Split Thread Musk, SpaceX and future of Tesla

[theprestige]

The more I think about it, the more I think that Teslas are not any worse than other car brands, in terms of overall quality or performance or ethics. Not especially so, anyway.

Rather, it seems Tesla's worst sin is a casual approach to deviating from the established idioms for car user experiences and user interfaces. Nothing wrong with having door handles work a little unconventionally. Nothing wrong with moving the blinker controls to an unconventional location.

There are even other cars that do this kind of thing. But they tend to be ridiculously expensive luxury cars, not high-end commodity models. I think it's a silly thing to do, design wise. But I'm a luddite who hates change. I ignore half the features in my new car, simply because I don't want to have to figure out the unique idiom for cruise control and hands-free phone calls. I do like the on-wheel volume and chapter buttons though.

Anyway, yeah. Shame on Elon Musk for messing with the long-established UI/UX conventions for automobile controls. What an unethical monster he is! What a total scam he's perpetrating on the entire world! Literally the second most evil person in all of human history.

I know what you're thinking: "Right, because Donald Trump is the most evil person in all of human history. But what about Hitler? Isn't he the second most evil person in all of human history?"

And that's because you're forgetting all the other Trumps, and Dick Cheney. When you really think about it, Adolf Hitler is probably in the bottom half of your top ten list of evil people throughout history. Probably number seven or eight, depending on where you rank Vladimir Putin.

 

[novaphile]

Cars with weird controls have been a thing, since forever.

My personal favourite was a Citroen station wagon, which had the indicators as a rocker switch in the centre of the dashboard.

Click left to turn left, click right to turn right, click left-right-left-right-left-right-left-right to find the centre position to turn the stupid things off.

All of this, with one hand off the steering wheel, because you can't reach the control with your hand on the steering wheel.

After/during sixteen years of driving my Opel Corsa (sold in Australia as a Holden Barina) I would frequently hit windscreen wipers instead of indicators and vice-versa.

European cars have the controls on the opposite side to Australia.

Similarly issues with emergency brakes on foot pedals, or having a pedal to release the emergency brake (which is put on with a lever, or a handle that is pulled out of the dashboard.)

My first cars had the high beam/low beam switch on the floor, imagine my joy when driving a rental car, at night, to discover that I'd just put the emergency brakes on while looking for the 'dip switch' with my left foot. (In that car it was a foot pedal to put the brakes on, and a lever under the dashboard to release it).

I'm grateful that we still have a steering wheel and an accelerator pedal, as some kind of standard.

(Although, I have seen some cars with a stupid pair of handles instead of a wheel, I hope that doesn't catch on.)

 

[theprestige]

The farther back you go, the less consistent the UI/UX. The convergence of transmission controllers on the center console is relatively recent.

So shame on Tesla for casually eschewing convention.

Shame, but not special pleading outrage.

 

[Silly Green Monkey]

Slightly off topic,

Adventures with Purpose

Accidentally driving your car into a lake and not getting out has been a thing for a while now. The latest one had been there since 1985. I don't think we can pin this one on Tesla, though I'm sure some will try!

That latest one was also a suicide, so doesn't really relate. Kiely Rodni would be more of a better example.

 

[Roger Ramjets]

My first cars had the high beam/low beam switch on the floor,

Brings back some bad memories. My first car was a green and white Ford Cortina with bench seats and column gear-change. I loved it - until I got my next car, a dark green 1st generation Ford Laser 3 door hatchback (AKA Mazda 323). Then I realized what a turd the Cortina was.

Unfortunately the Laser rusted out and was condemned, so I went without a car for a few months. Then I got a 5 speed manual Nissan Sentra S, and realized what a turd the Laser was. It had about 230,000 km on the clock when things started to go wrong, and I decided now was the time to think about getting the car I wanted but couldn't afford in 2011 - a Nissan Leaf. When I got that car I realized what turds all the previous ones were. Electric windows! No more dangerously leaning over to wind the passenger side window up or down while driving!

I'll take the convenience of pushbutton operation over the minuscule chance of accidentally driving into a lake and drowning any day.

 

[a_unique_person]

The farther back you go, the less consistent the UI/UX. The convergence of transmission controllers on the center console is relatively recent.

So shame on Tesla for casually eschewing convention.

Shame, but not special pleading outrage.

I think the progression was because those locations worked best for most people. The dip switch on the floor was bad. Lights on the stalk were good. Blinker on the stalk, obvious. The actual inventor of the Tesla did a great job. The first commercially successful battery car. The things that have since been done to it seem to be Elon's brain farts.

 

[Gulliver Foyle]

I’ve always been a fan of the “Efficient Market Hypothesis”. In short, a stock price is always where it “should be”. Whether it was “overpriced” or “undervalued” only makes sense retroactively. Not perfect, given folks trading on inside information, or other market manipulation. But a good first order assumption nonetheless.

TSLA @ 163.57 is exactly where the market thinks it should be - “invisible hand” and all that. If it drops to 50, we’ll look back and say it was still overpriced even @ 163.57. If it soars over the next year to 500, folks will be sorry for having missed a buying opportunity.

Only time will tell…

Problem with EMH is that it has no basis in reality. It's a classical case of economists wanting to work to a certain goal and looking for "evidence" to support that goal.

The simple facts that a) people are irrational and b) you cannot ensure that everybody has perfect information all the time (two basic tenets of EMH) simply blow the hypothesis assertion out of the water.

 

[lobosrul5]

Problem with EMH is that it has no basis in reality. It's a classical case of economists wanting to work to a certain goal and looking for "evidence" to support that goal.

The simple facts that a) people are irrational and b) you cannot ensure that everybody has perfect information all the time (two basic tenets of EMH) simply blow the hypothesis assertion out of the water.

EMH takes into account that people are irrational. The publicly traded price of TSLA at any given moment in time matches its EMH price perfectly. That's essentially a tautology: the price the public values TSLA is the price it trades it at.

The price that an insider values TSLA may vary. Corporate officers may know the next quarterly statement figures ahead of time and pass that on to a friend*. That guy may sell shares or buy more. The instant he's done doing so, we're back at the EMH price.

*working for a corporation in accounting I can promise you, know one knows until just a few days before its publicly released. Though some people might have a very good guess.

 

[Fast Eddie B]

I think folks tend to conflate "efficient" with "rational".

From tulips to the South Sea Bubble to daily machinations of stock prices, all can fall victim to the "madness of crowds", "Fear Of Missing Out", and a wide spectrum of psychological compunctions. Decidedly NOT rational, but in the end, efficient. And, importantly, unpredictable.

Seems like this may have been missed…

 

[theprestige]

Seems like the distinguishing characteristic of an efficient market is that it does not allow for arbitrage. The stock market seems like a good candidate, since there arbitrage is called insider trading and strictly prohibited.

 

[lobosrul5]

Seems like the distinguishing characteristic of an efficient market is that it does not allow for arbitrage. The stock market seems like a good candidate, since there arbitrage is called insider trading and strictly prohibited.

There are arbitrage etfs and mutual funds out there. MNA for example. Viewing its past performance however, supports your point.

 

[Roger Ramjets]

I think the progression was because those locations worked best for most people. The dip switch on the floor was bad. Lights on the stalk were good. Blinker on the stalk, obvious.

But is it? Around here there are a lot of small roundabouts, and few drivers uses their indicators correctly. A common 'mistake' is operating the indicator stalk while turning the wheel in one motion - which saves having to take your hand off the wheel but is useless because by that time it's too late. Other drivers end up having to wait until you start the turn in case you are actually going straight ahead. Most drivers here don't indicate when leaving the roundabout either, with a similar result.

The actual inventor of the Tesla did a great job. The first commercially successful battery car. The things that have since been done to it seem to be Elon's brain farts.

Huh?

History of Tesla, Inc.

Tesla was incorporated (as Tesla Motors) on July 1, 2003, by Martin Eberhard and Marc Tarpenning in San Carlos, California. The founders were influenced to start the company after General Motors recalled all its EV1 electric cars in 2003 and then destroyed them, and seeing the higher fuel efficiency of battery-electric cars as an opportunity to break the usual correlation between high performance and low fuel economy in automobiles...

Ian Wright was the third employee, joining a few months later. The three went looking for venture capital (VC) funding in January 2004 and connected with Elon Musk, who contributed US$6.5 million of the initial (Series A) US$7.5 million round of investment in February 2004 and became chairman of the board of directors. Musk then appointed Eberhard as the CEO. J.B. Straubel joined in May 2004 as the fifth employee...

Musk took an active role within the company and oversaw Roadster product design, but was not deeply involved in day-to-day business operations. Musk insisted from the beginning on a carbon-fiber-reinforced polymer body and contributed to the car style. Tesla Motors received the Global Green 2006 product design award for the design of the Tesla Roadster, presented by Mikhail Gorbachev. Elon Musk, Martin Eberhard, Barney Hatt, Tesla Motors also received the 2007 Index Design award for their design of the Tesla Roadster.

Musk was involved in the design of the Roadster from the beginning. Funny that Global Green gave Tesla an award for their design - I guess they liked 'brain farts'!

 

[Darat]

Copied from the Musk buys Twitter thread:

Elon defended his use of ketamine, saying it helps him alleviate a "negative chemical mind state" that benefits investors in Tesla.

Musk made the comments in his interview with Don Lemon

Oh that's bad, members of any boards of public companies Musk sits on now have a fiduciary duty to insist he is treated for his illegal drug abuse.

ETA: There you go, going off half-cocked again - he is apparently prescribed it: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...vestors-best-interests?embedded-checkout=true

 

[a_unique_person]

Copied from the Musk buys Twitter thread:



Oh that's bad, members of any boards of public companies Musk sits on now have a fiduciary duty to insist he is treated for his illegal drug abuse.

ETA: There you go, going off half-cocked again - he is apparently prescribed it: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...vestors-best-interests?embedded-checkout=true

Michael Jackson was prescribed propofol. There's always a doctor around who will prescribe anything you want for enough money.

The increasingly erratic behaviour of Musk and his disheveled appearance indicate someone who's doing the usual addict denial of being an addict.

 

[Solitaire]

Cybertruck & Tesla Roadster Video

I was excited to see the latest Thunderfoot video, but alas, nothing new.
Just disproves a bunch of Elon Musk's claims.



Guy shoots up the Cybertruck disproves the bulletproof claim.
Nuclear explosion proof glass, survives baseball, but nothing harder.
Full self driving has disappeared despite a $20,000 charge for it.

"Warning: Smart summon may not stop for all objects (especially very low objects
such as some curbs, or very high objects such as a shelf) and may not react to all
traffic. Smart Summon does not recognize the direction of traffic, does not navigate
around empty parking spaces, and may not anticipate crossing traffic."

Sixteen minutes in Phil says the Tesla and SpaceX collaboration means the end
for the Tesla Roadster.

Elon Musk on Twitter/X: "Tonight we radically increased the design goals for the new
Tesla Roadster. There will never be another car like this, if you could even call it a car."

It looks like theprestige was right. In the 21 minute to 24 minute segment, Musk
cannot resist making libelous statements about rescue driver Vern Unsworth, as
if the diver's rescues were an affront to Musk. Bizarre.

Didn't get anything about the latest SpaceX launch, which is what I really wanted to see.

 

[Fast Eddie B]

Here’s a post I recently made to Facebook:

“ It’s kinda sad after waiting with bated breath since 2019, but now that the time has come, we’ve decided to pass on a new CyberTruck. The base price is so much higher than predicted, and the “Foundation” models - the only ones shipping now - are $20k on top of that. The limited range when towing, and lack of pull-through Supercharger stalls make it impractical as a travel trailer tow vehicle, and we recently bought a lightly used 2022 Toyota Tundra for roughly 1/3 the cost of the CyberTruck to serve that function. Maybe someday, but right now it just doesn’t make sense for us.”

 

[Roger Ramjets]

Nuclear explosion proof glass, survives baseball, but nothing harder.

When did Musk say the Cybertruck's glass was 'nuclear explosion proof'?

Breaking Cybertruck’s Armor Glass (So You Don’t Have To)

 

[GlennB]

When did Musk say the Cybertruck's glass was 'nuclear explosion proof'?

Breaking Cybertruck’s Armor Glass (So You Don’t Have To)

ffs please , if you post a 9 minute video can you tell us where the glass gets broken? You know, might get a few views? Hmmm?

 

[dirtywick]

if it's a video of that time he threw that brick at the window and it broke, that was hilarious

 

[Gulliver Foyle]

I was excited to see the latest Thunderfoot video, but alas, nothing new.
Just disproves a bunch of Elon Musk's claims.



Guy shoots up the Cybertruck disproves the bulletproof claim.
Nuclear explosion proof glass, survives baseball, but nothing harder.
Full self driving has disappeared despite a $20,000 charge for it.

"Warning: Smart summon may not stop for all objects (especially very low objects
such as some curbs, or very high objects such as a shelf) and may not react to all
traffic. Smart Summon does not recognize the direction of traffic, does not navigate
around empty parking spaces, and may not anticipate crossing traffic."

Sixteen minutes in Phil says the Tesla and SpaceX collaboration means the end
for the Tesla Roadster.

Elon Musk on Twitter/X: "Tonight we radically increased the design goals for the new
Tesla Roadster. There will never be another car like this, if you could even call it a car."

It looks like theprestige was right. In the 21 minute to 24 minute segment, Musk
cannot resist making libelous statements about rescue driver Vern Unsworth, as
if the diver's rescues were an affront to Musk. Bizarre.

Didn't get anything about the latest SpaceX launch, which is what I really wanted to see.

The way that "baseball" bounced after being weakly tossed at the window suggests itt was made out of foam.