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Split Thread Are Antifa and violent leftists the cause of everything wrong in America?

Trausti said:
Of course the Left does. It's nothing new. Iranian leftists celebrated the return of the Ayatollah. They were then rounded up and shot. The Left and Islamist have a shared hatred of the West. The Left are useful idiots. Queers for Palestine. Good, grief.
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Blanket statements prove you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Anyone with more than two brain cells knows that blanket statements are usually (if not always) based on lies.

I mean, how many lefties have you talked to? My guess is none.

You'd have to have talked to every single lefty in the world before I'd believe your crap.

Good luck with that.
 
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Trausti said:
Kinda of surprising sentiment. I thought the progressive Left liked Chris Hedges.
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I'm not a lefty or a dem, but it's obvious you would love to kiss the fat clown's jackass, right?
 
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AmyStrange said:
Blanket statements prove you don't have a clue what you're talking about.

Anyone with more than two brain cells knows that blanket statements are usually (if not always) based on lies.

I mean, how many lefties have you talked to? My guess is none.
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Trausti said:
Are you that incapable of engaging in an argument without mentioning him?
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Yes, especially when I'm talking to smart folks, but it does seem to me you're obsessed with lefties for some reason.

Why is that?
 
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Trausti said:
Well, at least you acknowledged you [sic] inability to engage [in] reasoned argument.
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I can't have a reasoned conversation when I'm talking to a five-year-old who believes everything the fat clown says.


ETA: I apologize to all five-year-olds because every single one of you are smarter than the fat clown and his stupid, lying maga weirdoes.
 
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Trausti said:
Yeah, that's [sic] the (sic] exactly [sic] that [sic] kind of response I'd expect from you.
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That's hilarious coming from someone who uses opinions and blanket statements as though they were facts.

I'll stop now before we end up in AAH, but you can certainly continue gibbering away. I'll just read and laugh my butt off.
 
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Trausti said:
Why does the Left love Islam so much? Incredibly suicidal.
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Love? Ha. Typical willful misunderstanding.

Here's the thing... Just like the left doesn't embrace right-wing extremists, terrorists, and criminals, the left doesn't embrace Islamic extremists, terrorists, and criminals. The left does embrace decent people, whatever their religion, though, and seeks to offer a helping hand to anyone being downtrodden based on who they are, instead of what they've done. Are there idiots on the left that say dumb things on the topic? Absolutely. That's a human thing, though, rather than a left thing. Easy proof of that's in the quoted above, though. Plenty of "Christians" in the US have made it perfectly clear that they approve of harming and killing the Left. Therefore, by your logic, the Left not being utterly hostile to all people who claim to be Christians is incredibly suicidal, nevermind the actual nuances in play. I suppose that you may not be so used to working outside the framework of the politics of hate that the right relies upon so much, though, so your position is somewhat understandable.

Trausti said:
Of course the Left does. It's nothing new. Iranian leftists celebrated the return of the Ayatollah. They were then rounded up and shot. The Left and Islamist have a shared hatred of the West. The Left are useful idiots. Queers for Palestine. Good, grief.
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Note - Queers for Palestine has a very different meaning than Queers for Hamas would. Israel has done lots and lots of things that are quite worthy of condemnation, just as numerous Palestinians have. Opposing injustice done by all parties, but especially the primary perpetrator (Israel, in this case, by virtue of holding overwhelmingly more power) is hardly something to mock. Further, to point at the words of a queer for Palestine -

I’m a queer for Palestine. I acknowledge that Hamas and Palestinians generally hold pretty abhorrent views on gay people. And if I was openly gay over there, they would probably do awful things to me. I don’t want to discuss the actual conflict much, there’s plenty of that happening already, I just want to stick to the issue of LGBT people being pro-Palestine. If you want to talk about why being pro-Palestine generally is wrong, please take it to another thread.

So why do I support a people who would want me dead if they knew who I was? It’s pretty simple really. The right to self-determination extends to all peoples, not just those who I agree with. It’s not really my place to step in and say no, you people are too homophobic, you’re not allowed make your own decisions. To me, that’s a recipe for disaster and justification for a repeat of the colonialism of previous centuries. There are many sovereign countries today that are as homophobic as Palestine. That doesn’t make any other country justified in invading and occupying the people there. So that’s why I think it’s wrong to say that gay people should automatically be against self-determination for the Palestinian people just because they’re homophobic.
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Personally, I find that to be entirely fair. My personal opinion may be more complicated and include more factors, but that certainly doesn't invalidate their opinion or make it idiotic, especially when it's invoking something so very basic.
 
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Aridas said:
Love? Ha. Typical willful misunderstanding.

Here's the thing... Just like the left doesn't embrace right-wing extremists, terrorists, and criminals, the left doesn't embrace Islamic extremists, terrorists, and criminals. The left does embrace decent people, whatever their religion, though, and seeks to offer a helping hand to anyone being downtrodden based on who they are, instead of what they've done. Are there idiots on the left that say dumb things on the topic? Absolutely. That's a human thing, though, rather than a left thing. Easy proof of that's in the quoted above, though. Plenty of "Christians" in the US have made it perfectly clear that they approve of harming and killing the Left. Therefore, by your logic, the Left not being utterly hostile to all people who claim to be Christians is incredibly suicidal, nevermind the actual nuances in play. I suppose that you may not be so used to working outside the framework of the politics of hate that the right relies upon so much, though, so your position is somewhat understandable.



Note - Queers for Palestine has a very different meaning than Queers for Hamas would. Israel has done lots and lots of things that are quite worthy of condemnation, just as numerous Palestinians have. Opposing injustice done by all parties, but especially the primary perpetrator (Israel, in this case, by virtue of holding overwhelmingly more power) is hardly something to mock. Further, to point at the words of a queer for Palestine -



Personally, I find that to be entirely fair. My personal opinion may be more complicated and include more factors, but that certainly doesn't invalidate their opinion or make it idiotic, especially when it's invoking something so very basic.
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Well said and thank you.

My problem is that I just can't take anyone seriously who post crazy crap.

I can't help but return the favor.
 
I've said it before in other threads, the ICE thread in particular, but it's very relevant here too so I'll repeat myself.

The current administration has manufactured a mythology of violent antifa terrorists threatening the country. This is, of course, false, as no such thing is happening. But they are also using ICE to commit obvious and blatant atrocities against the population. This playbook is straight out of Machiavelli.

They are trying to provoke a violent response. Because if they can do that, the whole mythology underpinning the fascist takeover of the country instantly becomes true, and justifies everything they have done, are doing, and will do. Start fighting back, start using violence against ICE, and that gives them the excuse they need to send in the jackbooted thugs to put it down.

This is why the frog costumes are important. Frog and unicorn costumes completely destroy the narrative that the administration has spread - that antifa and violent leftists are the cause of everything wrong in America.

Stay strong. Keep the peace. Break the peace and they have won.
 
Trausti said:
I am fascinated by idiocy. Very entertaining.
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That's something you have in common with President Trump. His self-fascination is a consequence of his narcissism.

“I am pleased to inform our many U.S.A. Patriots that I am designating ANTIFA, A SICK, DANGEROUS, RADICAL LEFT DISASTER, AS A MAJOR TERRORIST ORGANIZATION. I will also be strongly recommending that those funding ANTIFA be thoroughly investigated in accordance with the highest legal standards and practices.”​

It is indeed somewhat fascinating that the idiot thought those two sentences were consistent with saying (just a couple of sentences earlier) that efforts to "suppress lawful political speech must be stopped." And then, just a couple of sentences after the quotation above, he boasted of "ordering military strikes on narcoterrorists" as though ordering unlawful extra-judicial killings was not itself an example of state-sponsored terrorism.
 
There is no 'Antifa'. How can we have a reasonable discussion in this thread when people don't understand that underlying premise?
 
Trausti said:
Why does the Left love Islam so much? Incredibly suicidal.
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People on the left generally tend to think that everyone should be free to hold whatever religious beliefs they wish, they object only when people of any religion attempt to impose their beliefs on those who do not share them. Christian fundamentalists are a much bigger problem in the US than Islamic fundamentalists in this respect.

It is in no way surprising that both moderate Christians and moderate Islamists are well represented on the left, and find common cause in opposing the far right.
 
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