Transwomen are not Women - Part 15

[smartcooky]

Understatement of the year, right there. I've been assuming he was trolling up till now, but now I'm starting to wonder if the ignorance is genuine?

Right back at ya pal!

 

[smartcooky]

I am pointing out that there was a distinction between transvestites and transsexuals. This is correct and different from your claims.

No, it isn't.
You didn't see transsexuals or transvestites in the 1990s flaunting their BS, wearing dresses and beards at the same time, and waving their ladydicks around in public.

Also, while you may be ignorant of this, there were indeed complaints by feminists about the demands of transsexuals at least as far back as the nineties. This is something that you should know.

Very, very rarely. Nowhere near as frequently as now

By the way, “Actually, I think nobody cares what you think, least of all in this thread” is a hilariously bitchy thing to say.

Glad you found it useful

Nice to see you finally unblocked me though.

Whatever gave you the idea that you were blocked? I don't need to blocklist you take no notice of your BS

It was interesting watching you work yourself into a lather about people who had left the thread and ranting about them being cowards all the while skulking behind the block button.

Err, what?

 

[smartcooky]

Like, Rolfe and some other UKers seem to have a particularly aggressive and nasty local contingent of transpeople going out of their way to make a public scene at every opportunity, and she seems to think that's the norm.

It IS the norm. If you think there aren't violent pro-transgender protests in the USA, or that gender critical people are not harassed and threatened in the USA, then I have a bridge to sell you.

 

[Thermal]

No, it isn't.
You didn't see transsexuals or transvestites in the 1990s flaunting their BS, wearing dresses and beards at the same time, and waving their ladydicks around in public.

No, sweetie. YOU didn't. I and others most assuredly did. I saw far, far more then than I do now, too.

And all sparring and point scoring aside, that's the cool thing about an international discussion forum. We get to hear first hand about how differently things go down in other cultures, similar though they are, and get a shot of a different POV that we can go into detail about, more so than relying on googling some article.

 

[Thermal]

It IS the norm.

It is not.

If you think there aren't violent pro-transgender protests in the USA, or that gender critical people are not harassed and threatened in the USA, then I have a bridge to sell you.

Of course there are. The USA is a continent wide nation of a third of a ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ billion. If you can think of something, anything, we probably can find violent protests about it. And peaceful protests. And indifferent protests. And support demonstrations in every emotional representation.

 

[theprestige]

This is interesting. Over here in the States, that was not at all the case. I used to spend a lot of time in Atlantic City NJ USA, and going in the public restrooms on Pacific Avenue (the strip where most of the casinos were, and sharing a border with the famed red light district) was pretty much a free for all. Literally anyone might be in either room. Transvestites, transsexuals, guys in costume for whatever show they were working or audience members of, prostitutes of every description, whatever. The police did nothing till blood was flowing, and the prevailing consensus was along the lines of "Surprised? You must be new here". This was decades before our gender laws. If it was offensive to you, you went to an inland restroom, like in a Macy's. There, it was boys and girls in their respective rooms, but force of law or public vigilantism wasn't a thing, to my knowledge.

I stil live in the same state, and the 'TRA wish list' is codified in law. Nothing changed, except the town cleaned up considerably and now it's pretty much boys and girls in their respective rooms, with only a very, very occasional non-conformist in either.

I have no problem, as long as it's left up to local jurisdictions and private entities to decide their own rules. And as long as strict segregation is always a protected option for those that want to implement it.

 

[Thermal]

I have no problem, as long as it's left up to local jurisdictions and private entities to decide their own rules. And as long as strict segregation is always a protected option for those that want to implement it.

Ok, agreed. As long as it is codified clearly, ie this space is segregated by sex, not gender. And also that complaining about someone who is disruptive or intimidating is also *not* criminalized or penalized.

 

[smartcooky]

No, sweetie. YOU didn't. I and others most assuredly did. I saw far, far more then than I do now, too.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

You'll be able to provide evidence of widespread, violent, pro-trans protests from the 1990s, right? You'll be able to provide evidence of transsexuals and transvestites demanding access to women's toilets, women's refuges, women's rape crisis centres women's hospital wards and women's medical services? You will be able to show records of transvestites and transsexuals demanding that others must recognize them as real women, or that others must call them she or her? You will be able source newspaper articles showing they demanded not to be excluded from women's groups? You will be able to show us all the letters to the editor sections from 1990's newspapers featuring hordes of transsexuals and transvestites demanding that people who disagreed with them be suspended, or fired. Finally, you will be able to show everyone your evidence of them making death threats against people, and the families of people who disagreed with their demands. You'll be able to show us all how these transsexual and transvestite protesters in the 1990s urinated and defecated in public, vandalized and defaced public and private property, masturbated in the entrances of women's toilets, held placards imploring their supporters to kill people, and punched and kicked people who counter protested against them?

I'll wait (but I won't hold my breath)

Of course, you won't be able to provide ANY of this evidence - and this is the case, not be cause the evidence is hard or impossible to find, but because, as you know perfectly well, these things NEVER happened.

 

[Thermal]

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

And sharing personal experience helps to clarify how personal opinions are formed. If you will carefully read what you are quoting, i made not a single claim you buffoonishly now demand evidence of. I said only that your claim that we didnt see bearded transpeople etc was factually wrong, and I sure as hell did.That you continue to pretend (?) not to understand how any of this works is a source of amazement to me.

Eta: btw, when you were demonstrating your comical misunderstanding of what a transvestite was, you dropped a long list of things they "NEVER" did, claiming they were 'FACTS'. Seems like you are ahead of me in line for providing evidence of extraordinary claims.

Hell, the very post you are quoting was said in response to yet another unevidenced extraordinary claim you made. I merely pointed out that it was foolish for you to tell others what they experienced decades ago, and across the globe from you.

But I wouldn't hold you to backing up your own claims. We all know you're just making ◊◊◊◊ up.

 

[smartcooky]

And sharing personal experience helps to clarify how personal opinions are formed. If you will carefully read what you are quoting, i made not a single claim you buffoonishly now demand evidence of. I said only that your claim that we didnt see bearded transpeople etc was factually wrong, and I sure as hell did.That you continue to pretend (?) not to understand how any of this works is a source of amazement to me.

Eta: btw, when you were demonstrating your comical misunderstanding of what a transvestite was, you dropped a long list of things they "NEVER" did, claiming they were 'FACTS'. Seems like you are ahead of me in line for providing evidence of extraordinary claims.

Hell, the very post you are quoting was said in response to yet another unevidenced extraordinary claim you made. I merely pointed out that it was foolish for you to tell others what they experienced decades ago, and across the globe from you.

But I wouldn't hold you to backing up your own claims. We all know you're just making ◊◊◊◊ up.

Obvious switching of the burden of proof is obvious

 

[angrysoba]

No, it isn't.

You referred to anyone who might be considered to be transgender as having been considered a "transvestite". This is completely wrong. Transvestites were specifically cross-dressers. What do you think the "vestite" part means? It refers to clothes.

You didn't see transsexuals or transvestites in the 1990s flaunting their BS, wearing dresses and beards at the same time,

Sure you did. A school friend of mine back in the 1990s used to work the checkout where he would see the same guy walk in wearing a dress and a beard.

But why is it that that upsets you? Are you of the opinion a man cannot wear a dress and a beard? I thought you were meant to be opposed to gender stereotypes and now you are bringing them back.

and waving their ladydicks around in public.

It's allways thinking about ladydicks being "waved in public" with you, isn't it.

Very, very rarely. Nowhere near as frequently as now

For someone who claims to be Gender Critical, you seem rather ignorant of the literature of your movement.

Read this from Germaine Greer from 1989. Or don't, I suppose. Just keep yourself inside your ignorant bubble ranting and raving, doubling, tripling, quadrupling down...

 

[Rolfe]

Ouch. I hadn't seen that one before. There is an even earlier article that's often quoted to the same effect.

 

[angrysoba]

Whatever gave you the idea that you were blocked? I don't need to blocklist you take no notice of your BS?

Why do I get the idea I was blocked?

Probably because you told other posters in DMs that you had.

So are you lying now, or were you lying then?

 

[angrysoba]

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

You'll be able to provide evidence of widespread, violent, pro-trans protests from the 1990s, right? You'll be able to provide evidence of transsexuals and transvestites demanding access to women's toilets, women's refuges, women's rape crisis centres women's hospital wards and women's medical services? You will be able to show records of transvestites and transsexuals demanding that others must recognize them as real women, or that others must call them she or her? You will be able source newspaper articles showing they demanded not to be excluded from women's groups? You will be able to show us all the letters to the editor sections from 1990's newspapers featuring hordes of transsexuals and transvestites demanding that people who disagreed with them be suspended, or fired. Finally, you will be able to show everyone your evidence of them making death threats against people, and the families of people who disagreed with their demands. You'll be able to show us all how these transsexual and transvestite protesters in the 1990s urinated and defecated in public, vandalized and defaced public and private property, masturbated in the entrances of women's toilets, held placards imploring their supporters to kill people, and punched and kicked people who counter protested against them?

I'll wait (but I won't hold my breath)

Of course, you won't be able to provide ANY of this evidence - and this is the case, not be cause the evidence is hard or impossible to find, but because, as you know perfectly well, these things NEVER happened.

FACT: Goalposts have NEVER moved so far!

 

[smartcooky]

You referred to anyone who might be considered to be transgender as having been considered a "transvestite". This is completely wrong. Transvestites were specifically cross-dressers. What do you think the "vestite" part means? It refers to clothes.

And?

Sure you did. A school friend of mine back in the 1990s used to work the checkout where he would see the same guy walk in wearing a dress and a beard.

Personal anecdote noted

But why is it that that upsets you? Are you of the opinion a man cannot wear a dress and a beard? I thought you were meant to be opposed to gender stereotypes and now you are bringing them back.

Err, what?

It's allways thinking about ladydicks being "waved in public" with you, isn't it.

Observed reality. Have you be living under a stone or in a cave for the last decade?

For someone who claims to be Gender Critical, you seem rather ignorant of the literature of your movement.

Read this from Germaine Greer from 1989. Or don't, I suppose. Just keep yourself inside your ignorant bubble ranting and raving, doubling, tripling, quadrupling down...

View attachment 63337

And the relevance of this is??

 

[smartcooky]

Why do I get the idea I was blocked?

Probably because you told other posters in DMs that you had.

So are you lying now, or were you lying then?

Yeah, that was when you were throwing insults, calling me a liar, posting ad-hominems directed at me. Once you calmed down, I took you off.

 

[smartcooky]

FACT: Goalposts have NEVER moved so far!

What goalposts? You're being delusional.

 

[angrysoba]

Observed reality. Have you be living under a stone or in a cave for the last decade?

Dude, I'm not sure where you go to get your kicks, but I have not been "observing" ladydicks.

 

[angrysoba]

Yeah, that was when you were throwing insults, calling me a liar, posting ad-hominems directed at me. Once you calmed down, I took you off.

Then you now admit it, and what I said about your blocking me WAS true, even though you implied here that I was the one who was wrong...

You said, "Whatever gave you the idea that you were blocked? I don't need to blocklist you take no notice of your BS?"

 

[angrysoba]

And?

Personal anecdote noted

What does it matter if this is a personal anecdote?

It is a counter-example of your claim that it NEVER HAPPENED. You offer no evidence that it NEVER HAPPENED. You merely have a list of assertions that are untrue.

You seem to believe that by having long lists of SHOUTY BARE ASSERTIONS that you can forego reason, argument and evidence.

Err, what?

Observed reality. Have you be living under a stone or in a cave for the last decade?

And the relevance of this is??

What relevance? It again contradicts YOUR claim that these things NEVER HAPPENED!!!1!

Keep up!