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Does 'rape culture' accurately describe (many) societies?

Darat said:
No I don't. There is no conspiracy or rather no more than likeminded folk agreeing on something can be described as a conspiracy. And there is no secrecy in this - you yourself have posted them saying this.
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I have no idea what you are talking about. Your assertion:
It is a very crafty bit of via the backdoor wholesale removal of most porn for UK based folk.

That is a conspiracy theory. You state: most porn. A citation would be required for that.
Darat said:
Do you really need your posts posted back to you? Don't you read your own posts?

The current "content regulations that already exist for pornography distributed offline" is the BBFC certification. It even tells you that later on in your quote: " Since 1984, legislation has existed to specifically prohibit offline content that the British Board of Film Classification (BBFC) would find unsuitable for classification"

What did do you think they are proposing?
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Again, your reason for reposting this is beyond me. Are you suggesting that Bonnie Blue's schoolroom orgy is unavailable online in the UK? Or that similar content is unavailable online here? We know the BBFC won't allow it on DVD, Blu Ray, Video on Demand or in Cinemas.
 
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Tracey Sweet:
The young girl fantasy is one that's played out a lot - there is a huge market for it. And we're going to do what the market wants.
Benjamin Nolot:
Be honest - how old are you made to look?
Tracey Sweet:
As young as possible - and I can look pretty freaking young.
 
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Poem said:
Everyone is biased, including Magic Lantern Pictures.
What you didn't do is show that their documentary is substantively wrong.
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What you did show is evidence that anti-porn sentiment is correlated strongly with religion. "Everyone is biased" is a weasel employed to excuse bias.

No, I didn't take time out of my day to watch a religious documentary of indeterminate length that bears a content warning. Did you think anyone here would? So I'm not going to comment on its content at all.
 
arthwollipot said:
What you did show is evidence that anti-porn sentiment is correlated strongly with religion. "Everyone is biased" is a weasel employed to excuse bias.
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The correlation is irrelevant if the documentary is essentially factual.
arthwollipot said:
No, I didn't take time out of my day to watch a religious documentary of indeterminate length that bears a content warning. Did you think anyone here would? So I'm not going to comment on its content at all.
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Right, so you are wasting my time then.
 
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Poem said:
I have no idea what you are talking about. Your assertion:
It is a very crafty bit of via the backdoor wholesale removal of most porn for UK based folk.

That is a conspiracy theory. You state: most porn. A citation would be required for that.
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I have provided the citation from the quotes you already posted. You don't seem to understand the current regulatory system that they are referring to. According to your sources they are saying for it to be legal in the UK online porn should be subject to the same regulatory conditions that exist for offline porn, which means a certification by the BBFC. What that would mean is that for the UK every single porn video that is viewable in the UK will have to be certified by the BBFC otherwise it will be illegal to show it to anyone in the UK. That will be very expensive - these are the fees for doing this: https://www.bbfc.co.uk/fee-tariffs , there is also the time taken for the BBFC to certify content that can take literally months, especially if there are back and forward discussions. Of course they could propose "grandfathering" in all the legal porn released before the date the legislation takes effect however I can find no indication that they want to do that.
Poem said:
Again, your reason for reposting this is beyond me. Are you suggesting that Bonnie Blue's schoolroom orgy is unavailable online in the UK? Or that similar content is unavailable online here? We know the BBFC won't allow it on DVD, Blu Ray, Video on Demand or in Cinemas.
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I've no idea if it is available or not - however if it depicts over 18-year-old performers as being under 18 it is currently illegal for anyone* in the UK to watch it. Even if online porn is to fall under the same regulatory system as offline porn it would still be illegal to watch, the change in the law wouldn't affect the availability of such material.


(*If you want to be pedantic about it could be viewed legally by the police, the various prosecutor services in the UK, in court as part of a trial etc.)
 
Darat said:
I have provided the citation from the quotes you already posted. You don't seem to understand the current regulatory system that they are referring to. According to your sources they are saying for it to be legal in the UK online porn should be subject to the same regulatory conditions that exist for offline porn, which means a certification by the BBFC. What that would mean is that for the UK every single porn video that is viewable in the UK will have to be certified by the BBFC otherwise it will be illegal to show it to anyone in the UK. That will be very expensive - these are the fees for doing this: https://www.bbfc.co.uk/fee-tariffs , there is also the time taken for the BBFC to certify content that can take literally months, especially if there are back and forward discussions. Of course they could propose "grandfathering" in all the legal porn released before the date the legislation takes effect however I can find no indication that they want to do that.

I've no idea if it is available or not - however if it depicts over 18-year-old performers as being under 18 it is currently illegal for anyone* in the UK to watch it. Even if online porn is to fall under the same regulatory system as offline porn it would still be illegal to watch, the change in the law wouldn't affect the availability of such material.


(*If you want to be pedantic about it could be viewed legally by the police, the various prosecutor services in the UK, in court as part of a trial etc.)
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Thanks. Before I respond, can you clarify if you do agree with the UK legislation? Do you agree that porn that suggests underage sex, even if the actress/actor is over 18, should be illegal?
 
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Poem said:
Thanks. Before I respond, can you clarify if you do agree with the UK legislation? Do you agree that porn that suggests underage sex, even if the actress/actor is over 18, should be illegal?
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Curious: What does my view on that matter have to do with your response to something that has nothing to do with my personal opinion on the matter?
 
Darat said:
Curious: What does my view on that matter have to do with your response to something that has nothing to do with my personal opinion on the matter?
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In the US such material is produced and distributed legally. Who is it that has your backing?

You know you could have just answered.
 
Poem said:
In the US such material is produced and distributed legally. Who is it that has your backing?

You know you could have just answered.
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As you could have answered so many of the posts here rather than trying to deflect the discussion.

Do you have anything of substance to say about the post of mine you quoted?
 
And to stop the deflection: Porn that tries to give the appearance that the performers are under 18 should be illegal, it should be treated exactly like porn that did use under 18-year-old performers.
 
Darat said:
And to stop the deflection: Porn that tries to give the appearance that the performers are under 18 should be illegal, it should be treated exactly like porn that did use under 18-year-old performers.
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Right - which is what you wrote way back (I just looked):
Darat said:
The current situation is that the porn that was described in your quotation is illegal, it is prosecuted when cases can be made, people go to prison. I can't think how clearer as a society we can be that we find such porn not only wrong but abhorrent.
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I think I just wanted to make the point that you are at odds with a good number of posters here. I previously wrote that such content is a sign of an uncivilised society.

Even so, such porn is easily available on the net in the UK.
 
Poem said:
Right - which is what you wrote way back (I just looked):

I think I just wanted to make the point that you are at odds with a good number of posters here. I previously wrote that such content is a sign of an uncivilised society.
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I doubt I am. And if so - "So what?"
Poem said:
Even so, such porn is easily available on the net in the UK.
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I wouldn't know as I would never even attempt to view any porn that I even thought might hint at having "under 18" content, whether by appearance or by performer. I would STRONGLY urge anyone in the UK in this discussion to not to try and research that at all. It is a serious criminal offence to view such material, and even viewing one frame could end up with you being in prison, fined and on the sex offenders register.
 
Darat said:
I have provided the citation from the quotes you already posted. You don't seem to understand the current regulatory system that they are referring to. According to your sources they are saying for it to be legal in the UK online porn should be subject to the same regulatory conditions that exist for offline porn, which means a certification by the BBFC. What that would mean is that for the UK every single porn video that is viewable in the UK will have to be certified by the BBFC otherwise it will be illegal to show it to anyone in the UK. That will be very expensive - these are the fees for doing this: https://www.bbfc.co.uk/fee-tariffs , there is also the time taken for the BBFC to certify content that can take literally months, especially if there are back and forward discussions. Of course they could propose "grandfathering" in all the legal porn released before the date the legislation takes effect however I can find no indication that they want to do that.
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How else are you going to make sure that content is legal? You are 100% behind UK law in preventing porn that suggests underage sex (and other harmful material), but complain about the reality of regulation.

Which is probably why we are at this situation - illegal but anyone can access it.
 
Darat said:
I doubt I am. And if so - "So what?"

I wouldn't know
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We know because the UK wants to tighten up the process of preventing access to such material. That is the gist of that Guardian article..

Darat said:
as I would never even attempt to view any porn that I even thought might hint at having "under 18" content, whether by appearance or by performer. I would STRONGLY urge anyone in the UK in this discussion to not to try and research that at all. It is a serious criminal offence to view such material, and even viewing one frame could end up with you being in prison, fined and on the sex offenders register.
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Bonnie Blue's content was, as you know, the subject of that Channel 4 documentary.
 
Poem said:
How else are you going to make sure that content is legal? You are 100% behind UK law in preventing porn that suggests underage sex (and other harmful material), but complain about the reality of regulation.

Which is probably why we are at this situation - illegal but anyone can access it.
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I complain about the current regulatory system in terms of the BBFC for all media, the use of a private, unaccountable company overseeing what can be viewed and purchased in the UK is wrong on so many levels, if we need such a body it should be a fully accountable public body. So I would oppose their remit being increased in any way.

We have clear definitions in UK law that say what is legal and not legal in regard to pornography no matter the media or distribution channel, and that is treated as a serious crime.

What you would need to do to change my mind that we need another regulatory system would be to explain how that would help prevent illegal porn from being accessible, if strong criminal offences don't deter people why would whether it featured an official certification or not alter that?
 
Poem said:
...snip...

Bonnie Blue's content was, as you know, the subject of that Channel 4 documentary.
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That was a documentary about porn, not porn of itself. According to all accounts there were no scenes shown from the (potentially) illegal porn. A new regulatory system for porn wouldn't have prevented that documentary from being made or shown as I don't believe that the porn was being produced in the UK.
 
I'm not really involved in this discussion, but I saw this article linked by Popbitch and thought it might interest people here:

Inside the grubby world of the goon squad
Gen Z wankers

I read it with increasing levels of surprise, shock and astonishment. It's all rather dystopian and disturbing. As such I feel you will all find it as fascinating as I did.
 
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