"Innocent" civilians?

[ZirconBlue]

Only an idiot would say that


(you're welcome)

Wow! That didn't take long.


(thanks)

 

[Mephisto]

Wow! That didn't take long.


(thanks)

And it couldn't have come from a nicer guy. BTW, sorry for not welcoming you to the forum before - I was ummmm . . . distracted.

 

[Mephisto]

I think these images may be what Art had in mind.

Thanks, Mycroft. I know that Israel has some of the world's best snipers and looking at the photos you've provided, all I see are excellent examples where a sniper's careful aim might make all the difference in the world. It's absolutely clear who is armed and who is not - who is actually and physically engaging the Israelis and who is standing around watching.

Of course, I'll be the first to admit that targets aren't always so careless with their cover & concealment when they know there is a long rifle out there.

 

[The Fool]

Thanks, Mycroft. I know that Israel has some of the world's best snipers and looking at the photos you've provided, all I see are excellent examples where a sniper's careful aim might make all the difference in the world. It's absolutely clear who is armed and who is not - who is actually and physically engaging the Israelis and who is standing around watching.

Of course, I'll be the first to admit that targets aren't always so careless with their cover & concealment when they know there is a long rifle out there.

well there doesn't seem to be a great deal of "Israeli fire" incoming in those photos. They may be pictures of a demonstration of weapons by militants firing into an open field, displaying rockets, mines etc. Hardly looks like a firefight to me otherwise those kids would be legging it....

 

[Mycroft]

Thanks, Mycroft. I know that Israel has some of the world's best snipers and looking at the photos you've provided, all I see are excellent examples where a sniper's careful aim might make all the difference in the world. It's absolutely clear who is armed and who is not - who is actually and physically engaging the Israelis and who is standing around watching.

Of course, I'll be the first to admit that targets aren't always so careless with their cover & concealment when they know there is a long rifle out there.

A few observations:

1) Having a great sniper and having a great sniper where you need one may be two very different things.

2) Sometimes even the sniper might miss.

3) A sniper only gets one shot before the scene becomes a crowded and chaotic melee where you may no longer take sniper shots. Then what do you do with the other six militants who are still purposefully mingled with the civilians only now they're trying to shoot back at you?

4) Let's be honest; that guy in the powder-blue shirt in the last picture? You know, the one with the rocket launcher aimed at his nuts? He's not innocent. He's purposefully helping the militant by providing cover. He may not be at the secret meetings of the He-man Jew-haters club, but for that hour of that day, he's just as much a militant as the guy in the mask. The only difference is when he gets shot he'll become a propaganda tool, and guys like Cleon, Orwell and the rest of the gang are going to moan about how the IDF is always shooting civilians.

5) The rest of the pictures: the civilians are there because they've been taught from birth that "accidently" getting killed is a great thing. It's a free pass to paradise, it's a great propaganda victory against the evil Zionazi pigs, it gets a cash prize for your family, plus all the other Palestinian teenagers will call them a pussy if they don't go along. Take a close look at some of those facial expressions; exactly what you'd expect from a teenager dared to do something he doesn't want to do, but can't say no because he can't face his friends thinking he's not "cool".

This is the reality. So many "civilians" get shot by the IDF because the militants bring them along to the fight. It's part of the plan.

 

[Mycroft]

well there doesn't seem to be a great deal of "Israeli fire" incoming in those photos. They may be pictures of a demonstration of weapons by militants firing into an open field, displaying rockets, mines etc. Hardly looks like a firefight to me otherwise those kids would be legging it....

It’s Palestinian “Heritage Days” folks! It’s fun for the whole family! Come on down, have some kettle corn, bring the kids, there will be games and prizes as we celebrate with pride the values that make our people great!

Oh, wait. No women in those pictures. No small children or old folks either. I guess that can’t be it.

Nice try at whitewashing, though.

 

[The Fool]

It’s Palestinian “Heritage Days” folks! It’s fun for the whole family! Come on down, have some kettle corn, bring the kids, there will be games and prizes as we celebrate with pride the values that make our people great!

Oh, wait. No women in those pictures. No small children or old folks either. I guess that can’t be it.

Nice try at whitewashing, though.

Well, tell us what you suggest those photos are showing? Human shields in a firefight?

 

[Mephisto]

A few observations:

1) Having a great sniper and having a great sniper where you need one may be two very different things.

Well, if this type of action on the part of the Palestinians is routine you would think that snipers would be a part of any Israeli unit involved in confronting human shields.

2) Sometimes even the sniper might miss.

True, but hopefully a GOOD sniper will know when that's a possibility and weigh the chance of hitting the target against the chance of hitting a bystander.

3) A sniper only gets one shot before the scene becomes a crowded and chaotic melee where you may no longer take sniper shots. Then what do you do with the other six militants who are still purposefully mingled with the civilians only now they're trying to shoot back at you?

Multiple snipers? We do it in Iraq, why can't the Israelis figger it out?

4) Let's be honest; that guy in the powder-blue shirt in the last picture? You know, the one with the rocket launcher aimed at his nuts? He's not innocent. He's purposefully helping the militant by providing cover. He may not be at the secret meetings of the He-man Jew-haters club, but for that hour of that day, he's just as much a militant as the guy in the mask. The only difference is when he gets shot he'll become a propaganda tool, and guys like Cleon, Orwell and the rest of the gang are going to moan about how the IDF is always shooting civilians.

To be honest, that looks more like a staged photo than the rest. The backflash around that weapon is considerable and I can't picture anyone having seen that weapon fired is going to be standing either in front of it, or directly behind it. I think he's more guilty for wearing a powder blue sweatsuit than anything else.

5) The rest of the pictures: the civilians are there because they've been taught from birth that "accidently" getting killed is a great thing. It's a free pass to paradise, it's a great propaganda victory against the evil Zionazi pigs, it gets a cash prize for your family, plus all the other Palestinian teenagers will call them a pussy if they don't go along. Take a close look at some of those facial expressions; exactly what you'd expect from a teenager dared to do something he doesn't want to do, but can't say no because he can't face his friends thinking he's not "cool".

To be honest, when I saw those pictures I thought that these are boys being taught the art of war. If they weren't black-hooded men, it would look like dads taking their kids out shooting. They may not be wholly 100% innocent bystanders, BUT they are children and they ARE unarmed. They ARE still considered non-combatants.

This is the reality. So many "civilians" get shot by the IDF because the militants bring them along to the fight. It's part of the plan.

And if they can't kill them there, they can always use restraint to lob a missile into their neighborhood, or use full auto on their weapons to "take care" of the entire crowd.