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Apollo 11 Moon Landing Revisited: Hoax ~vs~ Debunk

No, you keep assuming that because you don't know something that I don't either, but here's the amusing thing: I was already six steps ahead of you.

Ah, the "six steps ahead" bollocks makes a comeback! Perhaps you'll be so kind as to inform my "mean sd" ( :ROFLMAO: ) mind how you're so far ahead of me (and presumably everyone else in this thread). And at the same time, inform us of what shutter speeds and aperture stops you'd generallyneed to use to photograph stars from the surface of the Moon.
 
A bad workman always blames his tools ~ old adage.
The cameras worked perfectly as designed. The astronauts performed well according to their training. The physics and chemistry of photochemical photography worked as expected.

Yet you cannot bring yourself to admit that the "expert in photography" Marcus Allen made a totally bonkers claim under color of that expertise that you confirmed was wrong.
 
WD Clinger already linked to it, but here you go:


Some of it got so bad that The Prestige and I were agreeing with each other, which rarely happens.

Much of it can be taken as a savage indictment of the English education system at a certain time and in a certain place. Fortunately most of the rest of us lived elsewhere in the country.

I lived and went to school close to Middlesex, but the differences are that my school was very good, and I was (and am) an intelligent person.
 
No, you keep assuming that because you don't know something that I don't either, but here's the amusing thing: I was already six steps ahead of you.
No, you're not the smartest person in the room.

You obviously got your figure for the shutter speed from an AI. And by now you've certainly asked your AI what the shutter speed would have to be when photographing stars from the lunar surface. The problem is likely that you asked your AI after you told us it would be markedly different on the Moon—which of course it won't be. As usual, you're six steps away from everyone in the wrong direction.
 
I saw that youtube video about the same time I posted it here. The youtuber is not responsible for my views but it is interesting to watch the analysis.
The lessons you should have learned from this include the following.

First, someone who claims to have a strong academic background in psychology shouldn't be posting videos from YouTube cranks when the academic literature says something completely different. If you stumbled onto the video and then immediately posted it, then you probably didn't look at the other videos to determine just what a crank your source was.

Second, it's almost always a good idea to see whether your source says something that contradicts your larger point, or otherwise presents information that's going to be problematic for you to disavow later.

Third and most important: when people who claim they know what someone is lying about can't agree on what that someone is lying about, maybe that casts doubt on the whole practice of guessing what people are lying about.
 
WD Clinger already linked to it, but here you go:


Some of it got so bad that The Prestige and I were agreeing with each other, which rarely happens.

Much of it can be taken as a savage indictment of the English education system at a certain time and in a certain place. Fortunately most of the rest of us lived elsewhere in the country.
There's nowt wrong with Middlesex. We gave you the Carry On films, Thunderbirds, Elton John, Brian May, Russell Grant. [ed.]

I'll get my coat.
 
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I thought Weaver spoke a lot of sense and, unlike the giggling Pat Norris and Tony Cook, had actually given it thought. Sounded like the voice of reason (or maybe it was his no-frills flat Yorkshire accent).
NASA did indeed supply information to Stanley Kubrick, at Kubrick's request, because he was making a generation-defining space epic. A lot of it was photography from uncrewed probes to the Moon, so that Kubrick could get his visual effects right. That's perfectly natural. The notion that it was for Kubrick to fake the Apollo photography is pure imagination—an early internet joke that some people took all too seriously.

Weaver had a very fertile imagination, which he has a hard time keeping separate from fact. And yes, Weaver has been giving all this a lot of thought: he was obsessed with the notion of a hoaxed Apollo for probably close to thirty years. He kept writing and rewriting the same nonfiction book filled with imaginative theories he couldn't be bothered to prove, hoping it would make him famous. It didn't, so finally he had to turn all that imaginative energy toward writing the story as a novel where he could just make up whatever he wanted without fear of informed criticism. His greatest imagination was believing that all those years running a software company would give him a foundation of understanding sufficient to tell his betters what frauds he thinks they are.

If you didn't wear your bias so prominently on your sleeve you could almost be taken seriously.
 
NASA did indeed supply information to Stanley Kubrick, at Kubrick's request, because he was making a generation-defining space epic. A lot of it was photography from uncrewed probes to the Moon, so that Kubrick could get his visual effects right. That's perfectly natural. The notion that it was for Kubrick to fake the Apollo photography is pure imagination—
an early internet joke that some people took all too seriously.
...snip....
This
 
The lessons you should have learned from this include the following.

First, someone who claims to have a strong academic background in psychology shouldn't be posting videos from YouTube cranks when the academic literature says something completely different. If you stumbled onto the video and then immediately posted it, then you probably didn't look at the other videos to determine just what a crank your source was.

Second, it's almost always a good idea to see whether your source says something that contradicts your larger point, or otherwise presents information that's going to be problematic for you to disavow later.

Third and most important: when people who claim they know what someone is lying about can't agree on what that someone is lying about, maybe that casts doubt on the whole practice of guessing what people are lying about.
I haven't made any 'claims' at all, other than to defend myself against severe bullying. If someone keeps, say, spreading a story that one is say, 40 stone and 3' 6", then it is reasonable for that person to set the record straight. If the truth were, say, that person is actually 10 stone and 5'10" (say) then it doesn't follow they are bragging or claiming they are special or making out they are considerably better than yowww. That's how bullying operates: you can't win if you're stupid you can't win if you are clever.

The body language guy never said the guys were lying he simply pointed out when they exhibited moments of tension. You saw Peter Hyatt's statement analysis, again, psychological junk in the hands of a lay person but you can read the script for yourself. Armstrong talks in the third person, careful not to commit to actually being there. In the press conference interview we saw Collins almost jump down his throat to interject, "We didn't see any stars at all!" (to paraphrase from memory). So, yeah, looking at this in a hundred years time, when the truth comes out, there is no way anyone could accuse them of lying because they never did say they were there.
 
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NASA did indeed supply information to Stanley Kubrick, at Kubrick's request, because he was making a generation-defining space epic. A lot of it was photography from uncrewed probes to the Moon, so that Kubrick could get his visual effects right. That's perfectly natural. The notion that it was for Kubrick to fake the Apollo photography is pure imagination—an early internet joke that some people took all too seriously.

Weaver had a very fertile imagination, which he has a hard time keeping separate from fact. And yes, Weaver has been giving all this a lot of thought: he was obsessed with the notion of a hoaxed Apollo for probably close to thirty years. He kept writing and rewriting the same nonfiction book filled with imaginative theories he couldn't be bothered to prove, hoping it would make him famous. It didn't, so finally he had to turn all that imaginative energy toward writing the story as a novel where he could just make up whatever he wanted without fear of informed criticism. His greatest imagination was believing that all those years running a software company would give him a foundation of understanding sufficient to tell his betters what frauds he thinks they are.

If you didn't wear your bias so prominently on your sleeve you could almost be taken seriously.
Well, sticking to the OP topic and video, we clearly see Tony Cook making a blatantly untrue claim re Weaver's excellent point about the radiation dangers of space, that oh, they just zipped through it ultra fast using a super-safe route. He just made it up on the hoof. There was no 'safe route' through the Van Allen belt, that was just a story dreamt up by Apollo PR merchants and 'debunkers'. (See Foster Zygote's grandiose diagrams of this so called route earlier in the thread, or jump to it here at around 37:00.)

 
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Well, sticking to the OP topic and video, we clearly see Tony Cook making a blatantly untrue claim re Weaver's excellent point about the radiation dangers of space...
Asked and answered.

He just made it up on the hoof.
No, those are documented facts.

There was no 'safe route' through the Van Allen belt, that was just a story dreamt up by Apollo PR merchants and 'debunkers'. (See Foster Zygote's grandiose diagrams of this so called route earlier in the thread, or jump to it here at around 37:00.)
Asked and answered. You are not qualified to interpret that data or Cook's expert statements. Neither is Weaver.
 
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He just made it up on the hoof. There was no 'safe route' through the Van Allen belt, that was just a story dreamt up by Apollo PR merchants and 'debunkers'.

This is simply false. When did you become immune to education?

Seriously, what effort have you expended in attempting to discover what NASA's plans were for getting safely past the Van Allen belts, before you called them a lie?
 
I haven't made any 'claims' at all, other than to defend myself against severe bullying.

The following spoiler quotes several of @Vixen's non-claims.


The GUARDIAN pic is the ORIGINAL one, issued by NASA and reproduced in newspapers all over the world. (-5903). As of 1969. Only NASA had the rights. This is factual. Then in 2004 came the DOCTORED version - by NASA - (-684) bleaching out the 'fall off' area, and also having the effect of making Buzz look less sharp. This is cold objective fact and nothing at all to do with opinion or 'theory', conspiracy or otherwise, it just is.

No, 'rooster tails' is an effect of wind.

Whilst orbiting planets is a relative doddle, landing and mucking about with cameras is pure nonsense and then taking off again, based on a closely followed script (there was no software)

Deep breath. If as a poster points out, a 180lb pack pack weights just 30lbs equivalent on the Moon. Then a chap of the same weight will also weigh 30lbs, ceteris paribus.
And it's piss easy to carry 30lbs on my back. septic pubis.
If you are now the equivalent of 30lbs, no it would not.

O-Level Physics was far harder than anything people do today.

I was right and I know I am right.

Apollo 11 is likely classified until 2076, when everyone with living memory of it is dead and buried in their graves.

I am as objective as I possibly can be.
 

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