Global Geographic Literacy Survey

Prove that there are "a lot of people in a lot of countries" that "go out of their way to show how much they hate Americans" and that it "can be pretty nasty in Europe".

Yes, verifiable evidence.
Did I say it was anything other than anecdotal? Americans are treated completely differently than Canadians in my experience. I can recall instances where they were charged more for their rooms, or meals, or had their passports taken by border guards, and had to pay to get them back - where the same border guard didn't even open mine before tossing it back to me. I have photos (not digital, unfortunately), of anti-American graffiti all over various cities, from 2000.

ETA: A lot of it in Italy, especially Rome. Not sure why.
 
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And that's the kind of thing I am talking about. Why would I want to spend big money visiting another country, when people are going to vandalize my car for no better reason than that I am an American? Lemmesee, I can spend $10,000 visiting Europe and being held personally responsible for whatever wrongs the locals feel my country has done and generally being treated like dirt because of my nationality OR I can spend $2000 and take my kids to Disneyland andbe just another face in the crowd. Tough decision, that.....

Wow.

You seriously need to control your prejudices of how other countries view Americans - especially European countries.

I'm appalled to see such blatant ignorance and xenophobia. Really. You need to travel more often.

And how much of that area could a Dane reach, without a passport, ten years ago?

What does that have to do with anything? FYI, it hasn't changed one bit. You would know this, if you had made the effort of educating yourself about these issues.

Europe is huge. It's a continent. European countries, by the standards of the Western Hemisphere, are tiny, which is why prior to the establishment of document-free travel as part of the development of the EU, passports were essential for Europeans in a way that they weren't for Americans.

Sure, Europe is huge. It's bigger than the US. Which you didn't know, because you were too lazy to educate yourself about geographical matters.

Thanks for proving my point.

Which is why I suggested that you might want to fly, instead. Taking some reading classes might help you as well.

I read and understood perfectly. You thought you could drive 500 km due south from Copenhagen. Well, gee: You can't.

Although you can actually drive 500km due south from Copenhagen. You just need a rather specialized vehicle (and a hell of a lot of fuel), but these vehicles are fairly widely available on the military surplus market (and used a lot in various parts of the tourism trade).

Har-har-har.

Depends on how you drive and how bad the Low Countries traffic is.

That goes for driving in the US, too. So? I'm sure you don't want to talk about how congested US highways are.

You've missed the point that nowhere in the United States do you have three large-sized distinct linguistic communities with a 700km drive of each other. The only place you'd find anything remotely like that would be on some of the larger Indian reservations, where English is more commonly spoken than the various tribal languages in the first place.

What does it matter if you have to drive through distinct linguistic communities? You can easily get by in Europe, even with your limited American-English.

Do you mean the 1985 agreement on document-free travel to which Denmark wasn't a part, or do you mean the 1990 convention that ratified it EU-wide?

I am talking about the present one, of course.

And if you're discussing the possbility of document-free travel as a practical matter, the dates of interest are probably either 1995, when it officially came into effect, or '99, when it was officially incorporated into EU law, since you would still have needed a passport for much of Europe even that late. And since we're discussing Denmark in particular -- Denmark didn't actual implement the Schengen Agreement until late '96.

So? We are talking about today.

So, basically, it's been less than ten years that Danes have been able to enjoy document-free travel throughout a fairly substantial minory of the European continent.

I see that you have only glanced at the information without actually understanding it, thereby once again underlining my point about the necessity to have an inkling of geographical knowledge. Danes can't travel document-free: We have to carry our passports with us, except when travelling to Norway and Sweden.

But don't let that stop you from ranting about how little Danes have needed passports....

WTF does that have to do with how you can travel in Europe today? I couldn't travel without identifying myself during the Napoleonic Era either. So? I can travel passport-free in Norway and Sweden.

Given that you have exhibited an abysmal lack of knowledge about European matters, do you think it might be a good idea for you to take a few geography classes?

If there are also individual states in the continental Europe where you can drive 500 km in a straight line without leaving the state, what is your point?

How many countries can you travel to, from the US, within seven hours, by car? How many of them are non-english speaking?

Remind me, but when did it become a necessity for travelling that the countries you visited would have to be English-speaking?

Where I am, I can drive 20 hours north, and still be hours away from leaving my province.

.........and?

Did I say it was anything other than anecdotal? Americans are treated completely differently than Canadians in my experience. I can recall instances where they were charged more for their rooms, or meals, or had their passports taken by border guards, and had to pay to get them back - where the same border guard didn't even open mine before tossing it back to me. I have photos (not digital, unfortunately), of anti-American graffiti all over various cities, from 2000.

ETA: A lot of it in Italy, especially Rome. Not sure why.

This calls for hardcore evidence. In the absence, I'm sure you don't mind if I dismiss that as anti-European slur. Do you?
 
Wow.

You seriously need to control your prejudices of how other countries view Americans - especially European countries.

I'm appalled to see such blatant ignorance and xenophobia.


Yeah, don't it suck when people make ignorant xenophobic assumptions about other nationalities?

CFLarsen said:
I think that you exhibit the predominant American attitude towards knowledge, that Nyar also mentioned. You look at what happens in your everyday life only - you concern yourself only with your work, your family, your shopping, the next movie that comes out. The rest of the world doesn't concern you because not only do you not think it is irrelevant to you, you don't want it to be relevant.
 
Just for fun:

http://traumwerk.stanford.edu:3455/MichaelShanks/89

http://www.up.edu.ph/forum/2003/Apr03/pinoypulitika.html

Alleys and nooks and the usual toilet doors were also heavy with anti-American graffiti.

http://www.freeflowuk.com/home/jour...ernational/spitinyoureye_alexandrawinton.aspx

Amanda Itria is an American. She has been spit on for it. “I remember it exactly,” said the 21 year-old exchange student from Detroit.

“We were in this bar in Manchester. This guy is 34 and completely piss-ass drunk. He approaches us, hears our accents and says a completely inappropriate remark about the reputation of American girls.”

The conversation continued, the man became more rude and when the girls asked him to leave, he got angry. “Then he gives me this weird look and asks me what my dad drives, what does my mother drive, myself, my sister, and my brother. I answer, but ask him why it matters?”

The man, using more than a few expletives, pointed out how much petrol Itria’s family is using. After Itria told him not to insult her family, she said, “he got up, spit in my face and left.”

This is one example of the popular rise of anti-American sentiment among a young generation. Other examples are easily found: posters depicting Uncle Sam as a demon, cartoons making fun of George W. Bush, anti-American graffiti, t-shirts, bands, and books. Much of this either comes from, or is aimed at youth. One might discern that is has become cool to dislike the United States.

http://www.unmikonline.org/press/2002/mon/Oct/lmm091002.htm

There is clear anti-American mood among Goran population and the best proof are the anti-American graffiti written on the walls of several houses in village Rapçe which is inhabited 100% by Goran community. The graffiti are in Serbian and English. One graffiti says: "Živeo Bin Laden" (Long Live Bin Laden). This anti-American and anti-Albanian graffiti does not help Goran community. To show anti-Americanism in Kosovo is same as to show openly hatred for Albanians. The other three graffiti say: Amerika je Jevrejska kurva (America is a Jewish whore), and Bush Go To Hell

http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/comment-wawro050703.asp

The walls in Trastevere and elsewhere in Rome were daubed with anti-American graffiti, all of which had been hastily but imperfectly painted over by the municipality. A common phrase, dating from the Kosovo air campaign, was Avanti Serbia! — "Go Serbia!" More recent is: Israel boia, USA cumplici — "Israel the murderer, USA the accomplice." Another graffito expressed fatigue with the whole escalating clash of civilizations: Né USA, né Islam! — "Neither USA, nor Islam."

http://www.consortiumnews.com/2004/041204.html

When I returned to Denmark several weeks ago, one of the most striking developments was the proliferation of anti-Bush and anti-American graffiti. Painted on walls everywhere were messages such as "Stop Bush" and "F*** USA."

Whether they have reason or not, or if it reflects the majority of the population, it's there. I have never seen anti-Canadian graffiti in a foreign country, and have never seen and 'anti' graffiti in my country, except for 'anti-US', or 'anti-Israel'.
 
Remind me, but when did it become a necessity for travelling that the countries you visited would have to be English-speaking?
Please show me where I said it was. I was simply pointing out that the of the two countries that border the US, only one does not have English as an official language.

.........and?

And it obviously takes a bit more effort for me to leave the country.

CRLarsen said:
This calls for hardcore evidence. In the absence, I'm sure you don't mind if I dismiss that as anti-European slur. Do you?

Funny, I was getting evidence while you posted this.

BTW, are you accusing me of lying?
 
What does that have to do with anything?

Well, if you need a passport to travel more than 515 km from your birthplace, that makes a passport more useful than if you only need only to travel 3000km from your birthplace.

FYI, it hasn't changed one bit.

So you're saying that Danes have always been able to travel wherever they liked inside the 13 countries that now comprise the EU, without travel documents. And the Schlengen Agreement changed nothing.

You know, you should educate yourself a bit.
 
Oh, I almost forgot!

http://www.indybay.org/news/2005/03/1728717.php

Police in Germany are hunting pranksters who have been sticking
miniature flag portraits of US President George W. Bush into piles of
dog poo in public parks. Josef Oettl, parks administrator for Bayreuth,
said: "This has been going on for about a year now, and there must be
2,000 to 3,000 piles of excrement that have been claimed during that
time."

bushpooflag.jpg
 
Did I say it was anything other than anecdotal? Americans are treated completely differently than Canadians in my experience. I can recall instances where they were charged more for their rooms, or meals, or had their passports taken by border guards, and had to pay to get them back - where the same border guard didn't even open mine before tossing it back to me. I have photos (not digital, unfortunately), of anti-American graffiti all over various cities, from 2000.

ETA: A lot of it in Italy, especially Rome. Not sure why.
I went to Prague last year and had a very nice experience. They love Americans there, and they love us because of $$$.

I don't know if this kind of attitude you speak of exists in a large-enough number to matter. And if it does, it speaks more about the citizens of those countries than it does about Americans.
 
Careful again. Since English is the world's lingua franca, is this a meaningful comparison? To many Europeans, English isn't a foreign language so much as it is a second language. How many Europeans speak a foreign language other than English?
Define "speak". I can say both "je ne parle pas Francais tres bien" and "Ich Sprechren nicht sehr gut Deutch".
 
Wow.

You seriously need to control your prejudices of how other countries view Americans - especially European countries.

I'm appalled to see such blatant ignorance and xenophobia. Really. You need to travel more often.


I don't think it is a prejudice because I don't think my countrymen are any better. I doubt I would be all too keen on travelling to the US if I were Arab or French, for instance. It's not that I think Europeans are dirtbags, it's that I think PEOPLE are dirtbags and will gleefully sieze on any opportunity to do cruddy things to torment whatever group of people are in disfavor at the moment. I have no reason to suppose the Europeans are any better than the rest of humanity in that regard, and Americans are one of the groups of people in disfavor over there (and just about everywhere else) at the moment.

As for the rest, again I say that I can only go by what I see.
 
But it isn't "useless": How can you understand e.g. geopolitical issues if you have no idea where the countries are, what their background are, etc?

It isn't merely knowledge of other countries that are lacking, either. 30% of young Americans think that the U.S. population is 1 billion to 2 billion people! Only 25% selected the proper range (150 million to 350 million).

That's truly astounding.
Also since they had 5 options to pick from (on of which was "I don't know") they did only marginally better than average, and was in fact beaten by significant margins by every other country in the test. Also only 44% knew which organization endosed the EURO. It's not so much that they don't know, but honestly how hard is it to figure out that the EURO is probably endorse by the EUROpean Union, rather than say NATO, OPEC, WTO or perhaps NAFTA.
 
I went to Prague last year and had a very nice experience. They love Americans there, and they love us because of $$$.

I don't know if this kind of attitude you speak of exists in a large-enough number to matter. And if it does, it speaks more about the citizens of those countries than it does about Americans.
I don't think that it reflects at all on Americans - I hope I didn't come across as thinking that. I'm just saying that there are instances of anti-Americanism in Europe.

Czech is pretty good, I was there again last year, and they've improved a lot since the first time I came. My general experience, is that former Eastern bloc countries tend to be much more receptive to Americans. I don't deny it's because of the money. Once people realize how much money comes into their country due to tourism...well, look at Croatia. They tend to be very American friendly, on the whole.

With regards to Czech, Prague is probably one of my favourite cities. Although it has gone up a lot in price. But you can still get $0.50 if you step outside of the city centre. Most people don't though, which is why they pay 6 euros a beer. Last time I was there, one of the people I was with was a former resident, who escaped in '79. It was awesome, hearing about his experiences with the Soviets.

Did you ever manage to pronounce 'Dobre den' (sp? it means 'good day' or something along those lines)? I always wanted to preface my saying it with 'I apologize for what I'm about to do to your language.' Though, I could pronounce 'pivo' quite well, so I didn't die of thirst, or anything.
 
Europe is huge. It's a continent. European countries, by the standards of the Western Hemisphere, are tiny, which is why prior to the establishment of document-free travel as part of the development of the EU, passports were essential for Europeans in a way that they weren't for Americans.

(...snip...)

Although you can actually drive 500km due south from Copenhagen. You just need a rather specialized vehicle (and a hell of a lot of fuel), but these vehicles are fairly widely available on the military surplus market (and used a lot in various parts of the tourism trade).
Europe is slightly larger than the US, and has about as many countries in it as the US has states.

If the US were a continent, like Europe, I could claim to have visited 23 foreign countries in that continent. Wow, I am a travellin' dude!

There are dozens, even hundreds of reasons why Americans don't visit Europe as often as Europeans visit America. My favorite explanation is that most of us have ancestors who left Europe because they were being taxed to death or hacked to death, and passed on their feelings about their European taxers and hackers to their children and grandchildren.
 
Also since they had 5 options to pick from (on of which was "I don't know") they did only marginally better than average, and was in fact beaten by significant margins by every other country in the test. Also only 44% knew which organization endosed the EURO. It's not so much that they don't know, but honestly how hard is it to figure out that the EURO is probably endorse by the EUROpean Union, rather than say NATO, OPEC, WTO or perhaps NAFTA.

To be fair, that question never mentioned the euro by name, it simply asked which organization endorsed a common currency for its members. So it requires at least a little knowldege of what the differing organizations are.
 
I don't think that it reflects at all on Americans - I hope I didn't come across as thinking that. I'm just saying that there are instances of anti-Americanism in Europe.

Czech is pretty good, I was there again last year, and they've improved a lot since the first time I came. My general experience, is that former Eastern bloc countries tend to be much more receptive to Americans. I don't deny it's because of the money. Once people realize how much money comes into their country due to tourism...well, look at Croatia. They tend to be very American friendly, on the whole.

With regards to Czech, Prague is probably one of my favourite cities. Although it has gone up a lot in price. But you can still get $0.50 if you step outside of the city centre. Most people don't though, which is why they pay 6 euros a beer. Last time I was there, one of the people I was with was a former resident, who escaped in '79. It was awesome, hearing about his experiences with the Soviets.
Oh the beer....the beer there was so good it almost makes me cry thinking about it now.
Did you ever manage to pronounce 'Dobre den' (sp? it means 'good day' or something along those lines)? I always wanted to preface my saying it with 'I apologize for what I'm about to do to your language.' Though, I could pronounce 'pivo' quite well, so I didn't die of thirst, or anything.
Well I have an added advantage of having Russian as my first languages and thus can easily pronounce that :)
 
To be fair, that question never mentioned the euro by name, it simply asked which organization endorsed a common currency for its members. So it requires at least a little knowldege of what the differing organizations are.
Yes it does, the question was: "Which of the following organizations endorses the euro as the common currency for its members?"
 
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