Ed Israel/US Attacks Iran /Yet Another Country/Iran

[Steve]

Is there ever a deal?

Sen. Dave McCormick: "We don't know whether there is an actual path to a deal. I assume there is. I think the
president is probably closing in on what he thinks is a good deal."

Video in link

 

[The Atheist]

How did Iran shoot down a helicopter?

Their military doesn't exist any more; they've been beaten 50 times already.

Must be time to bomb another school.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

It was an Attacked Helicopter

 

[The Atheist]

Do you think Iran is winning?

Unquestionably.

They've made USA into the world's laughing stock, have forced USA & Zionazirael to use up an enormous percentage of their weapons, have control of and are collecting fees from Hormuz, are driving an inflationary bubble that everyone in the world is paying and are still shooting down American aircraft.

Yes, they are taking some short-term but so is your pal Trump and USA in general.

If Iran is losing, by what metric do you think America is winning?

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Who is losing material as measured by replacement cost faster?
Who can endure hardship longer?
Who can maintain a credible threat even at minimal military capacity?

No question Iran is winning by not losing - both the US and Israel and the Saudis and UAE have to win to win, and that won't happen.

 

[Ziggurat]

Unquestionably.

They've made USA into the world's laughing stock

That's a pretty subjective criteria, and not worth giving any weight to.

have forced USA & Zionazirael to use up an enormous percentage of their weapons

What percentage of Iran's weapons were used up? If arsenal depletion is an important metric, apply it to both sides.

, have control of and are collecting fees from Hormuz

They don't have control of Hormuz. In order to control Hormuz, they would need to be able to not only deny passage to others, but to ensure passage of their own. And they can't do that. Hell, they can't even deny passage to our naval vessels, only to defenseless civilian ships. As for fees, do you think the fees they're collecting come close to the lost revenue from their inability to export their own oil? I don't.

, are driving an inflationary bubble that everyone in the world is paying

What do you think is happening to Iran's currency right now? Again, we see that you don't apply your own standards objectively.

and are still shooting down American aircraft.

And still getting their own ◊◊◊◊ blown up too.

If Iran is losing

Aren't they? Their currency is in the toilet, revenues have cratered, their military is being hollowed out, and much of their leadership is dead. What have they actually accomplished? Are they better off now than they were last year? No, by any objective measure they aren't.

, by what metric do you think America is winning?

Oh, I didn't say America is winning. I think it's completely reasonable to withhold judgment on that score. Our goals are long term, and it's hard to evaluate with precision, based on publicly available information, how much we've achieved. I'm not trying to convince you that we're winning. I'm challenging what I see as a very shallow evaluation of the question. That shallowness is demonstrated in factors such as citing US inflation but ignoring Iranian currency collapse.

 

[Emily's Cat]

What goals?

Most plausibly... starving Russia and China of oil, thus reducing the ability of two hostile aggressor nations to wage large scale war. It's not very nice to starve your enemies and destroy their economies, but potentially quite effective.

Also likely to be the most effective way to prevent another world war.

 

[Emily's Cat]

Constant claims of victory but an inability to follow it through and actually win

Do you WANT the US to glass Iran? Is that your objective here?

 

[johnny karate]

Do you think Iran is winning?

I'll take "What will the uncles no one likes be shrieking at Thanksgiving after their third Bud Light" for $200, please.

 

[johnny karate]

That's a pretty subjective criteria, and not worth giving any weight to.

What percentage of Iran's weapons were used up? If arsenal depletion is an important metric, apply it to both sides.

They don't have control of Hormuz. In order to control Hormuz, they would need to be able to not only deny passage to others, but to ensure passage of their own. And they can't do that. Hell, they can't even deny passage to our naval vessels, only to defenseless civilian ships. As for fees, do you think the fees they're collecting come close to the lost revenue from their inability to export their own oil? I don't.

What do you think is happening to Iran's currency right now? Again, we see that you don't apply your own standards objectively.

And still getting their own ◊◊◊◊ blown up too.

Aren't they? Their currency is in the toilet, revenues have cratered, their military is being hollowed out, and much of their leadership is dead. What have they actually accomplished? Are they better off now than they were last year? No, by any objective measure they aren't.

Oh, I didn't say America is winning. I think it's completely reasonable to withhold judgment on that score. Our goals are long term, and it's hard to evaluate with precision, based on publicly available information, how much we've achieved. I'm not trying to convince you that we're winning. I'm challenging what I see as a very shallow evaluation of the question. That shallowness is demonstrated in factors such as citing US inflation but ignoring Iranian currency collapse.

So the best you can manage is that we're both losing. Sounds great.

 

[Steve]

So the best you can manage is that we're both losing. Sounds great.

Seems to actually be the case.

 

[johnny karate]

Most plausibly... starving Russia and China of oil, thus reducing the ability of two hostile aggressor nations to wage large scale war. It's not very nice to starve your enemies and destroy their economies, but potentially quite effective.

Also likely to be the most effective way to prevent another world war.

Yes, if there's one thing known to prevent wars, it's starting wars. Razor-sharp analysis. You must read books.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Most plausibly... starving Russia and China of oil, thus reducing the ability of two hostile aggressor nations to wage large scale war. It's not very nice to starve your enemies and destroy their economies, but potentially quite effective.

Also likely to be the most effective way to prevent another world war.

The USA tried that with Japan.

 

[Steve]

The USA tried that with Japan.

And that prevented a war! Oh, wait.......

Almost 1 million US service men killed and wounded.

 

[Emily's Cat]

The USA tried that with Japan.

Elaborate?

 

[Ziggurat]

Elaborate?

We imposed an oil embargo on Japan prior to Pearl Harbor. That's often cited as one of the reasons they attacked Pearl Harbor.

We aren't embargoing oil to China, though, just cutting off their access to below-market priced oil. They can still buy as much as they want, at market prices.

 

[EHocking]

Donald doesn't know what the war is for or how to get out of it.

Most plausibly... starving Russia and China of oil, thus reducing the ability of two hostile aggressor nations to wage large scale war. It's not very nice to starve your enemies and destroy their economies, but potentially quite effective.

Also likely to be the most effective way to prevent another world war.

As with all thing Trump, that plan seems to be working sooooo well,

Most shipping traffic through the Strait of Hormuz, a waterway for global oil and gas transport that supplies roughly one-fifth of the world's crude oil, has been halted since early March, after the war started. About 20 vessels have been attacked in the area.​

​

However, Iran has still managed to export well above 16 million barrels of oil since the beginning of March, trade data and analytics platform Kpler estimated. Due to Western sanctions and associated risks, China has been the biggest buyer of Iranian oil.​

 

[Steve]

Elaborate?

Those who ignore history are condemned to repeat it.

 

[Ziggurat]

However, Iran has still managed to export well above 16 million barrels of oil since the beginning of March, trade data and analytics platform Kpler estimated. Due to Western sanctions and associated risks, China has been the biggest buyer of Iranian oil.​

And how much oil were they exporting before the war? How much was China buying?

 

[W.D.Clinger]

Not necessarily but the USA certainly looks to be losing

What's your metric?

“There will be no deal with Iran except UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER!”​

— President Donald J Trump, Friday, 6 March 2026​

So long as there is no deal with Iran, with or without UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER, Trump's stated metric will continue to be met.

Inasmuch as Trump has stated that clear goal, and that goal has been achieved without interruption ever since he started the war, I don't see how anyone could say he isn't winning.

And so long as Trump is winning, doesn't that mean the US is winning as well? I mean, is there any meaningful difference between Trump and the United States?