Does 'rape culture' accurately describe (many) societies?

[Poem]

Just out of curiosity, have you raised any children?

I love and respect my wife immensely, but I also lust after her like I did when we were high school seniors (we've been together 37 years, and she knows how to do that thing that makes me go "wheeeeeelaaaa!!!"). Lust is a natural state. The desire for sex has been heavily selected for by evolution, for obvious reasons, and the desire for sex isn't the problem. The problem is when desire for sex is placed before the desires and/or age of consent of someone else. People don't need to be in love, or in a permanent monogamous relationship for sex to be a healthy, beautiful and joyful experience. Two (or more) consenting adults have every right to have sex "just for fun", and they don't have to have children to do it.

Sure, there is nothing wrong with lust per se - but there is a problem when children pop out and they aren't wanted. Abcent fatherhood is a massive problem is it not? It's come up before.

And the lust that you refer to - that does need taming (in general) does it not?

 

[Poem]

Stalin (and Mao, and Pol Pot etc.) didn't slaughter anyone in the name of atheism, if that's where you're going. He slaughtered them in the name of the brand of Communism he subscribed to (at least nominally), which had, ironically, turned into a religion of its own, complete with unquestionable dogma.

What is your point please?

 

[Poem]

No no no. No one said non-religous people couldn't do bad things. Religious people us religion as a motive to do bad things.

And non-religious people use their ideology to do the same. What is your point?

The vast majority of Christians today don't have a clue what's in their instruction manual othe than a few scattered verses.

Agreed - but what has that to do with what I asked you?

 

[Helen]

I said i don't  watch porn, and that's beause it doesn't do anything for me. I've also said i'm a feminist. Two separate statements. I really dislike your attempt at putting words in my mouth. But then that's part of your MO, of course, and you do it to everyone, in your attempts at getting people to debate each other, instead of you.

You keep referring to the opinions of others, but quoting them doesn't turn their, or your, opinions into facts. That the rights of women and children have never been as respected as they are now in Western democracies is a fact. That there is still a great deal to be done is also a fact. That porn is cause of all the ills of the world is not a fact. That education does not help is not a fact.

People can like porn, and be good parents. People can enjoy all kinds of kinky sex, and be good parents. People can be homo-, bi-, and asexual, and be good parents. People can be heterosexual, and never indulge in lust, or watch porn, and be ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ awful parents.

And again; educate yourself about the atrocities, sexual as well as other kinds, that women and children (and men without influence or power) have been subjected to throughout history. You seem to be unable to understand that even if there is still an awful lot of room for improvement, this moment in history is actually quite a good time to be alive,
even for those that have been powerless, and victims, for nearly all of human history.

 

[Poem]

I said i don't  watch porn, and that's beause it doesn't do anything for me. I've also said i'm a feminist. Two separate statements.

Statements that you grouped together:

I don't watch porn. I am a feminist. Thank you for your attention to this matter.

..but, ok, I accept the reason why you don't watch.

You keep referring to the opinions of others, but quoting them doesn't turn their, or your, opinions into facts. That the rights of women and children have never been as respected as they are now in Western democracies is a fact. That there is still a great deal to be done is also a fact. That porn is cause of all the ills of the world is not a fact. That education does not help is not a fact.

And no acknowledgement of what I posted...national emergency and rape decriminalisation.

People can like porn, and be good parents.

Sure

People can enjoy all kinds of kinky sex, and be good parents. People can be homo-, bi-, and asexual, and be good parents.

Sure.

People can be heterosexual, and never indulge in lust, or watch porn, and be ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ awful parents.

Very true.

And again; educate yourself about the atrocities, sexual as well as other kinds, that women and children (and men without influence or power) have been subjected to throughout history. You seem to be unable to understand that even if there is still an awful lot of room for improvement, this moment in history is actually quite a good time to be alive,
even for those that have been powerless, and victims, for nearly all of human history.

Emperor's new clothes moment.

 

[Poem]

I said i don't  watch porn, and that's beause it doesn't do anything for me. I've also said i'm a feminist. Two separate statements. I really dislike your attempt at putting words in my mouth. But then that's part of your MO, of course, and you do it to everyone, in your attempts at getting people to debate each other, instead of you.

Which words Helen? This is what I wrote:

...and VAWG, as I have repeatedly said, is a NATIONAL EMERGENCY in the UK and rape has been effectively decriminalised...and the internet is flooded with misogynistic porn, underage roleplay porn...you-name-it porn...and kids are watching it...

Civilised? Not a chance.

And all from someone who says:
I don't watch porn. I am a feminist.

...but that it is not because of misogyny???

Which words did I put in your mouth?

 

[Helen]

When you tried to pretend that I don't watch porn because of misogyny. I have long since accepted that our culture is full of misogyny, and that it's impossible to avoid bumping into it.

And as for the rest of your blatherings; educate yourself. You seem almost impossibly ignorant about the history of human sexuality, especially as it pertains to rape, and you do a terrible job of trying to demonstrate that your opinions are based on facts. You are of course free to have those opinions, but that doesn't make them facts.

 

[Poem]

When you tried to pretend that I don't watch porn because of misogyny. I have long since accepted that our culture is full of misogyny, and that it's impossible to avoid bumping into it.

I was acknowledging that you said it was not because of misogyny...but since you formerly tied your feminism to not watching porn I was confused. Now you have clarified your postion.

And as for the rest of your blatherings; educate yourself. You seem almost impossibly ignorant about the history of human sexuality, especially as it pertains to rape, and you do a terrible job of trying to demonstrate that your opinions are based on facts. You are of course free to have those opinions, but that doesn't make them facts.

That humanity has historically behaved atrociously isn't disputed.

...and precisely zero engagement from you on specific points I made.

 

[Poem]

I have long since accepted that our culture is full of misogyny, and that it's impossible to avoid bumping into it.

Why are you just accepting it Helen? Yes, our culture is full of it - it is celebrated in porn almost as a default. We shouldn't be accepting it; not If we want to change the mess society is in.

 

[Helen]

Why are you just accepting it Helen? Yes, our culture is full of it - it is celebrated in porn almost as a default. We shouldn't be accepting it; not If we want to change the mess society is in.

Well, I quite like reading books, watching films, and so on. That does not in any way mean that I haven't done what I can to change things.

The world isn't black and white, Poem, it's an amazing number of shades of grey.

 

[Poem]

That does not in any way mean that I haven't done what I can to change things.

I have long since accepted that our culture is full of misogyny, and that it's impossible to avoid bumping into it.

 

[catsmate]

No, it musn't.

And I have no idea who Vera Baird is, or why I should take her word for anything. Please tell the thread why I should.

Former UKian politician and lawyer, short served Victims Commissioner and non-reformer of the CCRC.

 

[catsmate]

Go read the thread.

So you can't summarise your claims....

 

[Poem]

Former UKian politician and lawyer, short served Victims Commissioner and non-reformer of the CCRC.

What's the conviction rate for rape in the UK?

 

[catsmate]

What's your point?

Sex education is bad.

 

[catsmate]

Summing it up would be tautologous.

You don't seem to understand what a 'tautology' actually is.

 

[Poem]

So you can't summarise your claims....

Often do. Does that mean you are going to reveal what CP means...because you think posters should respond to requests for clarification?

 

[Poem]

Sex education is bad.

And the details of what's wrong and an the fix are what? Should be easy shouldn't it?

 

[Poem]

You don't seem to understand what a 'tautology' actually is.

You haven't explained why I don't understand. Ok, please let the thread know.

 

[catsmate]

...or that Stalin slaughtered the millions that he did (20 million)....

What has Stalin got to do with anything?

Do you tell your Christian friends that you think they are freaks?

Personally I've never concealed my view that religious belief is a form of mental illness.