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Ed Israel/US Attacks Iran /Yet Another Country/Iran

Iran and Israel are launching missile attacks and air strikes against one another. It's being reported 80 people have been killed in Iran -- including 20 children -- and 4 in Israel. Hundreds have been injured on both sides. Aljazeera reports:

Iran launched a new wave of missiles at Israel, saying that it targeted fighter jet fuel production facilities and energy supply centers in Israel, killing at least three people. Israel attacked Iranian targets throughout the day, targeting energy infrastructure, including an oil storage facility in Tehran, igniting a huge fire. Aljazeera article link
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Sharhan oil depot on fire near Tehran on Saturday.

It's a mess.
 
20 children killed in Iran. Were they nuclear scientists??? Revolutionary Guard generals??

Nope. Clearly IDFascists are targeting civilians. Or they have TERRIBLE aim.
 
If you think that Israel doesn't target civilians, it's because you are reading only news that support your priors. About a hundred Iran civilians have been killed by Israel in the first strike, about a thousand wounded. That's because their Targets lived in apartment building, and they took out entire floors and buildings to get a single person.
Israel's causalities are way lower.

Also, as anyone with a bone of intellectual honesty would admit, it's easier to target more precisely if you have superior reconnaissance, air superiority and superior weapons and none of your weapons are intercepted.
Israel put a lot of military sites in heavily populated areas, using it's population as human shields.

A little honesty would suit people claiming to be skeptics. Israel is the aggressor; any Israeli deaths in retaliation to its attack are its fault.
All the people kiled in Israel would have been alive if Netanjahu hadn't attacked for no good reason whatsoever besides that he could.
 
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Yeah, there's perhaps a tiny bit of celebrating due to those rockets landing on top of Palestinians. I'm sure there are Jews who consider the results of Muslims killing Muslims as "divine justice" (you offered a report that was somewhat lacking in details, by the way. How many celebrated? Just 4? or 400? Who knows?! I saw a video that provides a glimpse at one family being outwardly grateful that the rocket barrage didn't hit them and landed on a neighboring Palestinian village instead).
There's no love lost between Jews and Palestinians in Israel. For you to point this out, would be like saying that the sky appears blue.
However, the vast & overwhelming majority of people in Israel are just as upset and distraught at the deaths of ANY Israelis, and you don't see them celebrating, not in Bat Yam, not in Jerusalem, not in Alfe Menashe.

As an aside, it's kinda disgusting to see someone come in here to the discussion and immediately begin to bash Israel and denounce Israelis as "fascists" because of an isolated response to these attacks. Yet, when people in the ARAB WORLD are mass-celebrating Jews killed in Israel by ballistic missiles, that information is not on the radar.
 
webfusion said:
Yeah, there's perhaps a tiny bit of celebrating due to those rockets landing on top of Palestinians. I'm sure there are Jews who consider the results of Muslims killing Muslims as "divine justice" (you offered a report that was somewhat lacking in details, by the way. How many celebrated? Just 4? or 400? Who knows?! I saw a video that provides a glimpse at one family being outwardly grateful that the rocket barrage didn't hit them and landed on a neighboring Palestinian village instead).
There's no love lost between Jews and Palestinians in Israel. For you to point this out, would be like saying that the sky appears blue.
However, the vast & overwhelming majority of people in Israel are just as upset and distraught at the deaths of ANY Israelis, and you don't see them celebrating, not in Bat Yam, not in Jerusalem, not in Alfe Menashe.

As an aside, it's kinda disgusting to see someone come in here to the discussion and immediately begin to bash Israel and denounce Israelis as "fascists" because of an isolated response to these attacks...
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Those Jews who call for starvation in Gaza, who called for expanded settlements in the West Bank, who ignore acts of racist terrorism against Arabs in the West Bank by racist settlers, who call for the Arabs of Gaza to be expelled, are indeed FASCISTs. The shoe fits and they wear it well. I call them Judeo-Fascists because their version of fascism has a Jewish agenda.
 
is anyone (besides blatant liars like Netanyahu) claiming that there was a military necessity for the attack on Iran prior to the negotiations?
 
The Great Zaganza said:
If you think that Israel doesn't target civilians, it's because you are reading only news that support your priors. About a hundred Iran civilians have been killed by Israel in the first strike, about a thousand wounded. That's because their Targets lived in apartment building, and they took out entire floors and buildings to get a single person.
Israel's causalities are way lower.

Also, as anyone with a bone of intellectual honesty would admit, it's easier to target more precisely if you have superior reconnaissance, air superiority and superior weapons and none of your weapons are intercepted.
Israel put a lot of military sites in heavily populated areas, using it's population as human shields.

A little honesty would suit people claiming to be skeptics. Israel is the aggressor; any Israeli deaths in retaliation to its attack are its fault.
All the people kiled in Israel would have been alive if Netanjahu hadn't attacked for no good reason whatsoever besides that he could.
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Israel is not targetting Iranian civilians. Their strikes have been targeted, unlike (some of) Iran's strikes, especially if you also factor in their proxies. Targeting civilians is a war crime. And no, just cause Iran can only retaliate in this manner does not magically make it OK. Too bad, maybe don't refuse to allow weapons inspections in when the country you've vowed to utterly anhilate because your regime needs a scapegoat, has vastly superior capabilities than you. The Iranian regime made this mess.
 
lobosrul5 said:
Huh, Iran refused to negotiate. The 60 days were up.
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That is completely incorrect.
Iran had a scheduled negotiation for TODAY with the US.

But even if Iran had refused to negotiate (which they did NOT!), how does that translate into a legitimate reason to kill their leaders and dozens of bystanders?
 
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And, seriously: who can still say that Israel doesn't target civilians when they bomb and burn children in tents set up in Safe Zones set up by Israel.
Destroying wells and hospitals, blocking food transports: these are targeting civilians exclusively.

Honesty please
 
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The Great Zaganza said:
That is completely incorrect.
Iran had a scheduled negotiation for TODAY with the US.

But even if Iran had refused to negotiate (which they did NOT!), how does that translate into a legitimate reason to kill their leaders and dozens of bystanders?
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Iran was playing games. There have been no serious negotiations this year. The iaea has said Iran has continously failed to meet negotiations. If Iran was really, or likely still is, close to nuclear bomb then this is totally justified. If a country's leadership was close to getting a nuke and decried they'd use it against the USA we'd use far less restraint against them than Israel.


Eta, The IAEA's statement last Thursday. Please read it.

 
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lobosrul5 said:
Iran was playing games. There have been no serious negotiations this year. The iaea has said Iran has continously failed to meet negotiations. If Iran was really, or likely still is, close to nuclear bomb then this is totally justified. If a country's leadership was close to getting a nuke and decried they'd use it against the USA we'd use far less restraint against them than Israel.


Eta, The IAEA's statement last Thursday. Please read it.

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again, how those that translate into a Casus Belli?
by no measure is Iran "close" to a nuclear bomb.

Even by the most bellicose statement of US intelligence, Iran was at least 9 months away from having enough enriched material for testing one device.
It would have been years before the first actual warhead, more before one that could be mounted on a missile.

for 40 years Israel has claimed that Iran's access to nuclear weapons is imminent, and it has always lied.


BTW, how compliant is Israel with IAEA rules?

Guess we should bomb it according to the standards you have set.
 
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The Great Zaganza said:
again, how those that translate into a Casus Belli?
by no measure is Iran "close" to a nuclear bomb.

Even by the most bellicose statement of US intelligence, Iran was at least 9 months away from having enough enriched material for testing one device.
It would have been years before the first actual warhead, more before one that could be mounted on a missile.

for 40 years Israel has claimed that Iran's access to nuclear weapons is imminent, and it has always lied.


BTW, how compliant is Israel with IAEA rules?

Guess we should bomb it according to the standards you have set.
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9 months is pretty close man. Israel had an opportunity to strike top Iranian leaders that might not present itself again.

International organizations are saying Iran is not complying with inspections. There's only one plausible explanation for this.

Israel is not threatening other countries with their nukes. So, no. That'd make about as much sense as bombing France.
 
lobosrul5 said:
9 months is pretty close man. Israel had an opportunity to strike top Iranian leaders that might not present itself again.

International organizations are saying Iran is not complying with inspections. There's only one plausible explanation for this.

Israel is not threatening other countries with their nukes. So, no. That'd make about as much sense as bombing France.
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will you read you own post, please?

how is Iran threatening Israel with nukes, when it doesn't have any ?
meanwhile, Israel is threating Iran almost every week, if not more. And it does have nukes.

come one, do the reasonable step and admit that the attack was not necessary before the negotiations to safeguard the existence of Israel.
 
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The Great Zaganza said:
will you read you own post, please?

how is Iran threatening Israel with nukes, when it doesn't have any ?
meanwhile, Israel is threating Iran almost every week, if not more. And it does have nukes.

come one, do the reasonable step and admit that the attack was not necessary before the negotiations to safeguard the existence of Israel.
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The Iranian regime has repeatedly called for Israel's annihilation. Its really not a big stretch of the imagination that they will use nuclear wepons for such purpose. You also clearly took my words out of context. I never said Iran was threatening anyone with nukes.

No. I fully support preventing Iran from getting nuclear weapons by military means. Why dont you admit that if Iran wasnt threatening Israel and wasnt pursuing a nuclear weapons program that this war wouldnt exist?
 
lobosrul5 said:
Israel is not targetting Iranian civilians. Their strikes have been targeted, unlike (some of) Iran's strikes, especially if you also factor in their proxies. Targeting civilians is a war crime. And no, just cause Iran can only retaliate in this manner does not magically make it OK. Too bad, maybe don't refuse to allow weapons inspections in when the country you've vowed to utterly anhilate because your regime needs a scapegoat, has vastly superior capabilities than you. The Iranian regime made this mess.
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If Israel was ONLY targeting military instillations in Iran, no children would die.

Yet children are dying in Iran from Israeli strikes.

That means either the IDFascists have TERRIBLE aim or they are targeting civilians.
 
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