General Israel/Palestine discussion thread - Part 4

[Cosmic Yak]

You clearly haven't been paying attention.

https://thehill.com/opinion/interna...ttack-in-gaza-this-isnt-war-this-is-genocide/

https://www.timesofisrael.com/hamas...onstitute-genocide-international-law-experts/

That I missed the opinion of some American guy in a cinema is not me 'not paying attention '.
The Times of Israel article talks of possible genocide, not actual genocide. Again, the opinion of one newspaper, that does not support your claim, is not hugely present on my radar.
Hyperbole does nothing to advance the discussion, nor to solving problems on the ground.

 

[Cosmic Yak]

By the congenital pathological liar and psychopathic war criminal Netanyahu... right here...


Repeated lies about facts and denial of reality does not change the fact that Israel has in the past and continues to be a genocidal war criminal state of apartheid and ethnic cleansing and racism and settler colonialism... right from the onset and even before its creation by Zionists.

Stop lying, Leumas.

 

[Cosmic Yak]

The cartoon below is from a previous occasion... one out of NUMEROUS GENOCIDES Israel has committed LONG BEFORE there was a Hamas as an excuse that would only dupe ones who do not know facts of reality or of the reality of history... or even the rules of decency or humanity

I missed this one.
Which previous genocides, Leumas?
I assume you don't mean anything mentioned in the Bible, as you don't believe the Bible.
Please list the documented instances of multiple genocides by Israel, Zionists or the Jews, using accepted historical sources.
Or stop hijacking this thread.

 

[bobdroege7]

I would just like to remind some people that the two state solution was rejected.

Not by Israel.

 

[Planigale]

I would just like to remind some people that the two state solution was rejected.

Not by Israel.

I'd like to remind you Hamas has said that it would accept a two state solution as did the PLO, but Likud and the current Israeli PM are clear they will not.

So, yes by Israel.

(Please see multiple postings quoting Likud policy and Hamas statement of principles 2017 to evidence the actual facts.)

 

[Ziggurat]

I'd like to remind you Hamas has said that it would accept a two state solution as did the PLO

Except both of them also demand a right of return, which makes it not really a two state solution at all. And they also know Israel will never agree to it, so they can, so they can say those words to please western audiences, but they don't really believe them, and they know it'll never happen as long as they keep demanding that right of return. They have been offered two-state solutions before and turned it down over the right of return.

 

[bobdroege7]

I'd like to remind you Hamas has said that it would accept a two state solution as did the PLO, but Likud and the current Israeli PM are clear they will not.

So, yes by Israel.

(Please see multiple postings quoting Likud policy and Hamas statement of principles 2017 to evidence the actual facts.)

That was before Hamas was in power, when Arafat walked away from a two state solution.

You don't get a right of return when you lose a war.

 

[Nessie]

The BBC directly questions claims by the IDF of the use by Hamas of a hospital as a command post with underground command and control system.

https://twitter.com/ToryFibs/status/1725554439849734479

 

[Leumas]

That was before Hamas was in power, when Arafat walked away from a two state solution.

You don't get a right of return when you lose a war.

In which manual of war criminals did you read this?

Or which manual of Colonial Settlement or Imperialism or Plundering and Pillaging or INHUMANITY?

So a war criminal gets to start war and when he wins he decides that the people he ETHNICALLY CLEANSED have no human rights?

Out of what Manual of Immorality and Ethnic Cleansing did you get that from... ah... wait wait.... I now the answer to that...

The manual for all immorality and evil and nastiness and cruelty and turpitude and irrationality and insanity... as commanded by the most hideous sordid sadistic DEMON called YHWH given to his Stockholm Syndrome addled in the soul and mind adorers

 

[Planigale]

Except both of them also demand a right of return, which makes it not really a two state solution at all. And they also know Israel will never agree to it, so they can, so they can say those words to please western audiences, but they don't really believe them, and they know it'll never happen as long as they keep demanding that right of return. They have been offered two-state solutions before and turned it down over the right of return.

Still Likud now refuses to accept a two state solution, and has a right of return. Negotiations are all about the details, the right of return may be more flexible in fact than in theory; you can use it as an excuse not to negotiate but that is not the same as saying asking for a right of return is the same as refusing to discuss a two state solution. Israel under Likud refuse to consider a two state solution even with no right of return.

 

[Planigale]

Except both of them also demand a right of return, which makes it not really a two state solution at all. And they also know Israel will never agree to it, so they can, so they can say those words to please western audiences, but they don't really believe them, and they know it'll never happen as long as they keep demanding that right of return. They have been offered two-state solutions before and turned it down over the right of return.

But Likud will not accept a two stae solution regardless of the right to return, they want a state of Israel from the to the river. They are commited to settlement and annexation of the WestBank. The current Israeli government under Likud (and remember Likud is not the most extreme party in the coalition) will not accept a two state solution FULL STOP.

 

[Leumas]

I would just like to remind some people that the two state solution was rejected.

Not by Israel.

Disseminating and propagating PROPAGANDA "alternative facts".... is not reminding anyone of anything... it is lying to everyone with the hope of them not knowing or caring about knowing or even having the wherewithal to know any history and REAL FACTS... and thus will gullibly and ignorantly and readily imbibe the the fabricated lies about the facts.

 

[Planigale]

That was before Hamas was in power, when Arafat walked away from a two state solution.

You don't get a right of return when you lose a war.

You are introducing the right of return as a red herring?

Previously the question was who refuses to accept a two state solution. Now it apeears you accept that it is Israel that will not accept a two state solution and seek to justify why Israel will not accept a two state solution. To be clear the reason why is because Likud (and other parties) want Israel to extend from the Sea to the River and in this scenario there is no place for a West Bank palestinian state.

 

[Leumas]

I missed this one.
Which previous genocides, Leumas?
I assume you don't mean anything mentioned in the Bible, as you don't believe the Bible.

European Zionists and Zionism has nothing to do with the damned Bible other than distorting its fairy tales and lying about its sordid content in order to hoodwink imbeciles who also know nothing about its fables into giving the benighted nod to their Settler Colonialist crimes against humanity.

Please list the documented instances of multiple genocides by Israel, Zionists or the Jews, using accepted historical sources.

Already done... but you will never read it... because if you ever do... you might feel some compunction to

Stop lying

[imgw=300]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/e/e3/Pappe_-_The_Ethnic_Cleancing_of_Palestine.jpg/220px-Pappe_-_The_Ethnic_Cleancing_of_Palestine.jpg[/imgw]​

 

[bobdroege7]

Disseminating and propagating PROPAGANDA "alternative facts".... is not reminding anyone of anything... it is lying to everyone with the hope of them not knowing or caring about knowing or even having the wherewithal to know any history and REAL FACTS... and thus will gullibly and ignorantly and readily imbibe the the fabricated lies about the facts.

I have watched this play out for more than 50 years after my family took a vacation away from any news and came back and found that there had been a war started and finished while we were away.

It is not propaganda nor alternative facts to claim that a two state solution was approved by Israel and the PLO, but then Arafat walked away.

Camp David.

 

[bobdroege7]

You are introducing the right of return as a red herring?

Previously the question was who refuses to accept a two state solution. Now it apeears you accept that it is Israel that will not accept a two state solution and seek to justify why Israel will not accept a two state solution. To be clear the reason why is because Likud (and other parties) want Israel to extend from the Sea to the River and in this scenario there is no place for a West Bank palestinian state.

I didn't introduce it.

Doesn't Hamas have something in their charter about the river to the sea?

Israel is obviously not going to accept that, but that's not a two state solution.

 

[bobdroege7]

In which manual of war criminals did you read this?

Or which manual of Colonial Settlement or Imperialism or Plundering and Pillaging or INHUMANITY?

The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

Of course.

 

[Leumas]

...
It is not propaganda nor alternative facts to claim that a two state solution was approved by Israel and the PLO, but then Arafat walked away.

Yes it is... it depends on what propaganda outlet was giving you the alternative facts you believed...

Camp David.

And yet Begin and Arafat the CAREER TERRORIST criminals shared Nobel PEACE prizes (with others) for shaking hands in their old age after a long and bloody career of terrorizing and killing and tyrannizing.... and getting rewards for their crimes.

I have watched this play out for more than 50 years after my family took a vacation away from any news and came back and found that there had been a war started and finished while we were away.

What does that war of 1973 have to do with the HUMAN RIGHTS of refugees to return to their homes and farms from which they were ETHNICALLY CLEANSED in 1948 and 1965 and continually ever since up to now in 2023???

[imgw=300]https://cdnph.upi.com/svc/sv/upi/1381697235128/2023/1/1b5fad3708cdc2983804d2066781fca1/On-This-Day-Rabin-Peres-Arafat-share-Nobel-Peace-Prize.jpg[/imgw]​

 

[Leumas]

The Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

Of course.

Well... see I told you it all depends on which propaganda outlet you imbibed your alternative facts from.

You need to stop reading fabricated LIES (e.g. the Bible and the above equal trash) and start reading REAL HISTORY instead of the "alternative facts" you believed.

 

[Leumas]

Doesn't Hamas have something in their charter about the river to the sea?

They plagiarized that expression from the manifesto fairy tales of Zionism which clearly contradict the fables of the the Bible...

[imgw=200]https://farkash-gallery.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/D705-056-Copy.jpg[/imgw]​

Israel is obviously not going to accept that...

Yes of course not... because it goes against THEIR OWN Settler Colonialist aspirations.