Mineta's testimony not part of 9/11 report

ARubberChickenWithAPulley said:
The report says that "the Vice President entered the underground tunnel leading to the shelter at 9:37. Once inside, Vice President Cheney and the agents paused in an area of the tunnel that had a secure phone, a bench, and television." The report later states that Cheney arrived in the shelter conference room at 9:58. It seems likely, therefore, that Cheney was getting his updates on the status of the plane while he was in the tunnel and that that was the location that Mineta was referring to.
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Yes, and this completely contradicts Mineta's testimony. He arrived around 9:20. Cheney was already there. The conversation about the plane didn't start until about five minutes after Mineta arrived. This is not a time discrepency. According to the official 9/11 report, this event that Mineta described did not even take place.
 
Mutton-Head said:
I understand your time analysis Gumboot. You're right, the times given by Mineta are an approximation. But my question still stands as to why the whole Mineta testimony is ignored in the official report. Because the official report claims that Cheney arrived at PEOC at 9:58, twenty minutes after 77 hit the Pentagon. According to the official report, The conversation that Mineta described couldn't have even taken place.
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Well I have a question...

Why does it matter?

Maybe his testimony really was lost due to a "snafu". Maybe whoever provided Cheney's times was completely wrong. Cheney himself has reported on National Television that he was in the bunker when AA77 hit the Pentagon, so clearly HE doesn't think he arrived there at 0958.

The common logic by CTers is that producing enough errors in the details will produce an overall error in the big picture. But if those errors are irrelevant, you can combine as many as you want. It won't mean a thing.

-Andrew
 
Mutton-Head said:
Yes, and this completely contradicts Mineta's testimony. He arrived around 9:20. Cheney was already there. The conversation about the plane didn't start until about five minutes after Mineta arrived. This is not a time discrepency. According to the official 9/11 report, this event that Mineta described did not even take place.
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Read the footnotes about how the timing of Cheney's movements and the activities in the PEOC were cross-referenced.
 
gumboot said:
Well I have a question...

Why does it matter?

Maybe his testimony really was lost due to a "snafu". Maybe whoever provided Cheney's times was completely wrong. Cheney himself has reported on National Television that he was in the bunker when AA77 hit the Pentagon, so clearly HE doesn't think he arrived there at 0958.

The common logic by CTers is that producing enough errors in the details will produce an overall error in the big picture. But if those errors are irrelevant, you can combine as many as you want. It won't mean a thing.

-Andrew
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Sorry, but I'm an engineer by trade, and we know the importance of being accurate.

Maybe his testimony really was lost due to a "snafu".
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Hahahahaha... That's funny. I like all of your maybes. Oh well, it's only a massive criminal investigation. We're only trying to find out how 19 hijackers brought the American military to its knees. So what if we loose a few pieces of testimony, or can't keep track of when events occured.
 
Hahahahaha... That's funny. I like all of your maybes. Oh well, it's only a massive criminal investigation. We're only trying to find out how 19 hijackers brought the American military to its knees. So what if we loose a few pieces of testimony, or can't keep track of when events occured.
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I am not sure in what way Mineta's testimony can be considered "lost." I pulled it up very quickly after a search on Google, from the 911 Commission's official website. The Commission used the notes taken by Cheney's staff, several official logs from the various place Cheney was at, phone records, etc. to attempt to reconstruct his timeline. They prioritized the logs, whose entire purpose is to document exact times and events, over someone trying to recall exact times from memory. There is nothing particularly odd about that.
 
Mutton-Head said:
Sorry, but I'm an engineer by trade, and we know the importance of being accurate.
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The 9/11 Commission Report was an overview and summary of events. The major detailed investigations in various aspects of the event were still ongoing at the time. Anyone who thinks the commission report is a precise 100% accurate account of EXACTLY what happened is stupid.



Mutton-Head said:
Hahahahaha... That's funny. I like all of your maybes. Oh well, it's only a massive criminal investigation. We're only trying to find out how 19 hijackers brought the American military to its knees. So what if we loose a few pieces of testimony, or can't keep track of when events occured.
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What nonsense. The 9/11 Commission Report was not a criminal investigation. The Criminal Investigation is being conducted by the FBI, and as far as I am aware it is still ongoing.

-Andrew
 
Double post..

I wonder if seconds seemed like minutes and time seemed to almost stand still in such an intense moment.

What time was it during that crazy meeting months ago when so many things were going on....I'll take an educated guess.
 
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ARubberChickenWithAPulley said:
I am not sure in what way Mineta's testimony can be considered "lost." I pulled it up very quickly after a search on Google, from the 911 Commission's official website. The Commission used the notes taken by Cheney's staff, several official logs from the various place Cheney was at, phone records, etc. to attempt to reconstruct his timeline. They prioritized the logs, whose entire purpose is to document exact times and events, over someone trying to recall exact times from memory. There is nothing particularly odd about that.
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ARCWAP, you must be incorrect. Mutton-Head is the accurate one here, and he certainly wouldn't say Mineta's testimony was lost when it wasn't, and he certainly wouldn't imply that one person's memory of the time of day trumps multiple cross-referenced sources if it weren't true.
 
Gravy said:
ARCWAP, you must be incorrect. Mutton-Head is the accurate one here, and he certainly wouldn't say Mineta's testimony was lost when it wasn't, and he certainly wouldn't imply that one person's memory of the time of day trumps multiple cross-referenced sources if it weren't true.
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According to the 9/11 report, the event that Mineta described: The young man keeping Cheney informed about the plane approaching, and the question "Does the order still stand?"
According to the 9/11 report, this event never took place.
 
Mutton-Head said:
Hahahaha.... touche.

ouch.

Let me clarify, I'm an electrical engineer.
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I'll also clarify. My reference to your former post concerned your knowing the importance of being accurate, not what kind of engineer you are.
 
Gravy said:
I'll also clarify. My reference to your former post concerned your knowing the importance of being accurate, not what kind of engineer you are.
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Yes, and that's why when I was shown my errors in physics, I owned up to them. It was also an informal discussion, not an official report.
 
Mutton-Head said:
According to the 9/11 report, the event that Mineta described: The young man keeping Cheney informed about the plane approaching, and the question "Does the order still stand?"
According to the 9/11 report, this event never took place.
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And you conclude that because Mineta's testimony isn't included in the report?
Edit: Ah, my bad. I'm reading that section now. Be back soon.
 
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ARubberChickenWithAPulley said:
I am not sure in what way Mineta's testimony can be considered "lost." I pulled it up very quickly after a search on Google, from the 911 Commission's official website. The Commission used the notes taken by Cheney's staff, several official logs from the various place Cheney was at, phone records, etc. to attempt to reconstruct his timeline. They prioritized the logs, whose entire purpose is to document exact times and events, over someone trying to recall exact times from memory. There is nothing particularly odd about that.
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Mineta describes an event that is missing from the report. He describes Cheney monitoring the approach of flight 77. This occurs about five minutes after Mineta arrives. The event shows that Cheney was aware that 77 was approaching, and that there was a particular order associated with that plane. It could not have been a shoot-down order, because the report says that order was not given until after 10:00.
 
Mutton-Head said:
...Oh well, it's only a massive criminal investigation. We're only trying to find out how 19 hijackers brought the American military to its knees...
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How was the American military brought "to its knees?"

Really, I would stay away from the decanter of hyperbole when at the wheel of your computer.
 
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