• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

Any Conspiracy-Busters here?

... It's pretty windy in here.

Seems like the woo have left the area.

bump.

Yeah thats what happened...or they got tired of your circular rhetoric... you can't find any physical evidence to prove the official story thus validating your point, and you can't admit that the official story is lacking the ability to disprove conspiracy thus prolonging these types of debates...among other things...

you all claim to have debunked the points, but then can't explain how the three collapse explanantions can be mutually contradictory, not mention the Eutectic Reaction that occured apparently with added sulphur..something that reaks of explosives...

In short you have taken to this like a debate on a game show, where you utilize argumentative tactics in place of facts to make your case, this is ridiculous when trying to sort out in a rational way fact from fiction...

so unless you have something really intelligent to add(which I doubt)......
 
Yeah thats what happened...or they got tired of your circular rhetoric... you can't find any physical evidence to prove the official story thus validating your point, and you can't admit that the official story is lacking the ability to disprove conspiracy thus prolonging these types of debates...among other things...
No.

you all claim to have debunked the points, but then can't explain how the three collapse explanantions can be mutually contradictory, not mention the Eutectic Reaction that occured apparently with added sulphur..something that reaks of explosives...
Uh... You think they used black powder to blow up the WTC?


In short you have taken to this like a debate on a game show, where you utilize argumentative tactics in place of facts to make your case, this is ridiculous when trying to sort out in a rational way fact from fiction...
No.

We asked you for evidence.

You don't have any.

so unless you have something really intelligent to add(which I doubt)......
You'll go away and never return?
 
Belz... said:
Seems like the woo have left the area.
Yeah thats what happened...

So you admit you're a woo ?

or they got tired of your circular rhetoric... you can't find any physical evidence to prove the official story thus validating your point, and you can't admit that the official story is lacking the ability to disprove conspiracy thus prolonging these types of debates...among other things...

If you cared to accept the explanation of experts in these matters and decided to follow evidence instead of sensationalism, you'd be a skeptic, too.

you all claim to have debunked the points, but then can't explain how the three collapse explanantions can be mutually contradictory, not mention the Eutectic Reaction that occured apparently with added sulphur..something that reaks of explosives...

There is only one explanation, there is no such reation involved, and nothing reeks except people who don't listen to reason.

In short you have taken to this like a debate on a game show, where you utilize argumentative tactics in place of facts to make your case, this is ridiculous when trying to sort out in a rational way fact from fiction...

You don't WANT fact, Syntax. You want your version of the story to stick, the facts be DAMNED. You're not looking for the truth.
 
Most of you egotistical know-nothings will never bother to put in the time necessary to uncover the truth of 911 - you'll simply sit at your typewriters and fire off your vapid responses, hoping to impress your equally clueless comrades.

I wrote a couple of articles in SkepticReport about this topic a while back. One of the things that struck me then, and continues to mystify me now, is the insistence on the part of the CT's that it is the responsibility of others, not they, to uncover the "truth", despite the fact that they are the only ones who seem to care about it. Their job, as they see it, is to sew a few seeds of doubt here and there, and wait for it to blossom, through the toil of others, into the Accepted Truth.

The 9/11 attacks were indeed the result of a conspiracy. They were the culmination of a intricate strategy on the part of Muslim extremists to destroy America (or whatever the "reasoning" was behind it) by trying to wreck the economy, draw it into an unwinnable war, terrify the civilian populace, etc. In carrying out their plan, they raised terrorism to a new level, using tactics that had been unthinkable before. From a historical perspective, this is really, really heavy stuff. But it's not enough for the CT's. The REAL conspiracy is not good enough. There has to be SOME OTHER conspiracy, more unbelievable and with more disturbing implications.

I have no doubt that, were all their claims accepted as the official explanation, they would begin to say that THIS was the cover story, that the REAL truth was even more shocking and far-reaching than this. And if this new pile of baloney was accepted, they would come up with ANOTHER set of implausible "inconsistencies", and so on, and so on.

Very tiresome.
 
The 9/11 attacks were indeed the result of a conspiracy. They were the culmination of a intricate strategy on the part of Muslim extremists to destroy America (or whatever the "reasoning" was behind it) by trying to wreck the economy, draw it into an unwinnable war, terrify the civilian populace, etc. In carrying out their plan, they raised terrorism to a new level, using tactics that had been unthinkable before. From a historical perspective, this is really, really heavy stuff. But it's not enough for the CT's. The REAL conspiracy is not good enough. There has to be SOME OTHER conspiracy, more unbelievable and with more disturbing implications.


Sure...this did happen, on part of the extremists. But what is the legitimate ammo of the CT that keeps this a float? Perhaps the many documented connections between these people and the people in the american government that are the focus of the CT in the first place.

I had previously supplied links to articles detailing the depth of these connections, and they were written off because "no news story is accurate" in the eyes of the skeptics in this thread.

Then there are other matters, like the mutual inconsistancy of the official accounts ala FEMA, NIST, and the Commision. Upon close reading it should become apparent that they aren't in congruence. In summary, they basically admit that there is virtually no way this could have happened, but that it happened anyway by some means that are indeterminable.

Then there is the eutectic reaction, which as yet has been unexplained by both NIST and FEMA. You all write it off as well...even though it is a heat based reaction that requires temps around 1600-1700F degrees(some thing that the official accounts say didn't happen) The only way this could have occured is from a massive fire(one much larger, with much more volatile combustibles) or explosives...

As well there is building 7 with its nearly uniform collapse, and inconsistent explanation(it was not structurally weakened by planes)...and it also contained eutectic residue(buildings 1,2,7 all did).

The investigation was shoddy, and skeptics can't admit this, there is no evidence that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt the official story effectively...in fact other than a handfull of recordings made by bin Laden, the multitude of ignored warnings, and a passport that disappeared there really is nothing to support the claims of the government in regard to the Al-Qaeda plot except blind faith..

So how is a recording made in the hills of the Afghan tribal region and then leaked to the press more reliable than a news story that has been researched or based on actual documents?


anyways...
I think what this debate really truly boils down to is this:

Do you think there is enough physical evidence to prove the official story? If so, what is it?

Do you think that there are too many flaws in the investigation, and the findings to believe in total the official account? If so, why?


Personally, I have no doubt that Al-Qaeda and bin Laden are responsible for the planning and highjacking of planes....but you can't tell me the governments excuses as to why they didn't know in advance aren't bunk, and you can't tell me that they don't have ties to this because they do...the american government practically created extremist islam to combat the Soviet Union. Not to mention the years of meddling in the middle east that only served to harm us even more in the end...and all for private interests.
 
Last edited:
headache.gif

Ugh... here we go again.
 
anyways...
I think what this debate really truly boils down to is this:
Do you have any evidence to back up any of your claims??

Personally, I have no doubt that Al-Qaeda and bin Laden are responsible for the planning and highjacking of planes....but you can't tell me the governments excuses as to why they didn't know in advance aren't bunk
Sure I can. They aren't bunk.
 
Sure...this did happen, on part of the extremists. But what is the legitimate ammo of the CT that keeps this a float?

You seem to hold this naive belief that it is possible for CT's to actually be made to go away.

This is simply not true. History shows that CT's just make stuff up wholecloth if they want evidence.
 
Do you think there is enough physical evidence to prove the official story? If so, what is it?
"Proof" is an impossibly high standard for investigations. You have to be content with weighing the evidence and using reason and logic to come to the most reasonable conclusion. And in this case, the standard model is by far the most reasonable conclusion. Other explanations, involving the government help or even acquiescence are 1) not plausible, and 2) have zero evidence for them.

Do you think that there are too many flaws in the investigation, and the findings to believe in total the official account? If so, why?
"In total"? I'm sure there must be typos here and there, but by and large the evidence clearly points to the standard model. If you have any credible evidence that casts doubt on it, we'd like to see it, but so far you haven't come up with any piece that's credible, only long lists of lots of not credible stuff. That doesn't cut it.
 
Sure...this did happen, on part of the extremists. But what is the legitimate ammo of the CT that keeps this a float? Perhaps the many documented connections between these people and the people in the american government that are the focus of the CT in the first place.

I had previously supplied links to articles detailing the depth of these connections, and they were written off because "no news story is accurate" in the eyes of the skeptics in this thread.

Then there are other matters, like the mutual inconsistancy of the official accounts ala FEMA, NIST, and the Commision. Upon close reading it should become apparent that they aren't in congruence. In summary, they basically admit that there is virtually no way this could have happened, but that it happened anyway by some means that are indeterminable.

Then there is the eutectic reaction, which as yet has been unexplained by both NIST and FEMA. You all write it off as well...even though it is a heat based reaction that requires temps around 1600-1700F degrees(some thing that the official accounts say didn't happen) The only way this could have occured is from a massive fire(one much larger, with much more volatile combustibles) or explosives...

As well there is building 7 with its nearly uniform collapse, and inconsistent explanation(it was not structurally weakened by planes)...and it also contained eutectic residue(buildings 1,2,7 all did).

The investigation was shoddy, and skeptics can't admit this, there is no evidence that proves beyond a shadow of a doubt the official story effectively...in fact other than a handfull of recordings made by bin Laden, the multitude of ignored warnings, and a passport that disappeared there really is nothing to support the claims of the government in regard to the Al-Qaeda plot except blind faith..

So how is a recording made in the hills of the Afghan tribal region and then leaked to the press more reliable than a news story that has been researched or based on actual documents?


anyways...
I think what this debate really truly boils down to is this:

Do you think there is enough physical evidence to prove the official story? If so, what is it?

Do you think that there are too many flaws in the investigation, and the findings to believe in total the official account? If so, why?


Personally, I have no doubt that Al-Qaeda and bin Laden are responsible for the planning and highjacking of planes....but you can't tell me the governments excuses as to why they didn't know in advance aren't bunk, and you can't tell me that they don't have ties to this because they do...the american government practically created extremist islam to combat the Soviet Union. Not to mention the years of meddling in the middle east that only served to harm us even more in the end...and all for private interests.

:words:
 
Sure they did. Those damn Huns also created Christianity to cripple the Roman Empire from the inside.

No. I created both just to give thesyntaxera something to get upset about. While he's making these long posts, I'm stealing his nacho chips.
 
I hate to get sucked into this thread (the regular posters seem to be doing a fine job debunking), but I have a question for thesyntaxera.

As far as I can tell, thesyntaxera has taken a position that he doesn't necessarily believe that there is a conspiracy, but that there are too many holes in the popular version of the events that unfolded on 9/11. Although, to my understanding he will not commit to a particular conspiracy theory (such as remote-controlled planes), he seems to fall back on the theory that the attack was carried out by terrorists, but that the government had advanced knowledge of the attacks and wired the intended targets for demolition.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

My question to thesyntaxera is this: Why was WTC7 destroyed?
 
Well, that's one of the most inept, idiotic, and blinded views of history made in the past few weeks.

Well, he's got one finger on a correct idea. Al Qaeda and the Taliban did get the power they did in Afghanistan partially thanks to support from the USA.

They were called "mujihadeen" in the western press and considered heroic freedom fighters at the time, if you recall. Later when they were the bad guys they were referred to as the Taliban and Al Qaeda and were oppressors or terrorists, but they were the same people.

It doesn't follow from this that Al Qaeda were ever controlled by the CIA or anybody else, of course, but that won't stop the woowoos.
 
Well, he's got one finger on a correct idea. Al Qaeda and the Taliban did get the power they did in Afghanistan partially thanks to support from the USA.

They were called "mujihadeen" in the western press and considered heroic freedom fighters at the time, if you recall. Later when they were the bad guys they were referred to as the Taliban and Al Qaeda and were oppressors or terrorists, but they were the same people.

It doesn't follow from this that Al Qaeda were ever controlled by the CIA or anybody else, of course, but that won't stop the woowoos.

Iran predates the mujihadeen by several years. I would not call that revolution a moderate Islamic revolution.
 
They were called "mujihadeen" in the western press and considered heroic freedom fighters at the time, if you recall. Later when they were the bad guys they were referred to as the Taliban and Al Qaeda and were oppressors or terrorists, but they were the same people.
They were one of the factions. Many of the Afghan groups being funded by the CIA to fight the Soviets were also opposed to the Taliban and Al Qaeda.
 

Back
Top Bottom