Loose Change

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Hahahaha! That's exactly what I was thinking. If I posted over there that I'd found an error in the first 2 minutes of Loose Change and decided not to watch the rest because of that, they'd mock me for pages.

Hmmmmm, suddenly considering registering an account...
 
Pardalis said:
"I'll go feed my budgies" as in "I'll go and do a stress-free activity";)
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Ah, that makes sense. Real budgies certainly wouldn't be safe around a cat like you. I really like that phrase. Very soothing. I almost smell cookies baking.
If I could post over there I'd tell Terrorcell, "Somebody needs to feed their budgies!"
 
How do the folks at Loose Change explain why they haven't been shut down by the government yet?

After all, if it's all one giant government conspiracy with people being intimidated and shut up, it's awfully odd that the Loose Changers are being allowed to have their own website/forum/open lounges/meetings across the country.
 
OMG, now they're saying the anthrax attacks were intended to kill some photographer who found some bad pictures of the Bush twins.

How can they say this stuff and keep a straight face?

Edit: "found" (apparently), not "took"
 
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Regnad Kcin said:
Gravy, someone on that thread criticized your "10 takeoffs and 13 landings" comment (and then said he/she went no further with your work because of it) due to your ignorance of touch-and-go practice. That may be something to consider.
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CurtC said:
Consider? What's wrong with the comment? I used to fly planes, way back in the '70s, but even way back then we had touch-and-go practice. If you count the "touch" as a landing, you'd have to count the "go" as a takeoff!
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I know what he meant, you know what he meant, and I'll even guess the poster at LC knew what he meant. The risk, when critiquing the accuracy of another's cherished doctrine, is that you will be criticised yourself, so it's best to strive to be above it.

Look, I'm in awe of Gravy's efforts; he's to be applauded and toasted. My comment above is merely an observation. Something along the lines of "'Loose Change' claims there were 10 takeoffs and 13 landings. Seems like an error right there. Unless they forgot to indicate that some of these were accomplished during touch-and-go practice. It would be nice if 'Loose Change' was clear and thorough on all such points so a viewer would not have to guess. Moving on..." would have preserved Gravy's wry observation, as well as pre-empted the suggestion his critique is flawed.
 
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I'm really enjoying the gleeful pride they're taking in shutting down all the United 93 forums, too. Not discussing their evidence and opinions civilly -- but actually getting them SHUT DOWN.

Who, I wonder is really stifling all the dissent here? Who are the real fascists?
 
Pardalis said:
"I'll go feed my budgies" as in "I'll go and do a stress-free activity";)
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Another good one is "keed the fats", from a conversation my under-aged brother had with my dad when he came home drunk one night.

DAD: What are you doing out here?
BROTHER: I was just going to keed the fats. (feed the cats)
DAD: (After tense pause) Don't let your mother see you like that.
 
Gravy:
Watched it. Xraye, you're going to have to do much, much better than that unless you're just here, like geggy, to express your opinions. This video is your "evidence?"
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No, it wasn't "my" evidence but it's certainly a piece of evidence which I find interesting. I concede to the fact that I haven't properly researched the data, as evident in the fact that I'm coming across many things in this forum which I haven't seen yet.


Kookbreaker:
Its very rude to blunder into a thread without having at least read part of it. Loose Change is a bad joke, even your beloved 'Scholars' aren't too fond of it. Gravy's work has throughly debunked the LC nonsense.
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Ya, I didn't want to wade through all the masses of posts in this thread, but I realize that if I want to make any type of intelligable argument I have to become familiar with the debate. I'm currently only on the 5th page, making notes and checking the links, and I intend on doing thorough research of the points discussed here and on the debunking websight that was created before posting further.

CurtC
You've brought up a lot of points in your first post, so I think it's going to be a little messy and hard to follow here with all the point-specific replies, but we can handle it if you can.
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LOL Ya, deffinatly not a good strategy to confront a forum full of people to debate with, to throw mass amounts of evidence, or rather ammo, at the people I'm about to debate with. I admit that in my previous post I didn't present any substantial arguments.

I value this forum as a resource in understanding responses to the arguments that I'm thus far familiar with, exposure to different interpretations of current evidence, as a possible source of additional evidence that may surface which would be overlooked by the other side, and particularly as a fire-test of evidence that's used to debunk the official story.

Dialectical debate is essential when dealing with such issues, and I believe it's the only way that we can really come to a larger picture of what happened.
 
One good thing from that forum and the Huffington blog is that we were correct from the start regarding Gravy, Chipmunkstew, et al. They are professional trolls; as in paid trolls. They have way too much time on their hands and seem much more passionate about 'debunking' us than the average person would be.
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http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=3962

It's amazing what a warped little world these people live in, isn't it?

I've been accused of being a CIA plant about a dozen times in the last week or so. I've even been accused of being a blood-sucking alien shape-shifter (they have a few David Icke followers in the crowd).

I hate to tell them this... but I ain't gettin paid enough. :p
 
By the way, regardless of which side is right in this debate, I think only a positive result can come from it becoming widly known and widely debated. If it is a governmental conspiracy, the reasons are obvious why that should be known. If it is just a bunch of conspiracy theorists who got all freaked out because they think they have evidence of a cover up, it's also good that the debate becomes more public so that those who get caught up in the conspiracy will be confronted with the truth.
 
Xraye said:
LOL Ya, deffinatly not a good strategy to confront a forum full of people to debate with, to throw mass amounts of evidence, or rather ammo, at the people I'm about to debate with. I admit that in my previous post I didn't present any substantial arguments.

I value this forum as a resource in understanding responses to the arguments that I'm thus far familiar with, exposure to different interpretations of current evidence, as a possible source of additional evidence that may surface which would be overlooked by the other side, and particularly as a fire-test of evidence that's used to debunk the official story.

Dialectical debate is essential when dealing with such issues, and I believe it's the only way that we can really come to a larger picture of what happened.
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I believe as you go through the remaining pages, and as you read Gravy's debunking doc, that you will see that there are no substantial arguments for the LC version of events. You should also see that the Alek, roxdog and geggy are not really arguing in good faith here - they present a "question", but then do not provide any substantive argument before moving on to their next "question".

People here can be remarkably patient. If you present a single idea and thoroughly discuss it, without resorting to "automatic gainsaying", then truly interesting exchanges can take place.

By the way, I appreciated the way you actually asked, over at the LC forum, for evidence that any LCer had been banned from this board with no explanation and no warning. I can assure you, that has not happened.

Good luck at catching up! I routinely find myself 5-10 pages behind on this thread. A lot of people here care deeply about this subject.
 
For those following at home, they've moved the thread.

They created a "SKEPTICS Forum" under the "Loose Change Movie" subheading and moved several threads there -- including the one discussing Gravy's debunking document.
 
Xraye said:
By the way, regardless of which side is right in this debate, I think only a positive result can come from it becoming widly known and widely debated. If it is a governmental conspiracy, the reasons are obvious why that should be known. If it is just a bunch of conspiracy theorists who got all freaked out because they think they have evidence of a cover up, it's also good that the debate becomes more public so that those who get caught up in the conspiracy will be confronted with the truth.
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Very well said and I don't think anyone here will argue with that logic. One thing though, unless you are an expert in the various fields discussed in the supporting documentation (structural engineering, for example), you will need to rely on professional, expert, opinions of others.

It will be very interesting to hear your views regarding the facts and evidence on "both sides of the debate", especially considering the knowledge, experience and credentials of those analyzing the evidence.
 
Xraye said:
I intended to presume that we don't know what happened and thus by "larger picture" I meant the interpretation which accomidates the facts from both sides of the debate.
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As for "facts from both sides," I'm not aware of any from proponents of "Loose Change," at least in respect to advancing their premise.

I welcome your contribution to the discussion.
 
I sure wish I could resist those links to the loose screws board. My eyes bleed every time I go there and then I can't watch hockey playoffs.:(

Anyways my 15 year old daughter has come up with what seems to be a sure way of getting aliens to notice us here on earth. All they have to do is set up a dish to detect "Stupid Waves" rather than gravity waves. That will lead them to the black hole of stupidity and ignorance known as loose change. I mean really is there any other place on earth where people actually take pride and revel in their ignorance and dopeyness?

Wonder what would happen if they actually did get their investigation and it turns out that what did happen was in fact correct? Can you say nuclear implosion?

ETA: or is that nukular?
 
Walk The Line said:
How do the folks at Loose Change explain why they haven't been shut down by the government yet?

After all, if it's all one giant government conspiracy with people being intimidated and shut up, it's awfully odd that the Loose Changers are being allowed to have their own website/forum/open lounges/meetings across the country.
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The basic line of thinking goes something like this:

Whenever a bit of evidence or a fact pops up that appears to contradict the conspiracy theory, that fact is obviously "disinformation" deliberately planted by the conspirators to discredit the conspiracy theorist.

So, the mere existence of the LC forums is conclusive evidence -- simply by virtue of the fact that they haven't been shut down -- that their conspiracy theory must be true.

Q. E. D.

You see this going on with the 757 vs. no-757 camps. One bunch of CTs believes the evidence that an American Airlines 757 hit the Pentagon is so overwhelming that any CT to the contrary must be part of a deliberate misinformation campaign. The other bunch clings tightly to the notion that it wasn't a 757 at all, but merely a 757-shaped object, and yells "liar! liar! pants on fire!" at the other bunch.

It's a strange world they live in.
 
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