Trump's promised ICE raids have begun

Ziggurat said:
It's not about the number of similarities. You can rack up quite a count of meaningless stuff that way (Hitler was a vegetarian and loved dogs). It's about essential qualities. What makes Nazis Nazis, and not like other groups you might not like? If there isn't overlap on the essentials, then the comparison isn't valid no matter how many non-essential similarities you might find.
Click to expand...
Oh but there are many, many "essentials". So how many until the comparison is apt?
 
Ziggurat said:
You keep making the same error. If the mother actually wanted to bring the child with her, then no, it wasn't. You can say we don't know, and so it's a potential denial, but you cannot conclude at this stage that it was an actual denial. The court certainly doesn't take that view.
Click to expand...
If the father was allowed a substantive phone call, and the request properly adjudicated, you might be right, but that is not what happened.
 
Hercules56 said:
Says nothing about no due process. She was arrested and
charged with a crimewhich is the beginning of Due Process.
Click to expand...
Show me where she was charged.

NVM. She has since been formally charged with assaulting an Ice officer, which is probably not at all a trumped up charge.
 
Last edited:
Resume said:
If the father was allowed a substantive phone call, and the request properly adjudicated, you might be right, but that is not what happened.
Click to expand...
The father wanted a phone call, but he's not actually entitled to one. The mother is. We do not know if she wanted one. You can say that the fact that we don't know is itself a problem, but it's not necessarily the same problem as her being denied one.
 
Ziggurat said:
The father wanted a phone call, but he's not actually entitled to one. The mother is. We do not know if she wanted one. You can say that the fact that we don't know is itself a problem
Click to expand...
It is a huge problem.

After the father of the 2-year-old learned that his family was detained, his lawyer called immigration officials to inform them that V.M.L. is a U.S. citizen and could not be deported, according to court documents.

Before the court responded to the habeas petition and a motion for a temporary restraining order, the 2-year-old, along with her mother and sister, were deported to Honduras, according to court filings.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Ziggurat said:
The father wanted a phone call, but he's not actually entitled to one. The mother is. We do not know if she wanted one. You can say that the fact that we don't know is itself a problem, but it's not necessarily the same problem as her being denied one.
Click to expand...
The child was not actually deported unless there is a specific deportation letter for said child. The mother had every right to take her child with her. It's called parental rights.
 
Resume said:
Andrea Velez.
Click to expand...
Something interesting from that article:

"While it’s not yet clear how many citizens have been affected by the administration’s attack on immigrant communities, a government report found that between 2015 and 2020, Ice erroneously deported at least 70 US citizens, arrested 674 and detained 121."

Now I know where you got your "at least 70 US citizens" from. But as we discovered when actually looking at that report, that's not what it says. It ways 70 potential US citizens. The difference is significant. So they ◊◊◊◊◊◊ up on a fact that we can verify. That makes me very suspicious of all the supposed facts they claim that we cannot verify.

So is there any other reporting on the incident which might help clarify things? Why yes, apparently there is.

ICE detains a U.S. citizen in L.A. and charges her with obstructing an arrest

"Andrea Velez appeared in federal court Thursday charged with assaulting a federal officer while he was attempting to arrest a suspect and was released on $5,000 bail. She did not enter a plea and is due back in court on July 17."

Huh. Will you look at that. A totally different story, and nothing to do with Andrea's citizenship or immigration status. Now, did she actually assault an officer? I don't know, and I doubt you do either. That's what her court case will determine. But I see nothing about this so far to indicate that she's been denied any due process. She was arrested, arraigned, given a lawyer, and released on bail. Seems fairly standard for someone accused of assaulting police.
 
NM156 said:
Oh but there are many, many "essentials". So how many until the comparison is apt?
Click to expand...
Given that you're in favor of assassinating democratically elected leaders, I'm not sure it's wise of you to pursue this question.
 
Resume said:
I'm betting she assaulted an ice person by hitting his fist with her face.
Click to expand...
Given your track record with assertions, I'm betting not. I'm betting ICE had body cam footage of her assault, and will show that in court, and she will either plead or be convicted. It's not like she would be the only person lately to assault an ICE agent. But regardless, the case is not what you presented it as. Which also fits your track record.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Back
Top Bottom