Transwomen are not Women - Part 15

[Thermal]

◊◊◊◊ them! ◊◊◊◊ every single one of them!

Brevity is indeed the key to clear communication. Years and tens of thousands of posts could have been replaced with the above.

 

[Agatha]

Wouldn't it need to be demonstrated first that males and females have different "brain chemistry"?

Because I don't think that's been conclusively shown. For example: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-00677-x

And even if it was evidenced that men and women have gendered brains, and even if it was then shown that trans-identifying men have the "brain chemistry" of women, I'm not sure that would overcome any of the objections that people have expressed about men competing in women's sports, nor in single-sex spaces such as changing rooms or DV shelters.

 

[Thermal]

Wouldn't it need to be demonstrated first that males and females have different "brain chemistry"?

Because I don't think that's been conclusively shown. For example: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-00677-x

And even if it was evidenced that men and women have gendered brains, and even if it was then shown that trans-identifying men have the "brain chemistry" of women, I'm not sure that would overcome any of the objections that people have expressed about men competing in women's sports, nor in single-sex spaces such as changing rooms or DV shelters.

Seems to me an XY originated brain would kinda invariably produce an XY originated chemistry, whatever that specifically is?

 

[theprestige]

I think a very important issue for the subject is the following: do trans women actually have the chemistry and brain of a woman? I'm sure there has been some research on this.

Follow up: if trans women actually do have the brain chemistry of a woman as opposed to a man, that would definitely change my thoughts on the issue.

Wouldn't it need to be demonstrated first that males and females have different "brain chemistry"?

Because I don't think that's been conclusively shown. For example: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-00677-x

And even if it was evidenced that men and women have gendered brains, and even if it was then shown that trans-identifying men have the "brain chemistry" of women, I'm not sure that would overcome any of the objections that people have expressed about men competing in women's sports, nor in single-sex spaces such as changing rooms or DV shelters.

One thing we do have some stats about is patterns of sexual offense in males versus patterns of sexual offense in females. You probably already figured out which pattern transwomen sexual offenders follow.

 

[Emily's Cat]

If you're going to add things I didn't say, then you're not worth engaging with. Please only attribute to me what I actually say.

I didn't attribute anything to you.

 

[Emily's Cat]

And it’s just impossible to figure out who is faking it so all trans-people need to be treated as criminals.

This is false.

All transgender identified males are males, and should be treated as males.

The fact that some males will fake it only makes that resolution stronger.

 

[Rolfe]

And that's important to know when undergoing some medical treatment, or if you are planning to ◊◊◊◊. For the other 99.999% of human interaction, like simply going to the bathroom in a public facility, it doesn't make the slightest difference.

Obviously it doesn't to you, so you take it upon yourself to decree that it doesn't make the slightest difference to anyone else either. News flash. It makes a great deal of difference to many women, for reasons that have been enumerated in this thread multiple times. It also seems to make a fair bit of difference to a fair number of men, who are embarrassed by the presence of the opposite sex in their intimate spaces.

Then we have changing facilities, showers, sleeping accommodation, sports...

 

[Emily's Cat]

I've gone my whole life with never a thought about men's dicks. Every guy I met could be a eunuch for all I know. Their Johnson means dead zero to me in how we interact or relate to each other. Everything significant about being a man (to me, anyway) has nothing to do with their cocks.

Good for you.

Do you understand that the dynamic is NOT the same when the interaction is between males and females? Like, every interaction I have with other females has nothing at all to do with their breasts, butts, or vulvas... but that's not true for interactions the average male has with females.

 

[Rolfe]

I think a very important issue for the subject is the following: do trans women actually have the chemistry and brain of a woman? I'm sure there has been some research on this.

Follow up: if trans women actually do have the brain chemistry of a woman as opposed to a man, that would definitely change my thoughts on the issue.

They don't. A study of cadaver brains that purported to find some similarities between TIM brains and female brains has been debunked to hell and gone. Also, you only have to look at the massive, overwhelming male entitlement and domineering male behaviour of TIMs to realise that they quite obviously have the "chemistry and brain" of a man.

Objectively, every cell in the brain is the sex of the rest of the body, and the "chemistry" of the endocrine system is the chemistry of the sex of the body. Some men mess with this, to their detriment, but it still doesn't mean they're women in any sense of the word.

 

[Rolfe]

Seems to me an XY originated brain would kinda invariably produce an XY originated chemistry, whatever that specifically is?

Yes. For once we are in agreement.

 

[Thermal]

Obviously it doesn't to you, so you take it upon yourself to decree that it doesn't make the slightest difference to anyone else either. News flash. It makes a great deal of difference to many women, for reasons that have been enumerated in this thread multiple times. It also seems to make a fair bit of difference to a fair number of men, who are embarrassed by the presence of the opposite sex in their intimate spaces.

Then we have changing facilities, showers, sleeping accommodation, sports...

Ya I think you may have fallen behind in the discussion a bit.

In the US state I live, we have every legal access for transpeople imaginable, right down to high school locker room showers, which I thought would be a line never to be crossed. Apparently we crossed that Rubicon many years ago, and... nothing happened.

I had asked my wife about transwomen in rest rooms, and she said you see one once in a while, but who cares? A friend of hers goes to a gym called Planet Fitness, where there are a couple transwomen regularly in the locker room. Nothing happens.

And if you get tempted to whine about anecdotal evidence, you might recall that's all the tweets you post amount to.

All y'all's tranny freak sexual fantasies aren't happening. People seem to be far better than you imagine, and can conduct themselves normally.

 

[Emily's Cat]

I have a good compromise on a lot of these issues. Only men who have undergone reconstructive surgery to remove their testicles and penis, and hormone therapy to remove facial hair and grow boobs, aka transsexuals, should be allowed in women's bathrooms and locker rooms. But they cannot compete in women's sports because they still have the muscle and skeletal structure of a man.

If you still have a penis and testicles you do not belong in the women's locker room or shower or bathroom.

I can't tell you how much I loathe males declaring what females should have to tolerate, with no consideration for female's views at all.

And the ever present, much ignored question remains: How the heck are females supposed to know whether the male-bodied person who just sauntered into our locker room has their wedding tackle or not?

 

[Rolfe]

Ya I think you may have fallen behind in the discussion a bit.

In the US state I live, we have every legal access for transpeople imaginable, right down to high school locker room showers, which I thought would be a line never to be crossed. Apparently we crossed that Rubicon many years ago, and... nothing happened.

I had asked my wife about transwomen in rest rooms, and she said you see one once in a while, but who cares? A friend of hers goes to a gym called Planet Fitness, where there are a couple transwomen regularly in the locker room. Nothing happens.

And if you get tempted to whine about anecdotal evidence, you might recall that's all the tweets you post amount to.

All y'all's tranny freak sexual fantasies aren't happening. People seem to be far better than you imagine, and can conduct themselves normally.

You think nothing happens We could start with self-exclusion.

 

[Emily's Cat]

Because for all intents and purposes, they are no longer male to the women around them who feel threatened by a shlong in their face when they are getting undressed.

They're still male to the females who interact with them. In almost every case.

Please don't take it upon yourself to mansplain what females perceive.

 

[Thermal]

Good for you.

Do you understand that the dynamic is NOT the same when the interaction is between males and females? Like, every interaction I have with other females has nothing at all to do with their breasts, butts, or vulvas... but that's not true for interactions the average male has with females.

I do, but that was not what I was talking about. We had some male posters swooning about cock kind of unrelated to female threats. So there's that.

 

[Thermal]

They're still male to the females who interact with them. In almost every case.

Please don't take it upon yourself to mansplain what females perceive.

I don't. I am paraphrasing literally every female I am close enough to talk about this with, including my kids and wife and her friends and our families.

I really am finding it harder to understand the couple of vocal posters here who are screaming out a very different perspective (while claiming it is representative) than literally every other female I see anywhere.

 

[Mycroft]

Stop playing silly games by feigning ignorance

- YOU said those things
- I called you out for it
- YOU posted a link to back up YOUR claim
- I asked you show me where in the link it supports the things YOU claimed

I've pointed out the flaw in your reading comprehension. I can't understand it for you.

Read it again slowly. You won't find a part where I attribute it to you.

 

[Mycroft]

Only if you cling to the convenient but simplistic idea that this is all about the Y chromosome. It isn't. It's about the SRY gene, which WOMEN with Swyer's syndrome don't have (at least in a functional form).

Argue about CAIS if you like but Swyer's isn't open for debate.

You just declare it's not part of the debate. I disagree.

It shows biology is more complex than men are men and women are women.

 

[Thermal]

You think nothing happens We could start with self-exclusion.

Mind tossing in a few nouns and verbs to clarify what the hell you are talking about?

I can find no reporting of dem tranny freaks or poser tranny freaks attacking anyone anywhere in my wide open state. No twitter reporting of it, or complaining of coverups, pretty much nothing. What you assert as a horrific and inevitable certainty of perverted hordes kinda looks like it ain't happening in this rather large petri dish over here.

 

[Rolfe]

You just declare it's not part of the debate. I disagree.

It shows biology is more complex than men are men and women are women.

No, it doesn't. It really, really doesn't. Just that the usual story told to high school children is a simplification.