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Does SCOTUS deserve its exalted status?

@Suddenly, packing the courts is a terrible idea. You think the court is illegitimate now, wait until there's 50 justices with 26 chosen by the last president. Unless you find a way to keep any other party out of power for the rest of time, that would be a disaster.
If that happens it still isn't worse than the status quo.

The Democrats pack the court in an aggressive manner. This makes it so it can't immediately be repacked without altering the dynamic of the court in a fundamental way that forces reform. That's better, or at least not possibly worse, than the present state of affairs of a locked in majority of conservative political activists.

The Democrats not taking action in fear of sparking retaliation is cowardly and stupid altogether. As to this issue even more so. With a Supreme Court that will uphold a comprehensive voting rights act ending gerrymandering and voter suppression the chances of the GOP as it exists now ever regaining significant power is negligible. They won't win a fair election.
 
So if my side packs the courts it's ok, but if the other sides does it it's bad and evil?
That is one of fears; that the left in the USA becomes just as ruthless and authoratrain as the right, so we have a choice between Hitler and Stalin, which is no real choice at all.
For the record, I would get rid of lifetime appointments and replace it with a ten year one time tenure.
 
If that happens it still isn't worse than the status quo.
This part is probably correct from the standpoint of a Democrat. At least during times the Democrats are in power they would have a rubber stamp judiciary. Not sure that is cause for celebration given that the same applies during times the Republicans are in power.

The Democrats pack the court in an aggressive manner. This makes it so it can't immediately be repacked without altering the dynamic of the court in a fundamental way that forces reform. That's better, or at least not possibly worse, than the present state of affairs of a locked in majority of conservative political activists.

Democrats add, say 6 judges to give themselves a 9-6 majority, Republicans add 6 judges to make it 12-9.

The Democrats not taking action in fear of sparking retaliation is cowardly and stupid altogether. As to this issue even more so. With a Supreme Court that will uphold a comprehensive voting rights act ending gerrymandering and voter suppression the chances of the GOP as it exists now ever regaining significant power is negligible. They won't win a fair election.
If you believe that the Democrats will win every election in the future, you're thoroughly deluded for the simple reason that people don't vote for Party A or Candidate X because they love them. They vote for Party A or Candidate X because they have grown to despise Party B and Candidate Y. That is what will decimate the GOP this November; they are Party B this time around. You can see this in the polls actually; even though the GOP is very unpopular, the Democrats are almost as unpopular.
 
So if my side packs the courts it's ok, but if the other sides does it it's bad and evil?
That is one of fears; that the left in the USA becomes just as ruthless and authoratrain as the right, so we have a choice between Hitler and Stalin, which is no real choice at all.
For the record, I would get rid of lifetime appointments and replace it with a ten year one time tenure.
the SC has not grown with the rest of the Judiciary and US population. It needs to either become bigger or delegate powers to other courts for the functioning of the US legal system.
 
Meh, not a lot to this story really. It wasn't even the actual start of the shadow docket. The alternative would seem to be waiting for a case get through the courts as the executive branch or a state is doing something that may be illegal? Like say, deporting a bunch of people with questionable due process? Or not even that much due process.
It's not quite how they do it. When they run the shadow Docket scam they put an instant hold on it but hear no legal argument and sit on it for a year or so, then the point is moot.

When states threatened to keep Trump out of the election they have an instant hold them gave their full response a short time later.

When Trump was claiming executive privilege for the stolen documents case they put an instant hold on it then sat on it for about a year.
 
the SC has not grown with the rest of the Judiciary and US population. It needs to either become bigger or delegate powers to other courts for the functioning of the US legal system.
Do you want it to become bigger now, when the Republicans are in charge, or only at some future date when the Democrats have the reins?
 

Does SCOTUS deserve its exalted status?​

No more than any other political body.
The deserve a more exalted status than the US congress, at least the SCOTUS is trying to do it's job.
 
the SC has not grown with the rest of the Judiciary and US population. It needs to either become bigger or delegate powers to other courts for the functioning of the US legal system.
Congress has delegated power to other courts. The SCOTUS used to literally ride a circuit on horse back. Now we have circuit courts. That sort of thing is up to congress but they have stopped doing any of their jobs. They stopped changing the court more than a hundred years ago, so even before they stopped doing all the other things they are supposed to do.
 
This part is probably correct from the standpoint of a Democrat. At least during times the Democrats are in power they would have a rubber stamp judiciary. Not sure that is cause for celebration given that the same applies during times the Republicans are in power.

From the standpoint of people who don't like corruption and would rather have a court that at least tries to not be political operatives, If you say that's a partisan issue it is hard to disagree. I don't see it. Democrats can be corrupt as all get out, but as things are they are the party that has motivation to do something about this particular puddle of sleeze.

Democrats add, say 6 judges to give themselves a 9-6 majority, Republicans add 6 judges to make it 12-9.

Democrats add fifteen making it 21-6. Or more. The idea being just enough that an attempt to reverse it to recreate a substantial majority will make the court absolutely unworkable. Judges generally aren't going to follow party discipline and at these numbers you are going to see a Blackmun style flip or three, so getting it to even 25-21 isn't going to cut it. They can deal with it or agree to some changes.

It would be effective brinksmanship.

If you believe that the Democrats will win every election in the future, you're thoroughly deluded for the simple reason that people don't vote for Party A or Candidate X because they love them. They vote for Party A or Candidate X because they have grown to despise Party B and Candidate Y. That is what will decimate the GOP this November; they are Party B this time around. You can see this in the polls actually; even though the GOP is very unpopular, the Democrats are almost as unpopular.
Of course the Democrats wouldn't win every election.

The GOP as is exists now wouldn't possibly win. This is not Bob Dole's party. It has become a toxic craphole that is imploding on its own.

We can agree that in a two party system parties survive by building coalitions moving towards a 50/50 equilibrium. Since the condition precedent for all of this is an initial big GOP defeat a realignment will have to happen with or without radical reform. With reforms it will have to a more significant shift. The GOP selling it's soul to Trump makes all of this (post-Trump) even more chaotic as the party now lacks any ideological focus other than vague outrage. This isn't Bob Dole's conservativism. Heck, Berry Goldwater would be horrified by the present GOP. It is a nihilistic clown car.

Who knows. The idea of the progressive wing of the Democratic Party post Trump abandoning the Democratic establishment, migrating into a floundering post-Trump GOP initially as a ballot access tactic and forming an uneasy alliance with the white working class cultural conservatives based on labor, other economic concerns, and general anti-Plutocrat hate isn't as crazy as it sounds.

The non-progressive parts of the Democratic Party are pretty pro-corporate so that becoming a somewhat less socially conservative party of the rich isn't that hard of a shift.

This whole dynamic with the party labels switched existed in the 60s and 70s.
 
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I see you have not answered whether the ambulance driver has committed a crime. It is a pretty simple question.

Laws, especially older ones, are often written in general terms just as this one.
My answer is that if the law applies a no exceptions bans on vehicles entering a park and the ambulance driver eventually winds up in court over this then the judge would have no option but to find the driver guilty and apply the legislated penalty. Judges should not be able to unilaterally change a law.

However, the police/prosecutors usually have some discretion about whether to charge someone or not and may decide not to charge the driver. There are probably hundreds or even thousands of outdated laws that are still on the books but are no longer prosecuted.

In either case, pressure should be applied to the legislature to do their job properly and amend the law so that it deals with the question of when an emergency vehicle can enter the park.
 
My answer is that if the law applies a no exceptions bans on vehicles entering a park and the ambulance driver eventually winds up in court over this then the judge would have no option but to find the driver guilty and apply the legislated penalty. Judges should not be able to unilaterally change a law.
The judge isn't changing a law. The judge that would convict under these circumstances is the one changing the law. A crime has not occurred here.

I will expand:

The whole point of language is to communicate; to reach a common understanding among the parties involved. Context is essential to any piece of writing, or for that matter all communication. A spoken word without context is just a sound. It only becomes something more when there is shared experience, tradition, assumption, whatever you want to call it that makes those sounds significant in a way both the speaker and listener understand. This can be on as basic of a level as "what language is being used" and then branches out to things like how a word is defined generally or within a subculture. Then there are issues of idiom, slang, and that language evolves. It gets extremely complicated. A sentence that seems simple to one person can mean something totally different to a different person because as a cultural matter they do not share the same understanding. Language is messy.

In this case the context is law, specifically criminal law. There are concepts that are implied within this context. In this situation the most relevant is the concept of necessity. The ambulance driver did not commit a crime because he had an obvious moral duty to drive into the park. It was a necessity to save a life. This concept is formulated a few different ways but this is the one where it's application is unambiguous regardless of how it is formulated. Within criminal law this and other concepts are baked into the common understanding of the words being used.

In this case within the Anglo/American legal tradition this goes beyond basic language concepts. Judge made a/k/a common law is a type of law and necessity is a pre-existing part of law and when a legislature passes a law it is understood to be within the existing legal framework. It is up to the legislature to say when they are changing the law or wanting a statute to be read in a way not consistent with existing law.

It is true that this statute says nothing about necessity. However that is only significant in that given the larger context it does not remove necessity from the existing law. One could read this statute and I guess take a narrow linguistic view applying only their understanding of context and assume that the legislative body intended to by silence exclude all existing common law doctrines from being used in the law's application, but that is the more tortured reading. You wouldn't be ignoring context. You would be substituting your own context.

Same in a more informal sense. We have a common understanding, or at least those of us with an iota of social intelligence have an understanding that a law meant to keep a people from driving through the park does not apply to emergency vehicles responding to an emergency. In the same way that if I tell the person driving a car to turn left I do not mean to immediately swerve left across traffic and hit a building. I mean the next intersection or other relevant pathway.

Without some context every word is a meaningless scribble. Textualism is a marketing word. What people who call themselves textualists are doing is selectively applying the contextual meaning they think applies and framing that as an absolute. It is a confidence game.



However, the police/prosecutors usually have some discretion about whether to charge someone or not and may decide not to charge the driver. There are probably hundreds or even thousands of outdated laws that are still on the books but are no longer prosecuted.
Long unenforced statutes are another thing that is handled within the context of law. That these statutes can no longer be enforced is the law in many jurisdictions. Civil law code jurisdictions (Louisiana for example) and some other jurisdictions (West Virginia for one) call it "desuetude." Some other jurisdictions formulate a due process construction. This isn't just a question of prosecutorial discretion.

In either case, pressure should be applied to the legislature to do their job properly and amend the law so that it deals with the question of when an emergency vehicle can enter the park.

The legislative body did do their job properly. The essence of the judiciary is to apply the general to the specific. While we do impose upon the legislature a duty to not be vague, that is a low bar and there is no expectation for them to address specific circumstances. The legislature is free to be as specific as they want,, but otherwise they leave the process of how to apply the law to the judiciary.

Even absent a clear idea of what the judicial branch will do the legislature is free to speak in general terms leaving the judiciary to fill in the blanks consistent with our understanding of justice. A judiciary that rejects this discretion in favor of a childlike hyperliteralism the unpleasant results of which are then blamed on the legislature is abandoning its duty.
 
The judge isn't changing a law. The judge that would convict under these circumstances is the one changing the law. A crime has not occurred here.
This is blatantly absurd. If the law says that NO vehicles may enter the park and the judge says that the law says emergency vehicles may enter the park the the judge has changed the law.

I will expand:
That is not an explanation. It is a rationalization. In the absence of any ambiguity, a judge has no business making a ruling that runs counter to a written law. That the law ought to say something different is not the judge's call.

The legislative body did do their job properly. The essence of the judiciary is to apply the general to the specific. While we do impose upon the legislature a duty to not be vague, that is a low bar and there is no expectation for them to address specific circumstances. The legislature is free to be as specific as they want,, but otherwise they leave the process of how to apply the law to the judiciary.
This is rubbish. The legislature created a BAD law. Anybody can see that there may be circumstances where an emergency vehicle might need to access a park and they should have worded the law accordingly. It is up to the legislature to fix the law - not for a judge to change it.
 
The really funny part is where you're lecturing an actual former judge on how judges interpret the law.
I'm not saying how judges interpret the law. I'm saying how they ought to interpret the law - and it should not be by adding words to the law that are not there and change its meaning.

That the legal system thinks that interpreting a law away is valid shows how sick the legal system is. It is the reason why the bill of rights has been effectively rendered meaningless.
 
I'm not saying how judges interpret the law. I'm saying how they ought to interpret the law - and it should not be by adding words to the law that are not there and change its meaning.

That the legal system thinks that interpreting a law away is valid shows how sick the legal system is. It is the reason why the bill of rights has been effectively rendered meaningless.
Welcome to the world of judicial activism and accusations thereof.

Has been and always will.
 
This is blatantly absurd. If the law says that NO vehicles may enter the park and the judge says that the law says emergency vehicles may enter the park the the judge has changed the law.
When a judge decides a criminal case the law controlling that case is all applicable law, not just one applicable statute. That is the larger context in which these laws work.

A statute is just a type of law. It isn't a synonym for law. We colloquially refer to statutes as "laws" and that sometimes confuses people who are not aware of the context within which these terms are used.
That is not an explanation. It is a rationalization. In the absence of any ambiguity, a judge has no business making a ruling that runs counter to a written law. That the law ought to say something different is not the judge's call.
You effectively say that the legislature by its silence is choosing to reverse well settled common law That is not a reasonable reading. It is also contrary to law as it is also a well settled legal principle that while a legislature can choose to abrogate the common law it must do so explicitly and/or directly. They did not do that here, but you want a judge to act as if they did.

The judge isn't changing the law. You are the one wanting to change the law to be consistent with your narrow, simplistic, and incorrect idea of what law is.

A real world example: The state of West Virginia has no statute that defines murder. It has statutes about degrees of murder and the punishment, but it is silent as to what a murder actually is. By its silence the common law definition remains in place. Just as here the silence leaves necessity in place.

If the law were to work within your narrow personal understanding murder wouldn't be illegal here because the legislature, within your narrow understanding, wrote a bad statute not defining murder so there can't be a prosecution for murder. I can assure you it is still illegal here. This is because statutes fit into a context of already existing law.

This is rubbish. The legislature created a BAD law. Anybody can see that there may be circumstances where an emergency vehicle might need to access a park and they should have worded the law accordingly. It is up to the legislature to fix the law - not for a judge to change it.

Everybody can also see that there is the law an already existing necessity exception to criminal acts and thus no need to repeat it in a statute. If the legislature didn't want already existing law to apply it is up to them to say so - not for a judge to do it on the assumption that is what they want. .

My guess is that if this law was 25 pages long and covered every eventuality you'd complain about that as well even though such tortiously long statutes would be necessary to do anything in a world where we have to cater to the understanding of people who are unable or refuse to understand context.
 

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