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Trump 2.0 won't be as bad as they say

Ziggurat said:
Oh, Trump absolutely ****** that up.

First and foremost among those fuckups, he trusted Fauci.
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Thanks for proving my point.

Ziggurat said:
Right about what? Was he right when he said that the public shouldn't wear masks because they aren't effective for the general public? Or was he right when he said that everyone should wear masks?

Then there are the deliberate lies, like his attempts to cover up the lab leak hypothesis, which he knew was possible but pretended wasn't because he was partly to blame for it.

Or how about school shutdowns? He wasn't right about that, and that seriously hurt children with little if any health benefit.
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Thanks for really proving my point.
 
Ziggurat said:
Right about what? Was he right when he said that the public shouldn't wear masks because they aren't effective for the general public? Or was he right when he said that everyone should wear masks?

Then there are the deliberate lies, like his attempts to cover up the lab leak hypothesis, which he knew was possible but pretended wasn't because he was partly to blame for it.

Or how about school shutdowns? He wasn't right about that, and that seriously hurt children with little if any health benefit.
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You naively think that Fauci worked in isolation. In reality Fauci had a team of experts working with new information of a novel disease and trying to make sense of it. The information he was providing to the public was the best effort of that team of experts as new information came to them for analysis, and some early analysis was of course incorrect. As they refined their recommendations, and their recommended precautions were adopted by a larger number of sensible folks, COVID became less and less of a danger to the public at large. Thinking that any of his announcements and recommendations were based solely on his own personal thoughts is right-wing stupid in the extreme.
 
seayakin said:
He has criticized the current administration but if I understood everything he said, there is a marked difference in the level of competence and capability of Trump vs Biden. He specifically mentions how horribly Trump managed people, how he could not get any of his agenda passed when Congress was controlled by Republicans. He cited his only real success was in appointing judges. He also meantioned that if you measure the success of a president by their ability to get their agenda implemented Biden is far more successful.
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I wouldn't take the word of the Freakonomics crowd as being worth much. They had one bad idea which was lucky enough to meet the zeitgeist at the right time.

For example the above, Poesner omits the small detail that the repugs don't want to govern. They don't care that their policies don't get enacted, so much so that they no longer have policy. They just want to destroy government, the idea of government even, to bring back society's rules to the capitalist free for all of the Gilded Age.
 
thaiboxerken said:
If Trump wins, it's game over for the USA democracy experiment. Trump will pass away, which is JD Vance's hope. JD Vance will be the POTUS and he will wield the power of MAGA and the government in more dangerous way that Trump could. It will be apartheid.
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If T****y dies, it all falls apart. And Vance doesn't have the power base or the personal charisma to end up on top; he's more of a Rudolf Hess or Alfred Rosenburg figure, a man appointed to high office because he's no threat to those around him. The bunfighting between the Goebels, Görings, Eichmanns and Boormans that are T****y's other lackeys after he cacks it will be nasty, brutish and short.
 
3point14 said:
Six major media companies. Failing public education system. Outdated and not fit for purpose electoral system.
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And their associated 24 hours news channels struggling to fill the airtime. Wasn't it something like half a billion worth of free airtime trump got through them?
 
Steve said:
You naively think that Fauci worked in isolation. In reality Fauci had a team of experts working with new information of a novel disease and trying to make sense of it. The information he was providing to the public was the best effort of that team of experts as new information came to them for analysis, and some early analysis was of course incorrect. As they refined their recommendations, and their recommended precautions were adopted by a larger number of sensible folks, COVID became less and less of a danger to the public at large. Thinking that any of his announcements and recommendations were based solely on his own personal thoughts is right-wing stupid in the extreme.
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Yep. The whole focus on Fauci is misleading.
 
thaiboxerken said:
It is strange. The base hates government, so they are voting for an authoritarian.....
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They prefer the mob over city hall, because they think the mob is going to be their ally against the immigrant street gangs.
The idea of having a Big Brother who'll defend you from the "bullies" has some appeal, except big brothers will just as soon beat up on you.
 
Apathia said:
They prefer the mob over city hall, because they think the mob is going to be their ally against the immigrant street gangs.
The idea of having a Big Brother who'll defend you from the "bullies" has some appeal, except big brothers will just as soon beat up on you.
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Fascism is like the lottery. There are a lot more people who think they are going to come out ahead than will actually come out ahead...
 
Random said:
Fascism is like the lottery. There are a lot more people who think they are going to come out ahead than will actually come out ahead...
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Ya rolls your dices, and takes your chances.
But the dices are loaded.
Snake Eyes!
 
Ziggurat said:
Right about what? Was he right when he said that the public shouldn't wear masks because they aren't effective for the general public? Or was he right when he said that everyone should wear masks?

Then there are the deliberate lies, like his attempts to cover up the lab leak hypothesis, which he knew was possible but pretended wasn't because he was partly to blame for it.

Or how about school shutdowns? He wasn't right about that, and that seriously hurt children with little if any health benefit.
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So it's not really Trump's fault because you blame Fauci, but you blame Biden for the Afghanistan withdrawal and not the military command. Yep, you're judgment is to be trusted...
 
Disbelief said:
So it's not really Trump's fault because you blame Fauci, but you blame Biden for the Afghanistan withdrawal and not the military command. Yep, you're judgment is to be trusted...
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TM nailed it:

TragicMonkey said:
They always have to find an individual to blame. No matter how complex and widespread a problem is, it always boils down to finding a single person whose fault it is.
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Understanding the complexities of decision making at a high government or military level is confusing for some. They have to find a simple scapegoat.
 
Steve said:
You naively think that Fauci worked in isolation. In reality Fauci had a team of experts working with new information of a novel disease and trying to make sense of it. The information he was providing to the public was the best effort of that team of experts as new information came to them for analysis, and some early analysis was of course incorrect. As they refined their recommendations, and their recommended precautions were adopted by a larger number of sensible folks, COVID became less and less of a danger to the public at large. Thinking that any of his announcements and recommendations were based solely on his own personal thoughts is right-wing stupid in the extreme.
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TragicMonkey said:
They always have to find an individual to blame. No matter how complex and widespread a problem is, it always boils down to finding a single person whose fault it is.
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I agree with both of you.
 
Ziggurat said:
He ****** up the withdrawl. There's no ifs, ands, or buts. Maybe there was no way to do it perfectly, but we didn't just not do it perfectly, we did it badly. Really, really badly. We were not prepared. There were a TON of issues where we were just caught completely flat-footed, and we shouldn't have been.

That's not Trump's fault.
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Trump took a dump in Afghanistan and then complained about the guy who cleaned up his crap didn't do a good enough job.

You're right about one thing, maybe there wasn't a way to do it perfectly. You can say Biden did a bad job cleaning up Trump's messy diapers. But maybe, the reality is that Biden handled the situation better than anyone possibly could have. Maybe, if Trump hadn't prevented a smooth transition, the Biden administration would have been better equipped.to deal with it.

Now I'm not a military expert. Are you? I have no idea how well it was handled. But I sure as hell know that neither you or Trump are either.
 
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It's easy to sit back, complain about and criticize how Biden handled the withdrawal. What I'd like to know is how Zig thinks it could have been handled it better.
 
Steve said:
You naively think that Fauci worked in isolation. In reality Fauci had a team of experts working with new information of a novel disease and trying to make sense of it. The information he was providing to the public was the best effort of that team of experts as new information came to them for analysis, and some early analysis was of course incorrect.
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Bull ****. Much of what they were recommending wasn't based on any information at all, it was pulled out of their ass. The 6 feet separation thing? That didn't come from any study, that was just an ass pull.

But it's worse than that. The changing mask recommendation wasn't an ass pull, it was a lie. I understand why they lied, they didn't want a run on masks at the start when masks were in short supply, but it was still a lie.

But it's even worse than that, because some of the lies weren't even motivated by any greater good. The attempts to bury the lab leak hypothesis weren't based on the best information available at the time. Fauci knew that the suppression was a lie. He did it to cover his own ass.

Thinking that any of his announcements and recommendations were based solely on his own personal thoughts is right-wing stupid in the extreme.
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Oh, he's not the only villain in this story, sure. But then, neither is Trump, no matter how much you want him to be.
 
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