
3. Abusive or improper treatment; violation: a rape of justice.

I certainly agree that there is a difference between legal immigrants and illegal immigrants. However, they are both immigrants.

I certainly agree that there is a difference between rape and consensual sex, however they are both intercourse

 

[bob_kark]

I certainly agree that there is a difference between rape and consensual sex, however they are both intercourse

I certainly agree that there is a difference between cats and dogs, however they are both animals.

How long do you want to go in circles here?

 

[davefoc]

Thomas wrote:

I'm sure we can keep on adding reasons for the holocaust, but I believe we got some of the most important factors on the table now.

That was my reaction to what has been written previously also. It seems like most of the main reasons had been touched on. I think the issue of anti-semitism and the reasons for the holocaust have been conflated a bit in this thread. They aren't quite the same I think.

Anyway this is a summary based mostly on previous posts of why the German genocide against the Jews happened.

1. Anti-semitism existed in Germany based on:
a. Jews were a minority and minorities often are targets of discrimination and resentment by majority population.
b. Unigue relationship between Judaism and Christianity that led to some particular contempt for Jewish population. Possibly a holdover for anti-semitic notions in Christianity from inclusions of anti-Jewish propaganda in earliest Christian writings.
c. Jewish roles in professions that were seen as exploitive by some in Germany
d. Jewish involvement with communism.
e. Involvement of some Jews with Zionism. (not mentioned previously in this thread, but the subject of at least one contentious thread on the subject previously).
2. Despite all the above, Jewish anti-semitism prior to rise of Hitler was offset by high levels of assimilation of the Jewish population into German society.
3. The high levels of violence created by Hitler's early campaigns of murder against the disabled population worked to overcome some of society's normal resistance to mass murder.
4. Hitler, synergistically used a combination of arguments for racial purity and anti-semitism as one means of unifying the German population for his military goals.
5. Once a culture of high violvence had been established where fears for one's survival helped overcome the normal tendency of people to be somewhat altruistic and generally opposed to the murder of others Hitler was able to establish a national policy of murder based on his racist ideas.

 

[Dustin Kesselberg]

Jews are blowing up hundreds of innocent civilians and someone has the balls to start another "Feel bad for the jews" thread?


Good grief...

 

[bob_kark]

Jews are blowing up hundreds of innocent civilians and someone has the balls to start another "Feel bad for the jews" thread?


Good grief...

How do you see this as a "Feel bad for the jews" thread? The discrimination of Jews is well documented. We're simply discussing the possible causes of this. If you want to start a thread asking "Why do people hate Arabs?" feel free to do so.

 

[Dustin Kesselberg]

How do you see this as a "Feel bad for the jews" thread? The discrimination of Jews is well documented. We're simply discussing the possible causes of this. If you want to start a thread asking "Why do people hate Arabs?" feel free to do so.

There are dozens of threads about discrimination against the jews.


This thread was simply started at this particular time because the Jews are killing so many people. The thread starter just wants the attention taken away from the fact the jews are murdering hundreds of people and wants people to remember jews are discriminated against.





"People of the jury, The defendant may of brutally killed that whole family..But don't forget he was made fun of as a child!"


Can you say "Red herring"?

 

[webfusion]

Jews are blowing up hundreds of innocent civilians...

That is a false statement.

The government of the State of Israel, which represents many different segments of a multi-cultural and multi-religious society, has instructed their Defense Forces, whose members encompass Muslims, Jews, Christians and other religions, to act to stop unprovoked missile attacks upon the citizens of the State, by islamic terrorists who operate from within civilian areas of gaza and Lebanon.

So, Dustin, it is not "jews" who are acting as a group, it is Israelis of many different religious persuasions in the IDF; and they are not "blowing up" hundreds of innocent civilians -- the civilians are collateral to the IDF blowing up the terrorists who are illegally using these civilians for cover.

That has been repeatedly pointed out in various threads, and it seems highly unlikely that you missed that basic explanation being given over and over here on JREF Forums....

However, for your edification:
The IDF said it had warned residents of Qana to leave and that Hezbollah bore responsibility for using the town center as a base of operations to fire rockets at Israel.
PM Olmert confirmed that he has seen video evidence (taken from IAF observation drones) that Qana was used as a Hezbollah base for launching hundreds of rockets at Israel.

 

[bob_kark]

There are dozens of threads about discrimination against the jews.

This thread was simply started at this particular time because the Jews are killing so many people. The thread starter just wants the attention taken away from the fact the jews are murdering hundreds of people and wants people to remember jews are discriminated against.

"People of the jury, The defendant may of brutally killed that whole family..But don't forget he was made fun of as a child!"

Can you say "Red herring"?

That's a fairly bold claim. Do you have any evidence to support your theory?

 

[TragicMonkey]

This thread was simply started at this particular time because the Jews are killing so many people. The thread starter just wants the attention taken away from the fact the jews are murdering hundreds of people and wants people to remember jews are discriminated against.

Yeah, the Global Jewish Conspiracy International Cabal Of Evil really gives a crap what Dustin is reading on JREF, and is desperately plotting to make him think differently.

 

[Dustin Kesselberg]

That is a false statement.

The government of the State of Israel, which represents many different segments of a multi-cultural and multi-religious society, has instructed their Defense Forces, whose members encompass Muslims, Jews, Christians and other religions, to act to stop unprovoked missile attacks upon the citizens of the State, by islamic terrorists who operate from within civilian areas of gaza and Lebanon.

So, Dustin, it is not "jews" who are acting as a group, it is Israelis of many different religious persuasions in the IDF; and they are not "blowing up" hundreds of innocent civilians -- the civilians are collateral to the IDF blowing up the terrorists who are illegally using these civilians for cover.

That has been repeatedly pointed out in various threads, and it seems highly unlikely that you missed that basic explanation being given over and over here on JREF Forums....

However, for your edification:
The IDF said it had warned residents of Qana to leave and that Hezbollah bore responsibility for using the town center as a base of operations to fire rockets at Israel.
PM Olmert confirmed that he has seen video evidence (taken from IAF observation drones) that Qana was used as a Hezbollah base for launching hundreds of rockets at Israel.

You are a glutton for punishment aren't you? You continue to state the same old refuted arguments as if they were fact...


I'll spare you the punishment and myself the time of refuting your nonsense.

 

[Dustin Kesselberg]

That's a fairly bold claim. Do you have any evidence to support your theory?

Why else would someone start a "Why do people hate jews?" thread at this time when the jews are killing so many people?


No other explanation than to divert the attention from the crimes israel is commiting.

 

[Pardalis]

That is a false statement.

The government of the State of Israel, which represents many different segments of a multi-cultural and multi-religious society, has instructed their Defense Forces, whose members encompass Muslims, Jews, Christians and other religions, to act to stop unprovoked missile attacks upon the citizens of the State, by islamic terrorists who operate from within civilian areas of gaza and Lebanon.

So, Dustin, it is not "jews" who are acting as a group, it is Israelis of many different religious persuasions in the IDF; and they are not "blowing up" hundreds of innocent civilians -- the civilians are collateral to the IDF blowing up the terrorists who are illegally using these civilians for cover.

Funny that you make such a distinction now. Israel is commonly considered a Jewish state. And I noticed that usually whenever it is attacked, you don't make such a distinction.

The International comitty has repeatedly asked for a cease-fire. Someone should stand down, one must have the courage to do the first move. Of course Hizbollah, by it's nature, will never do that, so it's up to Israel.

 

[Dustin Kesselberg]

The International comitty has repeatedly asked for a cease-fire. Someone should stand down, one must have the courage to do the first move. Of course Hizbollah, by it's nature, will never do that, so it's up to Israel.

Oh no..Israel can't stand down. Afterall they're defending themselves. Why should they stop killing innocent children and defending themselves? Why doesn't the terrorest forces of hezbollah seek a diplomatic solution and ceacefire? You can't expect Israel to do it!