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Cont: The Trials of Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito: Part 32

Usually, the ECHR announces new judgments on Tuesdays and Thursdays. Today, I searched the HUDOC database for any judgment or decision on Sollecito v. Italy. The search found only the 2 February 2022 Communication of the case to Italy.

It may be that the ECHR has begun its August vacation; there were no new judgments (dated after 24 July 2025) listed.

One case, with 239 applicants, Demirhan and Others v. Turkiye 1595/20 2756/20 13487/20... 22 July 2025, may be of interest because it illustrates several issues. These issues include the workload of the ECHR, the kind of violations of the Convention that may occur, and the consistency of the ECHR in using precedent in its judgments. All the applicants had been found guilty of membership in an armed terrorist organization on the sole decisive (alleged) evidence that each had used an encrypted messaging system called "Bylock". Turkiye was found in violation of two Convention articles: 7 and 6.1. The ECHR explicitly suggested the applicants were entitled to a retrial, upon request, that conformed to the Convention, but no Just Satisfaction was awarded.

In paragraph 38, the ECHR states that it has formally communicated to Turkiye 5,000 similar cases. Other CoE or ECHR documents have stated that about 8,000 similar applications against Turkiye have been submitted to the ECHR.

The ECHR reasoning in the judgment relies mainly on a previous similar case, Yüksel Yalçınkaya v. Turkiye 15669/20 26 September 2023, where the applicant had been convicted of membership in an armed terrorist organization on the sole decisive evidence of his use of Bylock.

One sentence from paragraph 43 from the Demirhan and Others case illustrates the reasoning of the ECHR judgment that could well apply in a second Knox v. Italy case, and could have been used for the 2019 judgment Knox v. Italy:

The Court repeats at this juncture that in view of the importance of duly reasoned decisions for the proper administration of justice, the domestic courts’ silence on vital matters that went to the heart of the case raised well-founded misgivings regarding the fairness of the proceedings....


 
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Just watched an interview with Amanda Knox on youtube (David Pakman). Very impressive young woman! What must have been an extraordinarily difficult and painful time in her then very young life seems to have made her very insightful and aware of the human condition, and I couldn't catch even the smallest hint of bitterness as she discussed it. Yes, very impressive; she wears it well.

That's all. As you were.
 
Just watched an interview with Amanda Knox on youtube (David Pakman). Very impressive young woman! What must have been an extraordinarily difficult and painful time in her then very young life seems to have made her very insightful and aware of the human condition, and I couldn't catch even the smallest hint of bitterness as she discussed it. Yes, very impressive; she wears it well.

That's all. As you were.
Amanda Knox wrote an excellent review of the case from her viewpoint in The Atlantic after her re-conviction for calunnia.*

One point she makes is that the re-convicting courts used her ambiguous statements in her Memoriales as the decisive evidence against her. That is indeed the case. The MRs explicitly acknowledge the ambiguities in the Memoriales, but disingenuously and dishonestly claim that those ambiguities make those statements more attractive and convincing as evidence against Knox. The Italian texts of the MRs may be found on Knox's website.

*See:
 
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I could not agree more. Knox's first memoriale states very clearly she isn't sure what were real memories and what was only her imagination. She says "I want to make clear that I'm very doubtful of the veritity [sic] of my statements because they were made under the pressures of stress, shock and extreme exhaustion, " and
"But I've said this many times so as to make myself clear: these things seem unreal to me, like a dream, and I am convinced that they unsure if they are real things that happened or are just dreams my mind has made to try to answer the questions in my head and the questions I am being asked. But the truth is, I'm unsure about the truth and here's why..."


Then, of course, she states her retraction even more clearly the next day when she says she can't know who the 'real killer' is because she never went to the cottage that night.

How that can be seen as a confirmation of her statements is mindboggling. But I'm sure a PGP will be happy to explain to us how it is. :rolleyes:
 
Vixen has requested that I take this discussion to the right thread", so I am:

Vixen said:
Take it to the correct thread and I'll explain why John Douglas was SHILLING when he wrote his pure propaganda piece:

The Forgotten Killer: Rudy Guede and the Murder of Meredith Kercher​

Vixen said:
John Douglas was part of AK's paid for PR team in a cynical bid to swing her appeal. He is an unreliable narrator.
Vixen said:
Erratum: when I put in John Douglas' name on Amazon books, the book which came up was actually that of Douglas Preston, which I associated with said comment. So just to clarify, my comment above referred to Preston, not Douglas.
Stacyhs said:

Great. Then you can provide evidence that PRESTON "was part of AK's paid for PR team in a cynical bid to swing her appeal," thereby "He is an unreliable narrator."

The Forgotten Killer was published on Jan. 27, 2014. Knox didn't have an appeal filed then as Chieffi had ordered a re-trial in March 2013 and Knox wasn't convicted again by Nencini until January 30, 2014...3 days after the book's publication. Try again.
Vixen said:
Take it to the right thread.

We now have yet another person who, according to Vixen, is 'bent' and 'shilling' for the Knox.
Odd how Curatolo, Quintavalle, Kokomani, etc. were all not "unreliable narrators".
 
I could not agree more. Knox's first memoriale states very clearly she isn't sure what were real memories and what was only her imagination. She says "I want to make clear that I'm very doubtful of the veritity [sic] of my statements because they were made under the pressures of stress, shock and extreme exhaustion, " and
"But I've said this many times so as to make myself clear: these things seem unreal to me, like a dream, and I am convinced that they unsure if they are real things that happened or are just dreams my mind has made to try to answer the questions in my head and the questions I am being asked. But the truth is, I'm unsure about the truth and here's why..."


Then, of course, she states her retraction even more clearly the next day when she says she can't know who the 'real killer' is because she never went to the cottage that night.
w
How that can be seen as a confirmation of her statements is mindboggling. But I'm sure a PGP will be happy to explain to us how it is. :rolleyes:
That's how the Italian courts treated it in their re-conviction MRs. The clear confusion and wording such as "just dreams" were called "attractive" (if Google translation is correct) and the apparent doubts expressed were dismissed as defensive maneuvers, making the Memoriales equal to or more convincing expression of calunnia than Knox's (coerced) statements.

Because of that bizarre and unfair reasoning, I believe the ECHR should review the fairness of Knox's reconviction for calunnia.
 
Vixen has requested that I take this discussion to the right thread", so I am:







We now have yet another person who, according to Vixen, is 'bent' and 'shilling' for the Knox.
Odd how Curatolo, Quintavalle, Kokomani, etc. were all not "unreliable narrators".
Vixen's understanding of the authorship of The Forgotten Killer is faulty. The book has 7 authors; Douglas Preston is first author, John Douglas second, followed in order by Mark Olshaker, Steve Moore, Michael Heavey, Jim Lovering, and Thomas Lee Wright.

Douglas Preston is a well-known author of at least 10 non-fiction books and, often with collaborators, many novels and thrillers.

Preston had his own experience of aggressive questioning by prosecutor Mignini. Preston left Italy to avoid wrongful actions against him by Mignini; during Preston's stay in Italy he had investigated the Monster of Florence case with Mario Spezi. That episode predates the Meredith Kercher murder/rape case. Preston and Spezi wrote a book, The Monster of Florence, about that case and Mignini's questioning of Preston.

Mario Spezi was wrongfully detained in prison for 23 days on charges of impeding the investigation by Mignini, although the charges were overturned on appeal. A court later found that Spezi was jailed illegally and without any evidence of a crime.

As sole author, Douglas Preston wrote a 2013 book titled Trial by Fury: Internet Savagery and the Amanda Knox Case.

There's a Wikipedia article summarizing his biography and listing many of his writings:


 
Vixen's understanding of the authorship of The Forgotten Killer is faulty. The book has 7 authors; Douglas Preston is first author, John Douglas second, followed in order by Mark Olshaker, Steve Moore, Michael Heavey, Jim Lovering, and Thomas Lee Wright.

Douglas Preston is a well-known author of at least 10 non-fiction books and, often with collaborators, many novels and thrillers.

Preston had his own experience of aggressive questioning by prosecutor Mignini. Preston left Italy to avoid wrongful actions against him by Mignini; during Preston's stay in Italy he had investigated the Monster of Florence case with Mario Spezi. That episode predates the Meredith Kercher murder/rape case. Preston and Spezi wrote a book, The Monster of Florence, about that case and Mignini's questioning of Preston.

Mario Spezi was wrongfully detained in prison for 23 days on charges of impeding the investigation by Mignini, although the charges were overturned on appeal. A court later found that Spezi was jailed illegally and without any evidence of a crime.

As sole author, Douglas Preston wrote a 2013 book titled Trial by Fury: Internet Savagery and the Amanda Knox Case.

There's a Wikipedia article summarizing his biography and listing many of his writings:


And every single person you mentioned above was bent and a shill for Knox!
:sarcasm:

It's a conspiracy bigger than 9/11, the JFK assassination, the 1969 moon landing, and the 2020 stolen election! RUSSIA, RUSSIA, RUSSIA! :crazy:
 
And every single person you mentioned above was bent and a shill for Knox!
:sarcasm:

It's a conspiracy bigger than 9/11, the JFK assassination, the 1969 moon landing, and the 2020 stolen election! RUSSIA, RUSSIA, RUSSIA! :crazy:
You forgot to mention that THEY'RE ALL IN THE MAFIA! or THEY'RE RELATED TO SOMEONE IN THE MAFIA! or maybe it's the MASONS! or the US STATE DEPARTMENT! or DONALD TRUMP AND HILARY CLINTON!

Also, the Italian POLICE, Italian PROSECUTORS, and Italian JUDGES NEVER EVER MAKE MISTAKES! NOR DO THEY EVER VIOLATE THE LAW!

:crazy:
 
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.....

Also, the Italian POLICE, Italian PROSECUTORS, and Italian JUDGES NEVER EVER MAKE MISTAKES! NOR DO THEY EVER VIOLATE THE LAW!

:crazy:
But let's take the ECHR case, pending before the CoM, of Urgesi and Others v. Italy 46530/09 8 June 2023.

In a civil case separate from but following upon a related criminal case with the same defendants, the second judge (rapporteur, the reporting judge) had been one of the prosecutors of the defendants, and of course had publicly stated that they were guilty.

The ECHR wrote in its judgment (Google translation; words in square brackets are my clarifications):

82. ... if a judge is seized of [given judicial authority in] a case that he or she has already dealt with within the scope of his or her duties within the prosecution service, individuals may legitimately fear that he or she will not offer sufficient guarantees of impartiality....
95. In light of the foregoing considerations, the Court considers that the issues submitted to U.M. [the reporting judge] for consideration in each of the two sets of proceedings were, with respect to all the applicants, essentially the same or, at the very least, strictly related, and that the applicants' fears regarding a lack of impartiality on the part of the Lecce Court of Appeal could therefore be considered objectively justified.
96. The Court ... notes that in the instant case the Court of Cassation did not consider the merits of the case and dismissed the ground of appeal relating to the impartiality of the Court of Appeal (see paragraph 21 above), thus failing to remedy the latter's lack of impartiality....
97. In light of the foregoing, the Court concludes that the Lecce Court of Appeal, which ruled on the application of preventive measures to the applicants, was not an impartial tribunal. There has therefore been a violation of Article 6 § 1 of the Convention.


So was this a mistake by the Italian judicial authorities or an intentional act to bias the Court of Appeal hearing the case? Does it matter to the defendants? Does it not suggest at a minimum a certain level of carelessness or incompetence on the part of the Italian judiciary?
 
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What are people's views on the Italian justice system. Do you feel the Italian justice system is corrupt and dysfunctional and what happened to Amanda and Raffaele in my view shows a system with many flaws.
 
Vixen's understanding of the authorship of The Forgotten Killer is faulty. The book has 7 authors; Douglas Preston is first author, John Douglas second, followed in order by Mark Olshaker, Steve Moore, Michael Heavey, Jim Lovering, and Thomas Lee Wright.

Douglas Preston is a well-known author of at least 10 non-fiction books and, often with collaborators, many novels and thrillers.

Preston had his own experience of aggressive questioning by prosecutor Mignini. Preston left Italy to avoid wrongful actions against him by Mignini; during Preston's stay in Italy he had investigated the Monster of Florence case with Mario Spezi. That episode predates the Meredith Kercher murder/rape case. Preston and Spezi wrote a book, The Monster of Florence, about that case and Mignini's questioning of Preston.

Mario Spezi was wrongfully detained in prison for 23 days on charges of impeding the investigation by Mignini, although the charges were overturned on appeal. A court later found that Spezi was jailed illegally and without any evidence of a crime.

As sole author, Douglas Preston wrote a 2013 book titled Trial by Fury: Internet Savagery and the Amanda Knox Case.

There's a Wikipedia article summarizing his biography and listing many of his writings:


As you yourself affirm, Douglas Preston had a massive grudge against Mignini, having been advised to leave Italy or face charges re the Spezi affair. Preston led the Union of Journalists (or whatever its called) against Mignini issuing a complaint about West Seattle Herald shilling for Knox, whose husband is the grandson of the then proprietor and his uncle the editor. So Preston had it in for Mignini and his methods were particularly obnoxious, trying to appeal to the MAGA Jim Crow mentality of 'You've got the black guy, you don't need to look for anyone else'.
 
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That's how the Italian courts treated it in their re-conviction MRs. The clear confusion and wording such as "just dreams" were called "attractive" (if Google translation is correct) and the apparent doubts expressed were dismissed as defensive maneuvers, making the Memoriales equal to or more convincing expression of calunnia than Knox's (coerced) statements.

Because of that bizarre and unfair reasoning, I believe the ECHR should review the fairness of Knox's reconviction for calunnia.
The background of the hearing is that Knox’ defence had demanded the Calunnia conviction be quashed, owing to the ECHR finding , 24 Jan 2019, under Article 6, Right to a Fair Trial, and in part Article 3, freedom from psychological pressure. that (a) a lawyer was not provided as of the time Knox made her verbal allegations against Patrick Lumumba, and that (b) the interpreter provided, Anna Donnino, had exceeded her remit in providing Knox emotional support (the ECHR upheld). Florence Court points out: “However, the Strasbourg Court did not find any infringement of Article 81 EC in substantive terms. 3 of the Convention, observing that there was "nothing to support the conclusion that the applicant had been subjected to the inhuman and degrading treatment complained of.”

The only remaining allowable evidence re the Calunnia charge, was the written document dated 6 Nov 2007, which Knox had handed to policewoman Ficarra, as ‘a gift’, after having provided two statements earlier. It was decided by the Central Court of Cassation (Supreme Court) 10 Oct 2023 that the case should go back down to trial, with the oral statements impermissible and the remaining independently-written aforementioned one assessed on its merits as to whether it could be said to be a case of Aggravated Criminal Calunnia against Lumumba. Aggravated, as it relates to a serious crime that attracts more than two years imprisonment and in addition, “and of teleological connection, ex art. 61 n. 2 cod. pen. for having acted in order to obtain impunity for all and, in particular, Guede Rudi Hermann for the crime of murder”. Knox was jailed for three years for ‘multiple aggravated slander’, with some aggravating elements excluded by the Fifth Chambers final report of 17 Mar 2015. The College of Legality had thus ruled that the convictions of 26 Mar 2013 and that of 27 March 2015 together with the Perugia Court of Appeal 3 Oct 2011 – the controversial Hellmann court that saw Knox freed to fly back to America but still convicted of Calunnia – should all be annulled. So, this hearing related to the retrial and re-conviction of Calunnia, albeit with time served.

Knox’s oral accusations against Lumumba had been made at around 01:00 and again at 05:45; these are the statements now barred as evidence because of the ECHR ruling. Knox’s claimed ‘retraction’ was written in private and in English at circa 13:00, the same day. The warrant executed for Lumumba’s arrest and subsequent imprisonment had been enacted at 08:30 that morning (6 Nov 2007) and thus, precedes the timing of the memo in question.

The Defendant’s Case – (Mr. Carlo Dalla Vedova del Foro di Roma and Mr. Luca Luparia Donati del Foro di Milano)

The defence for Knox argued that “ the memorial was a dream-like account of the fragments of a nightmare in which Amanda Marie Knox repeatedly admitted that she was unsure of having lived the confusingly reported experience, which re-emerged in the reality elaborated by her mind, badly prostrated after the last interrogation held the previous night. These were flashbacks which she herself doubted to the point of questioning who the real murderer was and of ruling out the possibility of being considered a witness against Diya Lumumba."

The Florence Appeal Court rejected this claim reasoning that the language deployed was escamotage – a ploy. For something to be considered circumstantial evidence, there needs to be a logical chain of events that leads up to it and from it. The Court pointed out Knox’s use of the clear chain of events of: seeing Patrick in the basketball court – seeing him at the door and hearing Meredith’s screams – couldn’t be claimed to be a ‘messy dream’, in particular because the event of Meredith’s screaming had been independently witnessed and verified by two separate neighbours and because Knox was the only person with the key to access the building that night.

The Civil Party’s Case (Mr. Carlo Pacelli del Foro di Perugia)

The counsel for Lumumba argued “In this regard he highlighted the part of the writing in which Amanda Marie Knox claimed that she had not lied when she had said that she thought the killer was Patrick and added immediately afterwards: 'I really thought he was the murderer.'"

Arguments

The defence for Knox claimed the memo represented a retraction of the claims she had made during the early hours and a need to clarify that she was doubtful and confused. The Florence Court rejected this saying that far from being a retraction or a description of a dream state, it was a reiteration, with the language used not expressing doubt but as ‘a ploy’ or a literary device, if you like. It explained that under the criminal code, a defendant was allowed to lie about their own involvement in a crime (= equivalent to the right not to incriminate oneself) but when an innocent third party is blamed it brings in the concept of risk brought to that person and Knox had endangered Lumumba with imprisonment and the risk of a conviction of a serious crime, of which he did unfairly serve fourteen days.

In its reasoning, it further points out the transcripts of police wire-tapping taken of Knox with her mother, in which she says she felt ‘terrible’ about what she had done to Lumumba. Putting him “in a horrible situation and in jail through her fault, reiterating that concept several times”. Yet, the court points out, Knox failed to mention Lumumba’s innocence at her later remand hearing, indicating a deliberate false accusation against Lumumba.

The court also notes, ‘The defendant told her mother - who spoke of possible lies spread artificially by the mass media - "But it is stupid. I can't say any more, because I know that I was there and I can't lie about it, I have no reason to." (bold mine).

The defence had also argued that Knox’s memo written at circa 13:00 of the 6 Nov 2007 (four days after the murder, at the Questura) was after the time of the order of detention of Lumumba, at 08:30, and thus, they argue, cannot be said to have caused his arrest, her earlier statements which caused this, now not being permitted as evidence.

The court dismisses this point stating, “On the other hand, for the offense of slander to be capable of being characterized, it is only necessary that the false accusation contains in itself the necessary and sufficient information for the initiation of criminal proceedings against a person who is unequivocally and easily identifiable, as was certainly the case - even nominally and documentally - in the present case.”

It rejects the claim Knox was confused and bringing up false memories because of the logical nature of the sequence of events she describes, as pointed out above. In any case, a false memory typically occurs when a person suffers a traumatic event and is unable to remember what happened. Later, with the passing of time, one’s brain fills in the missing details to make sense of the forgotten parts, and these details may be false. For a memory to be false, a traumatic event must have happened in the first place, for example, early childhood abuse or a car crash. If Knox had never been at the cottage whilst Meredith was murdered, how could she have a false memory of it? It certainly wouldn’t qualify as a ‘false memory’ in its proper sense.

The court writes: “To conclude on this point, it must be added that - a fortiori - the essential and direct nature of the false accusation does not make it either absurd or unlikely and confirms its suitability to integrate the material element of the alleged crime".

In Knox’s statement to the court she says, ‘'I wanted the police to know that I was doing my best to cooperate .”

Florence Court comments:

'It must be said that the crime of slander requires general intent, that is to say, the conscience and willingness to charge a person who is innocent of a crime, the reason for the false accusation being irrelevant (Cass. 2489 of 2000).


<snip>

Amanda Marie Knox was perfectly aware of Diya Lumumba’s innocence, as Patrick is known from a number of elements.

The first is that the defendant was at the time of the murder of Meredith Kercher at the house and, therefore, she knew that there was no Diya Lumumba there.

The figure is clear from Knox's own writing, which is located inside the house and reports a scream from Meredith ("I saw myself curled up in the kitchen with my hands over my ears because in my head I heard Meredith shouting").

That harrowing scream, which in her account required her to carry her hands to her ears and to curl up in the kitchen in an attempt not to hear it, was a fact that really happened and was clearly perceived by Capezzali Nara and Monacchia Antonella, two neighbors of the house, with dwellings located near the cottage of via della Pergola n. 7, who both heard her, deeming it anomalous and atrocious, so much that they were shocked.

<snip>

Meredith Kercher's harrowing scream, at the time of writing the accusatory statement against Diya Lumumba in the Knox memorial, was an element unknown to investigators and to anyone who could not hear it because they were not present in or near the house where the murder took place.

<snip>


That circumstance shows - first - the presence of Amanda Marie Knox in the house where homicide occurred, at the time when it occurred, a place where, moreover, she herself sits (‘curled up in the kitchen with her hands over her ears’) and, secondly, that the defendant was perfectly aware of the innocence of Diya Lumumba, known as Patrick, who was certainly not in that house.'

It concludes:

'The persistence of this attitude marks a clear departure from the behavior aimed at cooperation with investigators, often represented by the defense and by the defendant herself, most recently in her final statements.

3. In short, Amanda Marie Knox must be held liable for the crime of aggravated slander within the meaning of Article 2(2) of Regulation No 40/94. 368 cod. pen., ascribed to you in subpart F).

The judgment at first instance must, however, be reformed in part, first, by considering the definitive exclusion of the aggravating teleological link by reason of the formation of a final judgment on Knox’s acquittal from the charge of participation in the murder of Meredith Kercher, handed down by the Court of Cassation on 27 March 2015, and, second, from the point of view of the treatment penalized.'

[Follows various court costs orders.]

Thus decided in Florence on 5/6/2024

The Managing Director II President

Angelo Grieco Anna Maria Sacco
 
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What are people's views on the Italian justice system. Do you feel the Italian justice system is corrupt and dysfunctional and what happened to Amanda and Raffaele in my view shows a system with many flaws.
I was watching the Netflix programme about the London 7/7 bombings and I was struck by how the Italian police successfully aprehended one of the bombers, in Italy, who had fled the country. You see, the police really do have better things to do with their time than trying to frame innocent kiddies in the event of an horrific and horrendous brutal and cruel murder. It is just a story you tell yourself to justify your support of someone who - with hard cold objective scientific evidence - was at the scene of the crime as of the time and hasn't the honesty to come clean. In addition, deceiving people into buying her 'innocence' merchandise, which, to be fair, is a reflection on those fans themselves in their willingness to swallow the misogynist view that a female can't possibly commit such a serious offence, and therefore must have been the victim of the prosecutor. An absurd story but here's what you propagate.
 
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I was watching the Netflix programme about the London 7/7 bombings and I was struck by how the Italian police successfully aprehended one of the bombers, in Italy, who had fled the country. You see, the police really do have better things to do with their time than trying to frame innocent kiddies in the event of an horrific and horrendous brutal and cruel murder. It is just a story you tell yourself to justify your support of someone who - with hard cold objective scientific evidence - was at the scene of the crime as of the time and hasn't the honesty to come clean. In addition, deceiving people into buying her 'innocence' merchandise, which, to be fair, is a reflection on those fans themselves in their willingness to swallow the misogynist view that a female can't possibly commit such a serious offence, and therefore must have been the victim of the prosecutor. An absurd story but here's what you propagate.
More lies and hyperbole. You support the real killer in Guede while trying to pin this on two innocent people, as found by the Italian courts.
 
More lies and hyperbole. You support the real killer in Guede while trying to pin this on two innocent people, as found by the Italian courts.
The Italian courts confirm (see Sacco ruling re the recent Aggravated Calunnia Ruling) that it is a fact Knox was at the crime scene. There is zero evidence I 'support the real killer in Guede'.
 
The Italian courts confirm (see Sacco ruling re the recent Aggravated Calunnia Ruling) that it is a fact Knox was at the crime scene. There is zero evidence I 'support the real killer in Guede'.
And as has been pointed out hundreds of times, the 'evidence' of her being at the crime scene is her interrogation statements, and since these statements were ruled inadmissible, there is NO EVIDENCE Amanda was at the crime scene when the crime took place. That you continue to repeat what is clearly an unsubstantiated claim proves your blind, hateful bias towards Amanda. You're being incredibly dishonest, and you know it.
 
The Italian courts confirm (see Sacco ruling re the recent Aggravated Calunnia Ruling) that it is a fact Knox was at the crime scene. There is zero evidence I 'support the real killer in Guede'.
You said there was scientific evidence they were at the crime scene, but we know that's a lie. There are pages of evidence that you support Guede, we can all read.
 
And as has been pointed out hundreds of times, the 'evidence' of her being at the crime scene is her interrogation statements, and since these statements were ruled inadmissible, there is NO EVIDENCE Amanda was at the crime scene when the crime took place. That you continue to repeat what is clearly an unsubstantiated claim proves your blind, hateful bias towards Amanda. You're being incredibly dishonest, and you know it.


Yup, not only does he hate Amanda, but he also hates Meredith and loves Guede.


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