Islam in Britain - One Year Later

ImaginalDisc said:
Even if your assertion is correct, 24% of 3.1% is only 0.74%. That's less than one percent. That is by defintion a tiny minority.
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24% of an entire population is a large minority

0.74% is a relatively small minority.

Since the poll was about the British Muslim Population then its 24%.

In any case, 400,000 people willing to aid and abet terrorism is a stonkingly massive number, giving the seriousness of the matter.
 
Dcdrac said:
I have seen her parade her nonesens across the national press for twenty years Phillips does not let facts deflect her at all.
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Please answer the question without resorting to ad hom attacks. Is this statement...
There ARE truly moderate British Muslims, but they are a frightened and powerless minority within a minority, and to date they have no representative institutions.
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...true or false?
 
Jon_in_london said:
Who are you to say what is a true and what is a flase version of Islam?

Are you the Ayatollah or sumink?
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That it is acceptable to kill the innocent in the name of islam and no i am not but i ahve taken time to talk with muslims about islam to find out what their beiefs, they are many and varied, but the version that lot subscribed to is almost unversially rejecetd by the majority of muslims.

The first time i talked with an imam was in my profssional capacity at the time working in counter terrorism, we needed to know what we were tackling and as usual the picture is never as simple as people think, go ahead group blame all the muslims see thm as all suppoerting terrorism if you want to, but you find that most muslims just want a quiet life. Forget what the media and the like of madhatter Melanie say go and find out for yourself.
 
BPSCG said:
Please answer the question without resorting to ad hom attacks. Is this statement... ...true or false?
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She does not know herself i ahve read her articles and even the book and I myself have talked with muslims up and down the uK, I know she is talking rubbish.
 
BPSCG said:
Is this statement... ...true or false?
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according to the OP data, and depending how you define "TRULY moderate" I would say that statement is false, 44% of Muslims surveyed could not see any "reasons" for the London bombings,a minority, but more than a "tiny minority".
 
Dcdrac said:
She does not know herself i ahve read her articles and even the book and I myself have talked with muslims up and down the uK, I know she is talking rubbish.
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So you are saying her claim that "[t]here ARE truly moderate British Muslims, but they are a frightened and powerless minority within a minority, and to date they have no representative institutions" is false.

Since you know this, please supply the names of some moderate British Muslim institutions, so the rest of us can support them.
 
brodski said:
according to the OP data, and depending how you define "TRULY moderate" I would say that statement is false, 44% of Muslims surveyed could not see any "reasons" for the London bombings,a minority, but more than a "tiny minority".
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Even if they do see reasons for the bombings, that doesn't make them any less moderate. The question of whether they're "moderate," in this context, would be whether they supported the bombings, or would help to do so. Since, according to the OP, "6% believed that the 7/7 attacks had been justified," that means that 94% did not believe they were justified. Which would imply that the claim that moderates are a "tiny minority" is simply hogwash.

Of course, this would be much simpler if we were working on a common definition of "moderate." Is a "moderate" merely someone who does not support terrorism?
 
Dcdrac said:
That it is acceptable to kill the innocent in the name of islam and no i am not but i ahve taken time to talk with muslims about islam to find out what their beiefs, they are many and varied, but the version that lot subscribed to is almost unversially rejecetd by the majority of muslims.
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If their beliefs are many and varied which particular version is the true one? I know about the majority. Based on the OP, that majority would be about 76%.

Dcdrac said:
The first time i talked with an imam was in my profssional capacity at the time working in counter terrorism, we needed to know what we were tackling and as usual the picture is never as simple as people think, go ahead group blame all the muslims see thm as all suppoerting terrorism if you want to, but you find that most muslims just want a quiet life. Forget what the media and the like of madhatter Melanie say go and find out for yourself.
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Where was I "group blaming muslims?"

Excuse me while I consider you a bit of a Walter Mitty. "Working in counter terrorism" indeed.
 
I t was called Transport Security it was part of what was then DETR and what bacame the DFT.

And I did not say you were, that was not aimed at you specifically just against the genral feeling abroad that all muslims must be terrorists.
 
The statement was issued by Dr Muhammad Abdul Bari, secretary general of the Muslim Council of Britain...
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This guy?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...110.xml&sSheet=/news/2006/06/10/ixuknews.html

His aim, he says, will be to encourage Britain to adopt more Muslim ways, as well as to encourage Muslims to be good British citizens. He thinks that non-Muslim Britons would benefit from having arranged marriages and espousing stronger family values; they would also do well to stop drinking and gambling and to follow many of the teachings of Islam.
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Muslims are not going to convince people they are moderates when they profess a goal of imposing their religious beliefs on an entire nation.
 
Looks like Britain has an islamo-fascist problem. Is it that these extremists dislike the fact that Britian is a non-islamic state or do they have some other grievance?
 
Phillips: The great question! The short answer is — I don’t know; but we have got to try, otherwise it’s all over. What we should be doing is halting the tide of mass (and largely illegal) immigration that is changing the face of Britain. We should abolish the doctrine of multiculturalism that is destroying British identity and reassert instead our overarching values as a democratic nation rooted in the particulars of history, religion, laws, culture, customs and traditions — a nation which values and respects all minorities, but expects them to subscribe to that overarching national identity. And we should stopthe preaching and teaching of sedition, incitement to hatred and violence and war against the west that is presently continuing unchecked in mosques and madrassahs, on caampus, in youth clubs and in prisons and either prosecute the perpetrators or throw them out of the country. All this can be done. The Brititsh government has so far flinched from doing it.
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Abolish the doctrine of multiculturalism? Why? I don't see how this has anything to do with multiculturalism.
 
Jaggy Bunnet said:
Then you do not accept any religious group which believes people should follow their religious teaching can ever be moderate. OK.
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When extremist members of a religious group are murdering people indiscriminately around the world to enforce adherence to their beliefs and then a majority of adherents to that faith profess to support those acts, I'd have to answer your query with an emphatic "No."

And where does "imposing" come from? Looks to me like he used the word "encourage".
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I didn't just say "imposing." I specifically stated "profess a goal of imposing." Dr. Bari apparently doesn't want Islamic values only for those willing to subscribe to them, he wants them applied to everyone. That's a goal of imposing Islam on people.
 
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