Split Thread Are Antifa and violent leftists the cause of everything wrong in America?

[AmyStrange]

One of the oldest self-identified U.S. Antifa groups is Rose City Antifa in Portland, Oregon. It was founded in 2007. Many other local Antifa groups exist in the US. Decentralized does not mean they are not organized.

Are they a terrorist group too?

I guess being for freedom and equality is a bad thing in your little world.

Good luck with that, but thank you for your attention to this matter.

 

[Opcode]

Oh dear. Quoting Daily Mail, aka Daily Fail, aka Daily Heil, aka parrot-cage liner.

"...purported to be antifa leader...". But there is no antifa leadership, no organisation, no structure, no bosses. Might you not be concerned that a ◊◊◊◊-posting rag like the Mail totally made that up for gullible people like you? Hmmmm?

Antifa is decentralized, but it definitely exists and has organizers.

 

[AmyStrange]

Antifa is decentralized, but it definitely exists and has organizers.

Yup, they also existed during WWII, so they must've been a terrorist group too.

 

[bruto]

One of the oldest self-identified U.S. Antifa groups is Rose City Antifa in Portland, Oregon. It was founded in 2007. Many other local Antifa groups exist in the US. Decentralized does not mean they are not organized.

Nor does sharing the name of a principle, or even sharing a doctrine, mean they are.

 

[AmyStrange]

Nor does sharing the name of a principle, or even sharing a doctrine, mean they are.

Yup, they mustn't understand what anti-fascism actually means, but then again, they think being pro fascism is a good thing.

 

[Opcode]

Nor does sharing the name of a principle, or even sharing a doctrine, mean they are.

A group of people who meet at the same time and place, especially if they are wearing similar distinctive clothing and logos, is organized.

 

[AmyStrange]

A group of people who meet at the same time and place, especially if they are wearing similar distinctive clothing and logos, is organized.

So is ICE, and some people love them so much they're pretending to be one of them too:

Multiple ICE impersonation arrests made during nationwide immigration crackdown

Authorities in at least three states have arrested individuals allegedly impersonating Immigration and Customs Enforcement officers at a time when real ICE agents have ramped up immigration enforcement efforts under the Trump administration, adding to existing fears of law enforcement among migrant communities.

(SNIP)

Johnson was charged with three counts of kidnapping and one count each of impersonating a law enforcement officer, petty larceny, assault and battery, according to jail records.

Those are your real terrorist, not antifa.

 

[Aridas]

So like the fat clown, you think they're a terrorist group... bwahahahahahahaha... thanks for the laugh and for helping to prove me right.

BTW, where's their website? Where do they meet? I want to go.

To be serious here, just because -

Antifa (/ænˈtiːfə, ˈæntifə/) is a left-wing anti-fascist and anti-racist political movement. It is a highly decentralized array of autonomous groups in the United States.

To me, one of the more notable Antifa groups that come to mind was an Anti-Fa group that got together and formed a silent human wall between a group from Westboro Baptist that was being loudly hateful and a funeral that they chose to harass from the nearest distance they could.

Some of them were.

Like I said earlier, we know who they were because some of them were arrested, tried and convicted in courts of law.

Some, sure. With that said, though, all 3 of your listings are... not so impressive.

"Alissa Azar was found guilty by a Clackamas County jury Aug. 14 on charges related to a 2021 riot in Oregon City that involved a clash between Antifa and Proud Boys."

Azar found guilty after 2021 clash with Proud Boys at Clackamette Park | Clackamas County

Alissa Azar was found guilty by a Clackamas County jury Aug. 14 on charges related to a 2021 riot in Oregon City that involved a clash between Antifa and Proud Boys.

www.clackamas.us

So... you just brought up one of the various potential examples where Proud Boys and the like gathered with obvious intent to cause trouble and violence and you think that pretending that this is a good condemnation of Antifa would actually fly?

"Journalist Andy Ngo was awarded $300,000 on Aug. 21, 2023, in a lawsuit against purported anti-fascists who he says assaulted him in Portland, Oregon, in 2019 and 2021."

Andy Ngo isn't exactly a particularly trustworthy person when it comes to who he claims is anti-fascist. It's plausible, but, frankly, it's plausible that he'd call anyone who beat him up after he was being an ass whatever it suited him to call them. Anti-Fa is convenient for the narratives he pushes, either way.

"Since May 26, 2020, federal law enforcement authorities have arrested 100 people for crimes committed during local demonstrations."

74 People Facing Federal Charges for Crimes Committed During Portland Demonstrations

U.S. Attorney Billy J. Williams announced today that 74 people are facing federal charges for crimes committed adjacent to or under the guise of peaceful demonstrations in Portland since at least May 29, 2020.

www.justice.gov

That wasn't a list of Antifa. That wasn't a list of leftists. It's entirely plausible that such were among the names, but that's not what the list was of. Also, a number of those names were being charged with the incredibly violent charge of... failure to follow an order. That you would even try to pass that off as you did says more about how weak your position actually is than anything else.

Oh, thank you for posting that! Now we have written proof that even if somebody claims to be Antifa and belongs to a locally organized Antifa group, you are going to deny that Antifa exists! You are such a liar!

I don't care what you conclude. You are a nutcase! A poisonous nutcase!

Uhh... You might want to work on your reading comprehension for what he actually claimed, again. Anti-Fa in the sense that he's Anti-Fascist, not that he's affiliated with a group. Also, AmyStrange's pretty clearly trolling you overall after you pretty much invited him to do so.

 

[Darat]

Burning down cities, smashing storefronts and assaulting people are actions of terrorist groups. Of course, terrorist sympathizers would deny that takes place. This is how the Left has acted around the world for almost two centuries.

You know very well how to meet up with a local group.

"Burning down cities", can you provide a list of the cities that were burnt down?

 

[arthwollipot]

You are ignoring the fact that BLM and Antifa engaged in violent protests that caused billions of dollars in damage and resulted in dozens of people killed.

In 2020. How many arrests were made at the recent No Kings protests?

 

[arthwollipot]

Lots of people identify as Antifa. Local Antifa groups definitely exist, and they definitely organize protests.

Do you know what it says about someone when they declare Antifa to be their enemy?

 

[Norman Alexander]

Puh-tat-oh, Pat-awt-oh. If somebody claims to be Antifa, such as by wearing a jacket that says "Antifa," marches with groups of people who identify as Antifa, belongs to the local Antifa group and has a history of espousing Leftist views, then I take that as sufficient evidence that they are actual Leftists. What do you want? A blood sample?

Glamorous Antifa ringleader learns fate over clashes with Proud Boys

Alissa Azar, 33, learned her fate at the Judicial District Circuit Court of Oregon on Monday, three weeks after a jury found her guilty of felony riot and disorderly conduct.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Oh dear. Quoting Daily Mail, aka Daily Fail, aka Daily Heil, aka parrot-cage liner.

"...purported to be antifa leader...". But there is no antifa leadership, no organisation, no structure, no bosses. Might you not be concerned that a ◊◊◊◊-posting rag like the Mail totally made that up for gullible people like you? Hmmm

You are incorrect; ridiculously incorrect. A misdemeanor can be punished by up to a year in jail. A felony can be punished by more than a year in prison. Both generate a criminal record.

Oh. A year in prison, or a year in prison. THAT'S your distinction?

 

[Susheel]

Burning down cities, smashing storefronts and assaulting people are actions of terrorist groups. Of course, terrorist sympathizers would deny that takes place. This is how the Left has acted around the world for almost two centuries.

You know very well how to meet up with a local group.

In which fairy tale fantasy did this happen?

 

[arthwollipot]

Antifa is decentralized, but it definitely exists and has organizers.

Can you name any of them? Who is in charge of your local Antifa group?

 

[arthwollipot]

Oh. A year in prison, or a year in prison. THAT'S your distinction?

"Jail" and "Prison" are actually different in America. No, I didn't know that either until recently.

 

[Opcode]

To me, one of the more notable Antifa groups that come to mind was an Anti-Fa group that got together and formed a silent human wall between a group from Westboro Baptist that was being loudly hateful and a funeral that they chose to harass from the nearest distance they could.

That wasn't an Antifa group. That was Patriot Guard Riders (PGR). They aren't associated with Antifa and they have completely different tactics than Antifa. I can't find any instance of anyone who claims to be Antifa forming a human wall to shield anybody.

So... you just brought up one of the various potential examples where Proud Boys and the like gathered with obvious intent to cause trouble and violence and you think that pretending that this is a good condemnation of Antifa would actually fly?

No, the challenge to me was not to prove that breaking storefronts, looting and rioting are good reasons to condemn a group. The challenge posted to me was to prove that Antifa exists and participates in violent conduct. That's all that example was intended to demonstrate. You should concede me those points.

Andy Ngo isn't exactly a particularly trustworthy person when it comes to who he claims is anti-fascist.

The court sided with him.

That wasn't a list of Antifa. That wasn't a list of leftists. It's entirely plausible that such were among the names, but that's not what the list was of.

The list explains itself; a group of rioters who were arrested and charged. You can look up their backgrounds if you wish.

Also, a number of those names were being charged with the incredibly violent charge of... failure to follow an order. That you would even try to pass that off as you did says more about how weak your position actually is than anything else.

It's a data point, one of several I posted, and a small fraction that are easily findable on the Web, if you actually cared about facts.

Uhh... You might want to work on your reading comprehension for what he actually claimed, again. Anti-Fa in the sense that he's Anti-Fascist, not that he's affiliated with a group. Also, AmyStrange's pretty clearly trolling you overall after you pretty much invited him to do so.

Except that I've shown that people who are affiliated with Antifa groups have been arrested, charged and convicted. Your denials are typical of Leftist/Liberal dishonesty, and that's why I vote for Trump.

 

[Opcode]

"Burning down cities", can you provide a list of the cities that were burnt down?

Let's start with Portland, since this conversation will be predictable.

 

[Opcode]

In 2020. How many arrests were made at the recent No Kings protests?

I haven't paid any attention to the No Kings protests. Even so, I haven't heard of Antifa or BLM being involved in them, either.

 

[AmyStrange]

I haven't paid any attention to the No Kings protests. Even so, I haven't heard of Antifa or BLM being involved in them, either.

Why, because there was no violence?

 

[Susheel]

Let's start with Portland, since this conversation will be predictable.

Some members of the crowd marched to the Multnomah County Justice Center, the county jail and police headquarters. Video showed some protesters breaking windows on the building before entering, damaged computers, spraying graffiti and setting a small fire.

Yup...billions of dollars worth of damage and the city just burned down.