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Merged Justin Trudeau resigns

Canadians are too nice to go MAGA.
Do you recall the Alberta and Ottawa Trucker Protests? At one point one of the organizers was complaining the government was trampling on her "First Amendment rights." Except Canada doesn't have a "First Amendment."

Sadly, we have our share of crazies here, too.

 
Do you recall the Alberta and Ottawa Trucker Protests? At one point one of the organizers was complaining the government was trampling on her "First Amendment rights." Except Canada doesn't have a "First Amendment."

Sadly, we have our share of crazies here, too.

We have ours here down under too. E.g. Plenty of gun-crazies banging on about their Second Amendment gun rights... :sneaky:
 
Do you recall the Alberta and Ottawa Trucker Protests? At one point one of the organizers was complaining the government was trampling on her "First Amendment rights." Except Canada doesn't have a "First Amendment."

Sadly, we have our share of crazies here, too.

Well, technically while we do not have a "first amendment", we do have similar freedoms as part of our constitution. Its possible that the U.S. constitution is known well-enough that "first amendment" has become a catch-phrase for any sort of speech/assembly freedoms. (Sort of like 'klenex' is a sort of default term for any sort of tissue paper.)

Not that the Truckers weren't morons. They definitely were idiots, scum bags, and a blight on our country.

Frankly, I think we should have called in the military to take care of them. No, not ground troops. Send in an air strike. Wellington street has a nice open section... would have made a great target area.
 
Justin Trudeau is stepping down as his party's leader. The leader of the Conservative Party, Pierre Poilievre, said,"'Canadians can take back control of their lives and their country,'
He doesn't. He has spent years watching Trump and thinks those kinds of sound bite lies are the key to getting elected. A Trump mini-me in the making.
To be fair, such empty promises are typical with both the conservatives and the liberals. (Remember Chretien's promise to scrap the GST, or Trudeau's promise to "never" buy the F35.)

Not that I want Polievre to be prime minister. I have voted conservative in the past, but I think Poilievre relies too much on "populist" rhetoric. (For me, the breaking point is when he supported the Trucker convoy. That should have been something ALL the major parties condemned, But several conservatives, including to a degree Poilievre, supported them, or at least thought they were worth "talking to". A party which is going to support that nonsense is not one I can cast my ballot for.)
 
Great point. We saw the same with Stephen Harper, who then went on to win a majority government. In fact, here one can get a majority on as little as 38% of the popular vote: both the Liberals and Conservatives have done that in my lifetime. So Poilievre could become Prime Minister with a majority in the House despite 62% of Canadians voting against him.
In fact, if I remember correctly, there have only been 2 elections in over a century where a party has managed to obtain a majority of the popular vote, both conservative victories (Diefenbaker and Mulroney).

Even the Liberals, at the height of Trudeaumania in the 1960s, only got around 45% of the vote.
It's a major downside of our first-past-the-post system, which Justin Trudeau replaced. Oh, wait ...
Yeah, that was dumb.

The Liberals probably wanted to implement a ranked-choice ballot, which (given their status as the main 'centrist' party) would give them an advantage in future elections (almost a guaranteed win).

But they held some hearings and found that some form of proportional representation (which would probably harm the Liberals in the long run) was the most popular alternative to first-past-the-post.

So, they decided to just drop the issue.

See: https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-electoral-reform-biggest-regret-1.7426407
 
I actually expect the next election to produce a conservative minority government, who will not be able to enact most of their more drastic policies due to lack of support from other parties. This may actually be the first time I will be glad that the Bloc exists.
I am expecting a majority conservative government. (Not that I WANT that... I just expect that.)

Currently, the conservatives sit at 44% in the polls. The Liberals are at 21%. Usually parties can get a majority in parliament with ~40% of the popular vote.

Now, a new leader will probably help the Liberals, but I think they are too far behind in the polls, and the Liberals have been in power too long, for a new leader to make up enough ground to prevent a conservative majority.

We could be looking at another Trudeau-Turner-Mulroney dynamic.... unpopular leader gets replaced, and then the party gets decimated.
 
I can almost guarantee there will be a non confidence vote and the government will be brought down triggering an election. Both the Cons and the NDP hope to make gains while the Liberals are in disarray.
Won't happen. Trudeau has prorogued parliament until March, meaning all parliamentary business has stopped, so there is no way to bring in a non-confidence vote.

(I have no problem with them doing that. They are simply using the rules of parliamentary procedure that have been part of our system for decades. But I do recognize the hypocrisy of people who ignore it when the Liberals do it but condemned Harper when he used the same tactic.)

See: https://globalnews.ca/news/10944498/parliament-prorogued-justin-trudeau-resigns/
 
Won't happen. Trudeau has prorogued parliament until March, meaning all parliamentary business has stopped, so there is no way to bring in a non-confidence vote.

(I have no problem with them doing that. They are simply using the rules of parliamentary procedure that have been part of our system for decades. But I do recognize the hypocrisy of people who ignore it when the Liberals do it but condemned Harper when he used the same tactic.)

See: https://globalnews.ca/news/10944498/parliament-prorogued-justin-trudeau-resigns/

Yes the prorogation has bought some time. I have no problem with it either, nor did I when Harper did it except for the fact that the first time he prorogued parliament it was to evade an emerging scandal.

There will be an election this year regardless and our national embarrassment will begin.
 
Yes the prorogation has bought some time. I have no problem with it either, nor did I when Harper did it except for the fact that the first time he prorogued parliament it was to evade an emerging scandal.
Yeah, I remember the time Harper prorogued parliament to prevent release of a report into AdScam. No, wait, that was Chretien.

But then there was the time Harper prorogued parliament to limit the damage due to the WE Charity scandal. No, wait, that was Trudeau.

Actually, if memory serves me correctly, the first time Harper Prorogued parliament was to prevent a non-confidence vote early in the 2007/2008 recession. (Not exactly a scandal...) He prorogued it a second time around the Vancouver olympic games (although the opposition claims it was due to investigations into our actions in Afghanistan. But I don't really think that would have caused much political impact.)

Again, my main complaint here is the hypocrisy. Harper prorogues parliament to prevent the fall of a minority government, and its heralded by many as the end of democracy. Liberals prorogue parliament to limit political fallout over various scandals, and its a giant collective yawn.
There will be an election this year regardless and our national embarrassment will begin.
You see, here is my problem....

I want to stress that I do not like Pierre Poilievre. I do not want him anywhere near the Prime Minister's office.

But, when it comes to the conservatives, those on the center-left/left side of the political spectrum tend to make wild accusations. Rather than making rational arguments against policies that the conservatives had, they attack them over things that they have no intention of doing. I remember when Harper was elected, there were plenty of people who claimed "Oh my god! Its the end of Abortion rights / gay marriage", despite the fact that Harper had never campaigned on those issues, and it would actually be detrimental for the conservatives to do so.

There are valid reasons to criticize Poilievre. I just hope people keep the attacks to things he does (or actually plans to do), rather than just making baseless attacks.
 
Yeah, I remember the time Harper prorogued parliament to prevent release of a report into AdScam. No, wait, that was Chretien.

But then there was the time Harper prorogued parliament to limit the damage due to the WE Charity scandal. No, wait, that was Trudeau.

Actually, if memory serves me correctly, the first time Harper Prorogued parliament was to prevent a non-confidence vote early in the 2007/2008 recession. (Not exactly a scandal...) He prorogued it a second time around the Vancouver olympic games (although the opposition claims it was due to investigations into our actions in Afghanistan. But I don't really think that would have caused much political impact.)

Again, my main complaint here is the hypocrisy. Harper prorogues parliament to prevent the fall of a minority government, and its heralded by many as the end of democracy. Liberals prorogue parliament to limit political fallout over various scandals, and its a giant collective yawn.

You see, here is my problem....

I want to stress that I do not like Pierre Poilievre. I do not want him anywhere near the Prime Minister's office.

But, when it comes to the conservatives, those on the center-left/left side of the political spectrum tend to make wild accusations. Rather than making rational arguments against policies that the conservatives had, they attack them over things that they have no intention of doing. I remember when Harper was elected, there were plenty of people who claimed "Oh my god! Its the end of Abortion rights / gay marriage", despite the fact that Harper had never campaigned on those issues, and it would actually be detrimental for the conservatives to do so.

There are valid reasons to criticize Poilievre. I just hope people keep the attacks to things he does (or actually plans to do), rather than just making baseless attacks.

Maybe my memory is faulty but as I recall the first time Harper prorogued parliament it was to avoid the emerging scandal where his government had ignored intelligence that Canadian forces had been complicit in the torture of Afghan detainees.

With all due respect, I haven't heard anyone claim that a Poilievre government will be the end of abortion rights or same sex marriage. Maybe there are some extreme voices saying these things but they are hardly part of the mainstream centre-left coalition. The criticisms I hear, and I share are that he is a chronic liar (true), seems to have no policy positions beyond 3 word slogans (very true) and his flirtations with the freedumb convoy and the various extremist groups associated with it, like diagolon, is extremely troubling. Like Trump, he is a pure opportunist who comes across as a truly unintelligent human being who will sell out Canadian interests if its in his own personal interest. It will be nothing short of a national embarrassment to have him representing us.

Don't get me wrong, Trudeau is far past his best before date and his administration ran out of ideas long ago. But the idea of voting for a Poilievre-led CPC makes my stomach turn. I long for the days of a functional PC party that served as a real counterweight to the Liberals instead of this reactionary, populist bunch of nitwits the CPC has become.
 
Maybe my memory is faulty but as I recall the first time Harper prorogued parliament it was to avoid the emerging scandal where his government had ignored intelligence that Canadian forces had been complicit in the torture of Afghan detainees.
Your memory is faulty (but, since some of this happened a decade ago, its understandable.)

Harper's first prorogue was in 2008, over the attempts by a coalition of the Liberals, NDP and Bloc to force a non-confidence vote.

The second was in 2009/2010. I already dealt with this one.... As I pointed out, the opposition claims it was to defuse a scandal over actions in Afghanistan, but it was also during the Winter Olympics in Vancouver (which was the excuse that was used).. So, could the opposition have been right and it was all about the Afghanistan issue? I am skeptical about that, since I doubt a scandal about a war half way around the world that both the Liberals and Conservatives supported would have had much of an impact (especially at the early stages of the investigation.)

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prorogation_in_Canada

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Afghan_detainee_issue

With all due respect, I haven't heard anyone claim that a Poilievre government will be the end of abortion rights or same sex marriage.
I never claimed people were saying that about Poilievre. I said they were attacking Harper over the issue, as an example of how people sometimes base their attacks on straw men rather than issues of policy/actions.
The criticisms I hear, and I share are that he is a chronic liar (true), seems to have no policy positions beyond 3 word slogans (very true)
You see, neither of these should be a major issue. All politicians lie (or did you really believe chretien would "scrap the GST"? Or that Trudeau was being honest about "never buying the F35"?)

As for his use of "3 word slogans"... if you do some searching, you can find plenty of policy positions on the conservative web site. That a politician would want to condense things into simple, easy-to-remember slogans makes some political sense.

Those type of criticisms are the ones that make me cringe.
and his flirtations with the freedumb convoy and the various extremist groups associated with it, like diagolon, is extremely troubling.
Now you see, THIS is an actual criticism, and one that I agree with. The freedumb convoy protesters were scum and should have been treated with distain. And the fact that Poilievre had any sort of association with them is indeed a problem. (And for me, its a deal-breaker... once reason I will never vote for him.)

I can point to other criticisms too... his interest in crypto currency, his anti-environmental policies (all of which I oppose).

These are real criticisms, based on stuff that he has actually done and/or plans to do. Much more relevant than allegations than "I don't like him using campaign slogans".
Like Trump, he is a pure opportunist who comes across as a truly unintelligent human being...
Is Poilievre "unintelligent"? He did get a university degree, although he did a portion of it on line. Not sure how good his grades were.

Of course, when Trudeau started his political career many people considered him a pretty intellectual light-weight. (What, the Liberals have picked a guy who is a drama teacher and is more interested in snow-boarding?)
 
Well the polls certainly have gotten interesting. It seems a combination of Trudeau's resignation, Mark Carney injecting some enthusiasm into the LPC and Trump's attacks on Canada have combined to make this a closer race than anyone thought possible.

From a 25 point lead down to 10 points in about 7 weeks. We could witness one of the greatest political comebacks of all time if this continues.

I wonder if lil PP is regretting his choices to parrot Trump and the maga movement over the past year.

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Liberals are drawing strength from both the conservatives and the NDP. Bit of a shame in the latter case as I thought Singh seemed pretty good.
 
Well the polls certainly have gotten interesting. It seems a combination of Trudeau's resignation, Mark Carney injecting some enthusiasm into the LPC and Trump's attacks on Canada have combined to make this a closer race than anyone thought possible.
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Liberals are drawing strength from both the conservatives and the NDP. Bit of a shame in the latter case as I thought Singh seemed pretty good.
It really is an impressive shift. (Although personally I am worried that despite the Liberal's rebound, it might not be enough to overtake the conservatives.)

It will be interesting to see how the dropping of support for the NDP impacts the election. (It might unfortunately result in some 3-way races becoming 2-way races that benefit the conservatives.)
 
Liberals are drawing strength from both the conservatives and the NDP. Bit of a shame in the latter case as I thought Singh seemed pretty good.
Agreed. There is a lot of strategic choice going on here. I think there is a sizable cohort of the electorate that would be fine with the NDP or LPC and will switch to whomever has the best chance of beating the cons.

It remains to be seen if this shift in support will last or if it just a temporary bubble. As much as I don't want PP to be our next PM, I would feel a whole lot less bad about it if its a minority situation.
 
Looks like the Liberal Party in Canada has picked a new leader, and Canada will soon have a new Prime Minister.

All hail Mark Carney.

(I like the selection... strong financial background, and seems to have the popularity to take on the conservatives.)

For anyone that doesn't know how the Canadian political system works, a prime minister does not serve for a fixed term, but if a sitting prime minister resigns, then whomever wins the party's leader becomes the new prime minister automatically.

 
Looks like between the replacement of Trudeau by Carney and Trump's attacks on Canada, the Conservative's lead in the polls has more or less vanished.

From: https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/art...-liberals-as-concern-about-trump-rises-nanos/
As Canadians’ concerns about U.S. President Donald Trump rise, Pierre Poilievre’s Conservative polling advantage appears to have evaporated, with the Liberals now just one point behind according to the latest Nanos numbers. In new weekly tracking released Tuesday, the Conservatives are at 36 per cent support, the Liberals – now under the leadership of Mark Carney – have risen to 35 per cent support, and the NDP are at 15 per cent.

I expect an election will be called fairly quickly.
 

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