The Truth about RFK Jr

[angrysoba]

He was probably up against Dr Mercola, Dr Oz, and Deepak Chopra.

To be honest, although he talks complete cobblers about mysticism and quantum stuff, I actually had no idea what his views on vaccines were. From what I can see, with a small bit of Googling, he seems to be pretty pro-vaccine, including for Covid (which was the gateway vaxx for a lot of the MAGA people).

So honestly, I would rather have Chopra. In fact, I would probably rather have Oz. Neither would be on any short-list of any sane administration, but it shows what a mess we are in that they are both better than the actual Secretary for Health and Human Services.

 

[Norman Alexander]

He was probably up against Dr Mercola, Dr Oz, and Deepak Chopra.

I'm surprised RFK Jr. got the job, then.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

An unvaccinated adult has died in New Mexico; this person tested positive for measles. My present inclination is to blame not just RFK Jr (he has held his present position for a very short period of time but has a long history promulgating measles misinformation). Media influencers and politicians have done the country a great deal of damage by stoking unfounded fear of vaccination. For example, ABC News discussed VP Vance's 2024 appearance on Joe Rogan's podcast: "Vance also said he's worried that there may be a "conflict" in 30 to 40 years with developing countries because they have a negative perception of Westerners for "giving them health care that isn't actually health care," referring to vaccines". The story went on to say, "In August 2024, a Gallup poll found that fewer Americans today consider childhood vaccines -- with 40% saying it is extremely important for parents to have their children vaccinated, down from 58% in 2019 and 64% in 2001." I wonder how RFK, Jr. will respond to this death.

 

[angrysoba]

An unvaccinated adult has died in New Mexico; this person tested positive for measles. My present inclination is to blame not just RFK Jr (he has held his present position for a very short period of time but has a long history promulgating measles misinformation). Media influencers and politicians have done the country a great deal of damage by stoking unfounded fear of vaccination. For example, ABC News discussed VP Vance's 2024 appearance on Joe Rogan's podcast: "Vance also said he's worried that there may be a "conflict" in 30 to 40 years with developing countries because they have a negative perception of Westerners for "giving them health care that isn't actually health care," referring to vaccines". The story went on to say, "In August 2024, a Gallup poll found that fewer Americans today consider childhood vaccines -- with 40% saying it is extremely important for parents to have their children vaccinated, down from 58% in 2019 and 64% in 2001.
" I wonder how RFK, Jr. will respond to this death

Thoughts and prayers?

 

[johnny karate]

And the explanation is unconvincing. Here's a balanced medical research article on the use of placebos in medical trials:

The Truth About Placebos in Clinical Trials

Understanding the truth about placebo-controlled studies can help alleviate hesitation in participating in these trials. Learn more now.

wakeresearch.com

By the way, RFK Jr. is urging parents in Texas to get their kids vaccinated against the measles in response to the measles outbreak in the state, saying, “Vaccines not only protect individual children from measles but also contribute to community immunity, protecting those who are unable to be vaccinated for medical reasons.”

Congrats on another dead body. It must be disappointing that it wasn't a child.

 

[angrysoba]

Mike Griffiths 1, are you going to address these questions I asked you?

Of course you will use his op-ed as a convenient fig-leaf, but you forget that on the first page of this very thread you posted a bunch of links to websites of Del Bigtree, your own website and that of RFK Jr's claiming that MMR vaccine causes autism.



So you're giving us mixed messages here, Mike!

1. Do you or do you not support the MMR vaccine to control the current measles epidemic?

2. Do you or do you not support the MMR vaccine as a method of preventing future measles epidemics?

3. Should you have some concerns about the MMR vaccine and, along with RFK Jr, urge parents to get vaccinated against measles, would you argue that a future vaccine be tested against a saline solution placebo, knowing that those who are in the control group run the risk of measles infection, OR would you advocate testing it against the current vaccine?

Answers please!

The point is, like most anti-vaxxers, you pretend on the one hand that you are not spreading anti-vaxx BS by saying that RFK is in favour of the MMR vaccine, and yet at the same time, your links were explicitly against the MMR vaccine.

Are you going to square the circle on this? Please answer my questions.

 

[Resume]

Once again,. measles were all but eliminated in 2000, but due to science deniers and anti-vaxxers, we have another death in the anti-vax column.

Thanks anti-vax maga-morons.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Citing a story by Reuters, MedPage wrote, "The CDC is planning a large study looking into potential connections between vaccines and autism, two sources told Reuters, despite significant research showing vaccines and autism are not linked...It's unclear whether HHS Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr., who has long promoted anti-vaccine views, is involved in the planned CDC study or how it would be carried out, Reuters said."
Before he dropped out, RFK spoke about putting an eight-year pause on research into infectious diseases; therefore, it is likely that RFK, Jr had a hand in moving this idea forward. One, a new CDC study is at best a waste of resources that could be better spent on combatting infectious diseases by the most appropriate means. Two, if the study is performed with a Ladapo-like regard for the facts, then it will be worse than useless; it will increase vaccine hesitancy and be actually harmful.

 

[Resume]

Citing a story by Reuters, MedPage wrote, "The CDC is planning a large study looking into potential connections between vaccines and autism, two sources told Reuters, despite significant research showing vaccines and autism are not linked...It's unclear whether HHS Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr., who has long promoted anti-vaccine views, is involved in the planned CDC study or how it would be carried out, Reuters said."
Before he dropped out, RFK spoke about putting an eight-year pause on research into infectious diseases; therefore, it is likely that RFK, Jr had a hand in moving this idea forward. One, a new CDC study is at best a waste of resources that could be better spent on combatting infectious diseases by the most appropriate means. Two, if the study is performed with a Ladapo-like regard for the facts, then it will be worse than useless; it will increase vaccine hesitancy and be actually harmful.

This actually scares the living ◊◊◊◊ out of me. Who know what sort of anti-vax scientists will be running this "study?" Ladapo-like facts aren't factual at all, and I fear only propaganda and disinformation will be the results.

 

[KDLarsen]

I'm just wondering how long it'll be before they go after the vaccine courts.

 

[dudalb]

But if there's one thing you can say about RFKJr, it's that he was hired entirely on merit.

His Merit consisting of dropping out of the Presidential race and urging his supporters to vote for Trump.'
Pure transactinal deal. Which is why I think he is vulnerable; if he becomes a problem jfor Donnie, out he goes.

 

[Mojo]

Recommending treatment for a disease instead of the vaccine that prevents it is like recommending wheelchairs instead of wearing a seatbelt.

Can you imagine the (ETA: justified) outrage if there was a cheap and simple way to prevent disease and "Big Pharma" was campaigning against it and suggesting treatments for disease as an alternative?

 

[Planigale]

Can you imagine the (ETA: justified) outrage if there was a cheap and simple way to prevent disease and "Big Pharma" was campaigning against it and suggesting treatments for disease as an alternative?

I always point out when anti-vaxxers raise the big pharma argument that vaccines are not good for their bottom line, uncontrolled infections that they can sell drugs to treat would be a much better business model.

 

[angrysoba]

Can you imagine the (ETA: justified) outrage if there was a cheap and simple way to prevent disease and "Big Pharma" was campaigning against it and suggesting treatments for disease as an alternative?

 

[Lukraak_Sisser]

I always point out when anti-vaxxers raise the big pharma argument that vaccines are not good for their bottom line, uncontrolled infections that they can sell drugs to treat would be a much better business model.

Exactly. If anything Big Pharma is (in most of the world, but soon not the US) bound by rules and regulation. Medicine needs to be proven to work, needs to be developed, pass clinical trials etc etc.
Alternative medicine (Big A) needs none of that. No quality control, no trials, no accountability. So anything they sell is limited to the costs of their base resources and packaging, and everything else is pure profit.
Yet somehow these companies are presented as altruistic? Even though they sell snake oil that will NEVER help and thus always be needed at obscene profit margins pharmaceutical companies can only dream of?

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Reuters reported, ""So, we're going to find out what it is, and there’s nobody better than Bobby and all of the people that are working with you,” Trump said, referring to Kennedy...This week [Senator] Cassidy questioned Trump’s nominee to lead the National Institutes of Health, Dr. Jay Bhattacharya, over his stance on investigating a potential link between autism and childhood vaccinations.
"I don't generally believe there is a link, based on my reading of the literature," Bhattacharya said. "But we do have a sharp rise in autism rates, and I don't think any scientist really knows the cause of it. I would support a broad scientific agenda based on data to get an answer to that.""
The latter a studiously vague statement, but let me make a suggestion based upon what he said. Maybe Secretary Kennedy should propose an initiative to study the origins of autism in general and then keeps his hands off. The problem with Secretary Kennedy is that he has already made clear which answer is the correct one in his mind.

 

[angrysoba]

Reuters reported, ""So, we're going to find out what it is, and there’s nobody better than Bobby and all of the people that are working with you,” Trump said, referring to Kennedy...This week [Senator] Cassidy questioned Trump’s nominee to lead the National Institutes of Health, Dr. Jay Bhattacharya, over his stance on investigating a potential link between autism and childhood vaccinations.
"I don't generally believe there is a link, based on my reading of the literature," Bhattacharya said. "But we do have a sharp rise in autism rates, and I don't think any scientist really knows the cause of it. I would support a broad scientific agenda based on data to get an answer to that.""
The latter a studiously vague statement, but let me make a suggestion based upon what he said. Maybe Secretary Kennedy should propose an initiative to study the origins of autism in general and then keeps his hands off. The problem with Secretary Kennedy is that he has already made clear which answer is the correct one in his mind.

Wait, Cassidy is worried that Jay Bhattachariya might be led by some lunatic head of the HHS? Cassidy must be wondering how such a lunatic got confirmed in the first place.

 

[dann]

Vitamin A appears to be about as efficient as a treatment for measles as vitamin D is as a treatment for COVID-19:

Vitamin A should be given to children with measles. It is WHO recommendation (although the US is no longer a member of WHO?) It reduces severity of disease. I append US specific guidance. It is not an alternative to vaccination in prevention. There is no evidence vitamin A prevents infection.

https://www.nfid.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/04/Call-to-Action-Vitamin-A-for-the-Management-of-Measles-in-the-US-FINAL.pdf

RFK Jr. touts vitamin A for measles prevention. Doctors disagree. (USA Today, Mar 7, 2025)
What experts say about the use of vitamin A to treat or prevent measles
While RFK cited recent CDC guidance for the use of vitamin A in treating and preventing measles, the notice itself states that "vaccination remains the best defense against measles infection" and that the disease "does not have a specific antiviral treatment."
Likewise, it mentioned vitamin A only as "supportive care" that "may be appropriate" if administered under the direction of a physician.
The use of vitamin A is linked to measles in that it is sometimes recommended for use in infected patients, especially children, who are already malnourished or nutrient deficient, according to the World Health Organization (WHO).

This one's from today:

'He's distracting us': the dangers of RFK Jr.'s measles response (MSNBD on YouTube, Mar 10, 2025 - 7:00 min.)
Dr. Ashish Jha, Dean of the Brown University School of Public Health, joins Jonathan Capehart to discuss the uptick of measles cases across the country.
4:43--> And what is the treatment for someone who's not vaccinated, who gets the measles? Is the treatment easy, relatively fast, or is it not?

Dr. Ashish Jha: Look, there is no known treatment. We give vitamin a on the outside chance that they have vitamin A deficiency. But that's not going to help you if you don't have vitamin A deficiency. It's largely supportive care. A majority of people do okay, but we know, in kids, one to three out of every thousand will go on to develop encephalitis. That's an inflammation of the brain. That is a very bad thing to have.
About one in 1,000 kids end up dying from measles.
There are other long-term effects of getting measles. It wipes out your immunity in a way that can be quite damaging.
So there is, what we talk about is supportive care, just trying to get people through the infection. There is no known treatment for measles.

They also talk about vaccines and autism:

5:43--> The CDC is planning to do a study on vaccines and autism, something that has been debunked many, many times. Why this obsession to find a link between the two?

Dr. Ashish Jha: Yeah, as you said, Jonathan, this has been studied thoroughly. It has been studied to death. And even Jay Bhattacharya, the new NIH director, who's going to be coming in, agrees: The science is settled.
What they're doing is by keeping raising this kind of doubts about vaccine safety and even launching this study, which is going to be a huge waste of money, they're going to be ble to continue to say, 'Well, we don't really know if there is a link. We're studying it.' And continue to foment doubt.
So to me, this is not an intellectually honest effort to get to the bottom of a question that has already been settled. I'm unconvinced that these guys are going to be persuaded by whatever this study finds. But for months and years, as these study, as this study goes on, they're going to continue to be able to question the safety of vaccines, causing more harm, more illness, and unfortunately more deaths for America's children.

As for Jay Bhattacharya, Science-Based Medicine has several article about him. This one is from yesterday:

Dr. Edward Livingston On Vaccines & Autism: “Because of Public Skepticism, it is Not Settled Science” (Science-Bsased Medicine, Mar 9, 2025)
Dr. Bill Cassidy, a Republican Senator from Louisiana, has permanently cemented his reputation as a spineless jellyfish who caved to pressure and voted to confirm RFK Jr. Now that it’s too late, he is futilely trying to erase his shameful legacy by making accurate but impotent pro-vaccine statements whenever possible. According to news reports about the confirmation hearing of Dr. Jay Bhattacharya:

In one contentious exchange, Senator Bill Cassidy of Louisiana, the committee’s Republican chairman, lamented that Dr. Bhattacharya had stopped short of saying the question of whether vaccines cause autism had been resolved. “It’s been exhaustively studied,” said Mr. Cassidy, a doctor and fierce supporter of vaccination. “The more we pretend like this is an issue, the more we will have children dying from vaccine-preventable diseases.”
Dr. Bhattacharya responded that more research was needed as long as American parents were concerned enough not to vaccinate their children. “My inclination is to give people good data,” he said.
To that, Mr. Cassidy suggested that there already was good data, and that “precious limited taxpayer dollars” could not be devoted to every last fringe theory.
“There’s people who disagree that the world is round,” he said. “People still think Elvis is alive.”

I personally look forward to the Trump administration's new studies to determine the shape of the earth.
Musky might actually know something useful about that one.
As for Elvis, how do we know that he is dead, like, dead for real?

 

[Chris_Halkides]

RFK Jr. must be behind this. The Independent referenced the Washington Post, "The National Institutes of Health will reportedly cancel or scale back dozens of grants studying why people are hesitant to get vaccines and how to encourage community uptake of such measures.

“It is the policy of NIH not to prioritize research activities that focuses gaining scientific knowledge on why individuals are hesitant to be vaccinated and/or explore ways to improve vaccine interest and commitment,” according to a statement by the institutes on the change to over 40 grantees, according to an internal email obtained by The Washington Post."

 

[Chris_Halkides]

NPR reported, "Kennedy said on Jan. 29 of the committee: "I think 97% of the people on it had conflicts...The [2009] review, contrary to Kennedy's characterization, it did not find serious conflicts among most members." RFK is using claimed conflicts of interest, presumably to replace members of committees with people more conducive to Kennedy's...far from the mainstream..views.