Transwomen are not Women - Part 15

I've never seen any of that before. I don't know about ambiguity but surely the actual sex of the actress is blindingly obvious the entire time? It was to me.
Meh, I think most of the audience would perceive Pat as female, but most of the audience already knew that Pat was performed by a female. The sex of the actor was irrelevant to the bit, the whole series of sketches was a gag about not being quite sure whether Pat is male or female and all of the confusion it causes.

For most Americans, Pat has become part of our lexicon. I frequently use the name "Pat" as an example in various analogies, along with "Alex" and "Blake" and "Cameron". It's usually intentional on my part, because the sex of the actor in my analogy is irrelevant. But "Pat" is almost always the first choice, specifically because of that SNL bit.
 
That was what was so deceptive about the casting of a female actress as the trans-identifying male character in Coronation Street. She was read as female the entire time, subliminally grinding the idea that TWAW into all the viewers.
I've been really noticing this now. There are a lot of shows I'm rewatching that end up with a trans character in them, and they're almost always played by a female. It's contributed to this mass belief that males who identify as trans pass well and nobody can tell the difference.
 
I've made my position on this clear. Transsexuals do not get to choose their biological sex. Where biological differences are relevant, such as in some sports, they form a valid reason for grouping people into different categories to provide fairer competition.

Using a public toilet is an activity where biological differences are easily accommodated. This is not my opinion, it is a fact proven by the reality that many places such as small shops and cafes don't have the space for sex segregated toilet facilities and yet everyone manages to get along just fine.
Those small shops have single-use facilities.

What is your view on showers at the gym? Or nude spas? Or prisons?
 
The suffragettes didn't ask for this.
First-wave feminists didn't ask for this.
Second-wave feminists didn't ask for this.
Third-wave feminists didn't ask for this.
Radfems didn't.
FYI... Radical feminism was an offshoot of 2nd wave, call it second-and-a-halfth-wave. (today I learned that halfth is a word, I really expected spellcheck to object)
 
While I'm here...

Ideologically captured women: "Toxic masculinity is real! All men are Schrodinger's rapist! I'd rather meet a bear!"

Also ideologically captured women: "Protect the dolls! Men in our toilets!"

There's a "does a bear ◊◊◊◊ in the women's restroom?" joke in there somewhere.
The worst part of your post is that in real life... it the same damned women making both statements.

Me... I'm on the side of avoiding the bear because they're wild animals and can absolutely kill me and eat me for dinner if they so wished. I'm also on the side of keeping intimate spaces separated by sex. I mostly feel I'm on the side of practicality and acknowledgement that reality is real.
 
I think the highlighted says it all.
The highlighted part doesn’t say anything, because it needs the part you didn’t hilight in order to understand her meaning.
Why do you want to maintain the fantasy that women are these beautiful little angels that don't have bodily functions and just exist to look pretty and be ◊◊◊◊◊◊ by men?
The irony is that the only people I have actually heard say this and believe it is certain trans identifying males. Rolfe certainly never expressed anything of the sort.
My wife has lived on two continents and what you describe as being commonplace in public toilets is alien to her.
Ok. Your wife’s experience is evidently not representative of Rolfe’s experience. So what?
 
Why do you want to maintain the fantasy that women are these beautiful little angels that don't have bodily functions and just exist to look pretty and be ◊◊◊◊◊◊ by men?
Misogyny at its most obvious

My wife has lived on two continents and what you describe as being commonplace in public toilets is alien to her.
Well good on her. My partner lived in five countries in her time on this planet (Switzerland, Croatia, Canada, Australia and New Zealand) and what Rolfe described would pretty much match her experiences.

Reality is that everyone sees through the lens of their own experiences. What your wife experienced is no more relevant to this debate than those of my partner.
 
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Why do you want to maintain the fantasy that women are these beautiful little angels that don't have bodily functions and just exist to look pretty and be ◊◊◊◊◊◊ by men?

Just coming back to this anyway. I was advancing the point that women have particularly messy and embarrassing bodily functions which they require male-free spaces to deal with.

Make it make sense, somebody.
 
While I'm here...

Ideologically captured women: "Toxic masculinity is real! All men are Schrodinger's rapist! I'd rather meet a bear!"

Also ideologically captured women: "Protect the dolls! Men in our toilets!"
Pretty confident you'll never hear a single voice saying "Men in our toilets!" Not one, not ever. It's almost like they don't see transwomen as men, innit?

A transwoman is definitionally not biologically female. But socially, in terms of how we interact with them, they may as well be. They are way closer to being a woman than a man, till their pants come off, and in a restroom, that is done in single stall privacy. Same for a transman. For all publicly accesable transpersonal interactions, they are guys. I don't care what's in their pants, much as don't care what's in yours, even though you say you are a man. Your say-so is good enough for me, because actually interacting with your genitalia is not what treating you as a man is all about.
 
Why would transwomen using the men's restroom deprive them of dignity?
Walk a mile, man. You're a man, right? OK. Picture being told by some bigot "no, Hon, you're a woman. Now go to the little girls room like you should, with the other girls".

Feeling dignified? Respected?

And please don't say "well I am a man!" as a defense. Transwomen have a crossed wire somewhere in there, and think they are women. I get you don't accept that, but I do, from my personal interaction with a real one, and arms length interaction with a few others.

I accept that they believe they are women in the same way I accept that a gay man is sexually attracted to other men. I don't make up some bull ◊◊◊◊ AGP psychoanalitic diagnosis to make him out to be a perv getting his rocks off. I just accept it.
 
What you prescribe is already being done. It's even working, a little bit, slowly. But it's not the easy slam dunk you seem to imagine it should be. And the reality-denying response is a lot stronger and more entrenched than you seem to think.

You seem to believe you've come up with a simple and obvious solution that has escaped the rest of us. The truth is, we've already thought of it, already put it into practice, and are already dealing with the reality-denying pushback.
It might seem like that, but I expect that most people would have already come up with the same obvious simple solution to males and females who are using whatever toilets they want, and entering whatever sports competitions they want, because they are not labelled male and female.

The problem is that it hasn't happened yet as far as I can find. If you've seen examples of where it's happening can I have a link or something? I would love to see the data on whether it actually makes a difference.
 
I accept that they believe they are women in the same way I accept that a gay man is sexually attracted to other men.
Which is where the analogy fails. Being sexually attracted to the same sex makes somebody gay. Believing that one is a woman does not make somebody a woman. Demanding that people accept an ideological belief that what makes somebody a woman is their feelings is not even remotely comparable in any way, shape or form to asking people to accept that some people are attracted to the same sex. It is more comparable to demanding that they accept the truth of a religious belief.
I don't make up some bull ◊◊◊◊ AGP psychoanalitic diagnosis to make him out to be a perv getting his rocks off. I just accept it.
Refusing to look at evidence and accepting things without question if they make you feel morally superior and allow you to feel self-righteous in calling other people names. The hallmark of a true sceptic.
 
Here is why you don't get it and will never get it as long as you keep ignoring and handwaving away what you are being told.
It does not matter whether you label women's toilets "Females" or "Women" or "Ladies" or "Sheilas" or whatever. It will make no difference... Trans Identifying Males will ignore the labels and enter anyway because they are not so much interested in wanting somewhere to pee, as they are satisfying their misogynistic urge to stick it to women by waving their ladydicks around in women's faces. They claim that they feel uncomfortable using the men's, but are perfectly happy to make women uncomfortable by doing so.
Yeah lots of people in this thread keep saying I don't get it, it's happened a few times.
They tend to then follow with predictions of the future, rather than any data to show that I don't get it?

You are doing worse than that, you are saying every male in the trans community is a particular thing, namely misogynistic and wanting to get back at women by waving their ladydicks in their faces?

I know a few, one is my kid, do you know any?

They definitely don't fit the weird picture you described? Do you know any?
 
Which is where the analogy fails. Being sexually attracted to the same sex makes somebody gay.
I dont think they are. I think they are just pervs putting on gayface. Hows that sound? Familiar?
Believing that one is a woman does not make somebody a woman.
Nor do I assert it does. Thats why i dont call them women. They are transwomen. Have you heard that distinction made before?
Demanding that people accept an ideological belief that what makes somebody a woman is their feelings is not even remotely comparable in any way, shape or form to asking people to accept that some people are attracted to the same sex. It is more comparable to demanding that they accept the truth of a religious belief.
Disagreed, but I do see the similarity. Here in the States, we are pretty tolerant of going along with religious expression, too.
Refusing to look at evidence and accepting things without question if they make you feel morally superior and allow you to feel self-righteous in calling other people names. The hallmark of a true sceptic.
Not sure exactly what you are referring to, but if you mean the AGP reference, yes, I looked at the evidence. Or rather, it's proponents flatly repeated statement that they have none. Yeah, "hunches" (their choice of words) are not particularly robust evidence for a skeptic.
 

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