What did Democrats do wrong?

[Tero]

From Quora:
"All those jobs in textiles and appliance manufacturing (typical Walmart consumer goods) that went offshore did matter, but they’re gone and not likely to return. My last job was managing a big manufacturing operation that included the company’s primary warehouse/distribution center that also stocked products from a “sister” plant in China. Their transfer pricing wouldn’t even cover my U.S. plant’s materials costs, much less labor, overhead, and profits. And their regulatory costs vs. ours were virtually non-existent."

https://www.quora.com/What-percentage-of-goods-sold-in-America-are-manufactured-domestically-Why-is-there-a-push-to-buy-American-even-though-it-may-be-difficult-to-do-so

He blames regulation

 

[Thermal]

He blames regulation

He's wrong.

 

[dirtywick]

how so?

 

[The Don]

how so?

It's much more complicated than just blaming regulation IMO.

I mean if all workers and environmental protections were removed then manufacturing costs may come down marginally but that doesn't mean that they'll be competitive.

 

[dirtywick]

It's much more complicated than just blaming regulation IMO.

I mean if all workers and environmental protections were removed then manufacturing costs may come down marginally but that doesn't mean that they'll be competitive.

i agree it is much more complicated that blaming regulation, and to be fair there were many things listed in the quora post described and regulation was one of them. american manufacturers have multiple hurdles when it comes to competitve pricing of products, amongst which is increased regulatory costs.

 

[The Don]

i agree it is much more complicated that blaming regulation, and to be fair there were many things listed in the quora post described and regulation was one of them. american manufacturers have multiple hurdles when it comes to competitve pricing of products, amongst which is increased regulatory costs.

In any case even if the manufacturing capacity were retained in the US, the majority of the jobs would still have gone to automation so blaming the lack of US manufacturing jobs on regulation isn't inaccurate and simply opens the door to exploitation of workers and destruction of the natural environment by corporations who would have continued to manufacture in the US but see a chance to make even more money.

Regulations are demonised but the vast majority of them are there for a good reason. "Health and Safety" is used in the UK as a shorthand for government regulation stifling industry but workers are entitled to a safe working environment and you don't have to look far back in history (or a long way overseas) to see the effects of the alternative.

The ideal of course would be for the workers in the developing world to enjoy the same protections as those in the majority of the Western world. One way to ensure that it to ban products which aren't manufactured to the same exacting standards, something that the EU has sought to do. Other nations can scream protectionism but if they raise their standards then they can flourish.

The alternative is that proposed for, and partially adopted by, post-Brexit Britain, a race to the bottom where standards and regulations are reduced to the lowest global denominator. Not a good idea IMO because you don't want to be in the business of only competing on price.

 

[dirtywick]

just to add to what you said, higher productivity through automation is the only way to stay competitive against companies that have lower overhead.

regardless i’m not blaming regulation or making a judgement on whether or not they’re good or bad. its recognizing that in order to competitively manufacture in the west one of several hurdles you have to jump to be competitive is higher costs due to regulation.

in any case i agree that the race to the bottom is the worse course of action. we seem to be doing it anyway, particularly in raw materials and quality already.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

No.
The way to be and stay competitive is to specialize. The biggest mistake of the US economy is the focus on a few, giant players that offer a generic product for everyone, in the hope that economies of scale will make up for extra overhead and the need to constantly advertise.
But that will always leave you vulnerable to price undercutting from countries with lower labor and production costs.

If you stay much smaller, target your customer base much narrower, and are open for custom jobs, price stops being the key consideration: if you can only get what you really one from one place, that's where you buy.

Big is not actually better, as the "National Champions" spend more resources on lobbying than on R&D. And they all have a bloated middle management that saps competitiveness and soaks up any savings from size. Their only actual advantage is market capture, allowing them to sell inferior products for inflated prices.

If we started penalizing (instead of incentivising) advertisement, consumers would find it much easier to find what they actually need instead of being told what they are supposed to buy. And if we busted companies with too large market shares, prices would drop dramatically.

 

[Tero]

Getting back to the election (and aside from their globalism that democrats support), how exaclty was the party going to talk to this coalition of idiots and racists to make them listen? None of what Trump promised was going to happen. The tariffs will not bring the Asian jobs back.

 

[Thermal]

He was never serious about tariffs. It's right out of his "Art of the Deal" days- start negotiations from some lunatic point and when you inevitably meet kinda halfway, you're really ending up tilted heavily in your favor.

 

[dirtywick]

it’s hard to tell what he is and isn’t serious about though. which, perhaps is the lesson to the dems. just say whatever and none of it matters.

but they don’t really get to pull that off, do they?

 

[Tero]

It's a small price to pay to stop the penniless migrants from bringing fentanyl to your teens to "experiment" with.

 

[ahhell]

Trump has largely turned politics on its ear, to the point where it's hard to chastise Judis and Texiera (who were not misunderstood--they really foresaw another Democratic majority like the Donks had from 1932-1980). Keep in mind that although the Democrats did not win the 2004 election, they did very well in 2006 and 2008, and held onto the presidency in 2012. I've been reading Texiera's substack for quite a while and while I don't always agree with him, I am impressed by the amount of data he presents to back up his arguments. The chart where he shows that Kamala's coalition most resembles Bob Dole's blew my mind (not least because I was a part of both).

I've heard interviews of either Judis or Texiera, not sure which, in which he claims he was misunderstood or maybe folks took the premise and thought, well we don't have to worry about the minority vote so lets work on educated white folk. And in doing so they lost the white working class and seem to be losing the minority working class.

 

[Tero]

Howard Park

2.0 out of 5 stars Sick of Carter Bashing, old barely revised arguments​

The authors always blame the Democratic Party woes on "the base." The other party whispers sweet nothings to the "base" and offers unconditional love, even for the worst of the worst. They seem to think that Dems just need to forget about "womens lib", black lives matter, gays, trade in our foreign cars and bring back George Meany to run our unions. This book is base bashing without offering any alternative but time travel.

review of Where Have All the Democrats Gone?: The Soul of the Party in the Age of Extremes at Amazon

 

[Tero]

 

[Donal]

When you bury your child to own the libs

 

[Tero]

We failed but they failed too. They failed to pick up a book past the age of 18. This one was Tim, age 30-40.

Tero Gervais (@tero55gervais) on Threads

I usually win the science argument against nonbelievers. Vaccines or any biology or climate change. But we will honor Tim with his classic statement.

www.threads.net

 

[Emily's Cat]

New Balance's Made in USA running shoes and other apparel:

https://www.newbalance.com/made-in-the-usa/

Bully got you covered:

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Several well-established brands to choose from:

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WALK-BEHIND LAWN MOWERS MADE IN THE USA! Find & compare American made push mowers & self-propelled lawnmowers in our USA made brand directory.

madeintheusamatters.com

Yet they already are:

Introducing the Liberty Phone – Purism

Purism makes premium phones, laptops, mini PCs and servers running free software on PureOS. Purism products respect people's privacy and freedom while protecting their security.

puri.sm

Had you put a second's thought into finding out if you knew what you were talking about?

There are a lot of things made in the US... but they're extremely hard to find if you only shop on Amazon and Temu. You might actually have to go to a brick-and-mortar store or *gasp* pay shipping!

 

[Emily's Cat]

Their market share is low because people don't give a ◊◊◊◊ if the products they buy are making American jobs. People like you, who declare they don't exist, when they for damn sure do. You think Craftsman, Husquvarna, and Troy-Built are rare brands of mowers? It's simply a value call.

I had to buy a new pair of work boots recently. With the magic of this thing called the internet, I was able to identify models made domestically in seconds, and chose from them. Settled on a pair of Keens, made in Oregon, $90. American manufacturers succeed when people like me give a ◊◊◊◊. Go buy your Chinese products while crying that a google search is too much effort.

ETA: you say it's"impossible" to have American manufacturing for goods. Still feeling confident? Cuz I got a whole lot of Made in USA, from my boots to my sunglasses that says you're full of ◊◊◊◊.

Whenever possible, I will buy products made in the US. Sometimes I will expand my criteria to ABC.

 

[Thermal]

There are a lot of things made in the US... but they're extremely hard to find if you only shop on Amazon and Temu. You might actually have to go to a brick-and-mortar store or *gasp* pay shipping!

The beauty of the internet is that your horizons are expanded beyond the Zon and Temu. I found it more difficult in the 90s when I had to physically drive from store to store, even though more domestic made products were actually available. You still had to.physically hunt them down, and watch for the best deal.

I can quite literally do what used to be days of shopping on my phone while sipping morning coffee. While it is an effort now, it's far less than it used to be.